The Eternal Covenant of God: Does it exist within Hinduism and Buddhism?

[Dawnofhope]

The difference is that the Nirguna Brahman will not send any authorized advertisers, promoters or commission agents.

The concept of a formless God within a non dualist paradigm does have parallels with a Baha’i view of God:

To every discerning and illuminated heart it is evident that God, the unknowable Essence, the Divine Being, is immensely exalted beyond every human attribute, such as corporeal existence, ascent and descent, egress and regress. Far be it from His glory that human tongue should adequately recount His praise, or that human heart comprehend His fathomless mystery. He is, and hath ever been, veiled in the ancient eternity of His Essence, and will remain in His Reality everlastingly hidden from the sight of men. “No vision taketh in Him, but He taketh in all vision; He is the Subtile, the All-Perceiving.”…

Bahá'í Reference Library - Gleanings From the Writings of Bahá’u’lláh, Pages 46-49

Does He not manifest Himself from time to time to push back the darkness and to bring righteousness?

Whenever there is a decline in righteousness and an increase in unrighteousness, O Arjun, at that time I manifest myself on earth.
BG 4:7

I have not read Jai's reply to your query. As for me and as you very well know, I do not believe in existence of Gods or Goddesses. To me, they are imagination, falsehood.

I know your views on this very well.

You remind me of a movement within Christianity where some theologians lean towards atheism seeing God in their scriptures as a mere symbol. Nonetheless the sacred writings of their fellow Christians are very important to them as the Gita is important to you.

Krishna gives the clue in the very next verse.

"abhyāsena tu, Kaunteya, vairāgyeṇa ca gṛihyate." (BG 6:35)
abhyāsena - by practice; tu - but; kaunteya - O son of Kuntī; vairāgyeṇa - by detachment; ca - also; gṛihyate - can be controlled.
".. but, O Son of Kunti, by practice and by detachment also, it can be controlled."

Note that It does not require the grace of any God or Goddess.

Chapter 9 is all about devotion.

Only do not try to jump across the fence.

I’ll keep to my side of the fence if you keep to yours! It’s good to know where the boundaries lie between us.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Mara?

"Stuck in the middle of you", by Steelers Wheel.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Except we have a rational soul. We can make a choice and are not bound by nature.
One can choose to be a pack animal, or worse. Or we can choose love and service to all people.

I reject that too. Even animals make their choices, to run or stand to give fight. We are all bound by nature. Do not humans belong to Kingdom Animalia? Even animals have empathy. You can find videos showing chimps trying to free a leopard from a trap in Youtube or dogs guarding children against harm. That is what nature is like.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Does He not manifest Himself from time to time to push back the darkness and to bring righteousness?
.. as the Gita is important to you.
Chapter 9 is all about devotion.
I’ll keep to my side of the fence if you keep to yours! It’s good to know where the boundaries lie between us.

That is a Vaishnava belief and not a belief in 'Advaita' Hinduism.
The non-theist/secular ideas in Gita are important to me not the theist ones.
If it is, it is not a problem for me., because that is not my way.
The boundary is where God, soul, creation, birth, death, heaven, hell, salvation, deliverance, judgment, angels, prophets, sons, messengers, manifestations, mahdis arise. None of them exist in my side of the fence.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

If your religion works for you and brings you closer to Hinduism then they are two positives on your spiritual path.

Being closer to Hinduism isn't a goal of my spirituality. That doesn't make any sense. I was just pointing out that the Abrahamic religions and Dharmic religions have nothing to do with each other as they developed separately from different cultures, so calling them "sisters" is very strange.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

We can make a choice and are not bound by nature.

All things are bound by nature. It's hubristic insanity to believe otherwise.

Humans are just the best at tool use and creating complex societies due to our opposable thumbs and more complex brains, but there's almost nothing humans do that other animals don't. Whales are observed to have culture and language, for example.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

The Eternal Covenant of God is an enormously important part of the Abrahamic Faiths whether it be Judaism, Christianity, Islam or the Baha’i Faith. At its heart is a binding agreement between God and man. God asks man to recognise His Great Spiritual Teachers and follow Their Teachings. In return God promises to protect and care for man and to bless Him. Various Covenants are recorded in the Hebrew Scriptures through Noah, Abraham, Moses and David. Similar narratives are at work through Christ, Muhammad, the Bab and Bahá’u’lláh. Conceptually the Covenants are well established and progress through each Revelation.

However, Hinduism and Buddhism have developed parallel and usually seperate from their Abrahamic sister Faiths. Their narrative evolved over thousands of years is quite different. Yet Buddhism emerged from Hinduism as did Christianity from Judaism and the Baha’i Faith from Islam. Societal laws and those for spiritual development have successfully been put into practice and evolved over centuries or even Millenia. So in that sense there are clear parallels.

How about the Eternal Covenant of God that is so well established in the Abrahamic Faiths? Are there parallels in Buddhism and Hinduism? Perhaps the traditions based on the Dharmic Faiths have diverged so far from Abrahamic Faiths the concept of an Eternal Covenant is rendered meaningless. Is the Eternal Covenant of God uniquely Abrahamic or is it more Universal and applicable to both Hinduism and Buddhism?

Comments or questions as you will.

I wish there was a "confused" icon on this. Ha.

In the Dharma there isn't a "chosen people." There are many lineages and schools that have their own understanding and practice of Dharma but not to where there is a line of chosen. If anything, each person is to his own understanding of Dharma. There are, of course, holidays where people come together and worship for lack of better words.

For example, in christianity there is a consensus that they came from the jews; the jewish teachings. In The Dharma there is no "one bloodline" in practice. You have people in Japan [of course] that differ from India [if it's still practiced there, I don't know], which is different from, I don't know Vietnam. Jews and christians try to stay together in their given "covenant." I remember you saying Bahai rules are only applicable to Bahai just as Jews. Christian are a bit funny on this, though.

I think the only thing The Buddha kept in the Dharma he taught from Hinduism was the cultural part, like the existence of gods and goddesses and all of that. As for the practice he rightfully said god [hindu] does not lead one to enlightenment. It's a barrier. It's not atheistic, as one thinks; it's polytheistic. It's just not focus on the "one god" scenario. Which is different than covenants where one god sends his people to do X and share Y among people who wish to share their faith.

Shrugs. Anyone can find anything in common with anything. Synchronization is getting popular these days especially with the younger religions that reject the traditions of the church or religion in general.

I guess what they do have in common is the result of their individual practices. They all tend to promote compassion. Most tend to say people are in their own spiritual path without comparison to one's own. Maybe a few in between actually share some history given the geography and christian colonization and unfortunate influence.

It depends on how you want to see it. The Dharma isn't a covenant where "things have to be X way to follow The Buddha [as if following god]." So,....

 

[Vinayaka]

That is a Vaishnava belief and not a belief in 'Advaita' Hinduism.
The non-theist/secular ideas in Gita are important to me not the theist ones.

Nor in Saivism. Gosh sometimes I wish we were presented as several different religions rather than the umbrella term. This way we're all constantly clarifying.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Or we may not have been just discussing but cutting each others throats. A big umbrella is a nice thing. Many can take shelter beneath it.
Just think, if the Abrahamic religions had a big umbrella, how peaceful the world would have been?

 

[TransmutingSoul]

All things are bound by nature. It's hubristic insanity to believe otherwise.

@Aupmanyav

Yet we traverse the sky's and explore space, switch on power and light the dark, we override many of the laws of nature.

Thus we are a product of our own mind. The mind can be worldly and bound to it, or it can be heavenly and free of this world. A world where the body dies and our soul/mind lives on.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I reject that too. Even animals make their choices, to run or stand to give fight. We are all bound by nature. Do not humans belong to Kingdom Animalia? Even animals have empathy. You can find videos showing chimps trying to free a leopard from a trap in Youtube or dogs guarding children against harm. That is what nature is like.

A question mark, but I know it is not really a question

There are many answers, in many religions on this subject, that will show us why we can be more than an animal and I see that is part of the eternal covenant.

Regards Tony

 

[TransmutingSoul]

If there is creation (which I reject), it is not set up for anything.

Then you are saying there is no Dharma and that Karma is also not part of any system and that reincarnation has no goal, no purpose.

Regards Tony

 

[crossfire]

Then you are saying there is no Dharma and that Karma is also not part of any system and that reincarnation has no goal, no purpose.

Regards Tony

Holding such views create a thicket of views that obstruct realization and transcendence.
Aggi-Vacchagotta Sutta: To Vacchagotta on Fire

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

@Aupmanyav

Yet we traverse the sky's and explore space, switch on power and light the dark, we override many of the laws of nature.

Thus we are a product of our own mind. The mind can be worldly and bound to it, or it can be heavenly and free of this world. A world where the body dies and our soul/mind lives on.

Regards Tony

Bs. We have overridden none of the laws of nature. We just use the brain that evolution gave us, no more. We're still apes wired to live as tribal hunter-gatherers in the African plains.

 

[Aupmanyav]

.. we override many of the laws of nature. .. A world where the body dies and our soul/mind lives on.

We really cannot. When nature strikes, there is no recourse. .. That happens only in the imagination of a theist.

Then you are saying there is no Dharma and that Karma is also not part of any system and that reincarnation has no goal, no purpose.

You seem to be getting it now. Yes, 'dharma' 'karma' belong to this imaginary world, 'maya'. In reality, there is no world, no 'dharma', no 'karma'; no reincarnation as well, just play of energy fields. No purpose, because existence and non-existence are just phases of nature, like the 'virtual particles'.

 

[Dawnofhope]

That is a Vaishnava belief and not a belief in 'Advaita' Hinduism.
The non-theist/secular ideas in Gita are important to me not the theist ones.
If it is, it is not a problem for me., because that is not my way.
The boundary is where God, soul, creation, birth, death, heaven, hell, salvation, deliverance, judgment, angels, prophets, sons, messengers, manifestations, mahdis arise. None of them exist in my side of the fence.

Advaita Hinduism appears well aligned to atheism but not Vaishnava belief, not the Gita.

Your boundary is different from my boundary. I draw the line in regards to who is or isn't willing to be respectful of others, be courteous and reasonable. Adherence to a religious path or not is of no use if one's humanity is lacking.

 

[Dawnofhope]

Being closer to Hinduism isn't a goal of my spirituality. That doesn't make any sense. I was just pointing out that the Abrahamic religions and Dharmic religions have nothing to do with each other as they developed separately from different cultures, so calling them "sisters" is very strange.

Hinduism, Buddhism, Christianity and Islam are all religions. They all provide moral guidance, wisdom and inspiration. Each one has established itself globally and perform similar roles in their respective communities. All have interacted and profoundly influenced each other. The word Hinduism arose in part to distinguish it from Islam and then Christianity. The Indian subcontinent has been colonised by Abrahamic Faiths for much of the past 1,200 years, first by Islam, then by Christianity. 20% of India's population is either Muslim or Christian. If we included Pakistan which used to be part of India the figures would be much higher. The Sikh religion arose in no small measure because of the influence and apparent contradictions between Islam and Hinduism.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Your boundary is different from my boundary. I draw the line in regards to who is or isn't willing to be respectful of others, be courteous and reasonable. Adherence to a religious path or not is of no use if one's humanity is lacking.

When did I say that I have any problem with different views. We have many in Hinduism. I have difference of views even in my own family. I am an atheist, they are theists. Where did I loose my humanity?

The word Hinduism arose in part to distinguish it from Islam and then Christianity.

The name Hinduism is much older than that. It is first mentioned in Avesta., Hapta-Hendu (Sapta-Saindhavah, land of seven rivers), denoting the beliefs and people living in the Indus valley and to the East of it. Avesta mentions it as the 15th and the penultimate homeland of Aryans. That must have been around 2,000 BC when Aryans started coming in to India from Central Asia. The Abrahamic religions came up millenniums later. No denying what happened in history, we are OK with it and our billion.

 

[Dawnofhope]

When did I say that I have any problem with different views. We have many in Hinduism. I have difference of views even in my own family. I am an atheist, they are theists. Where did I loose my humanity?

To be clear I never said you have lost your humanity and have I never thought it. That's why I don't see you or most people here as 'on the other side of the fence'

The name Hinduism is much older than that. It is first mentioned in Avesta., Hapta-Hendu (Sapta-Saindhavah, land of seven rivers), denoting the beliefs and people living in the Indus valley and to the East of it. Avesta mentions it as the 15th and the penultimate homeland of Aryans. That must have been around 2,000 BC when Aryans started coming in to India from Central Asia. The Abrahamic religions came up millenniums later. No denying what happened in history, we are OK with it and our billion.

Thank you for your understanding of the origin of the word Hindu which all sounds reasonable. I had understood the word Hindu became more widely used to distinguish the religions of the peoples of the Indian subcontinent from those of the colonial powers?

Hindus - Wikipedia

 

[Vinayaka]

To be clear I never said you have lost your humanity and have I never thought it. That's why I don't see you or most people here as 'on the other side of the fence'



Thank you for your understanding of the origin of the word Hindu which all sounds reasonable. I had understood the word Hindu became more widely used to distinguish the religions of the peoples of the Indian subcontinent from those of the colonial powers?

Hindus - Wikipedia

There are several theories on the origin of the term 'Hindu' besides the 'east of the Sindhu' one. I used to have a link to a paper that contained several alternate theories. I can't find it that easily.

Editted to add link ... ANTIQUITY AND ORIGIN OF THE TERM 'HINDU'