The Concept of a Coming Messiah

[Ben Avraham]

The Concept of a Coming Messiah

The concept of a Messiah to come was in the hearts of the peasant Jews who were left behind after the high and middle classes were removed by the Assyrias first and later by the Babylonians. Then, the Jews who remained behind were expected to cultivate the Land, since they offered the conquerors no danger of further insurrection. It was then that the concept of a coming Messiah originated as they would pray for the return of the Messiah throughout the years the Messiah was away for having been taken into exile and until he would eventually return; especially from Babylon because the period of that exile was of only 70 years. (Jeremiah 29:10)

 

[allfoak]

The concept of a coming messiah came from the internal experiences of the mystic
It was never meant to be taken literally.
This happens when knowledge is received from man rather than through experience.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Ah ha, The Ted Turner "Christians are Losers" theory. You make that up on your own or read it somewhere?

Have you ever read the Essay of Mark Twain about the Jews? Probably not or you would not have asked the above question.

 

[wizanda]

The Concept of a Coming Messiah

Judaism 101: Mashiach: The Messiah

These Jewish sites keep saying minimum requirements for being a Jew, belief in the coming Messiah, and in the Resurrection.

As for the concept of a coming messiah based on the text:

Daniel has a long prophecy about the Messiah's role in the Ravenous Work, that continues until the new kingdom; where then the whole earth shall know God, and the Saintly kingdom will be ever lasting.

This is then clarified across the prophets, with much of Isaiah, and Zechariah being about it; it's an Amazing Work of textual engineering.

 

[Ben Avraham]

Judaism 101: Mashiach: The Messiah

These Jewish sites keep saying minimum requirements for being a Jew, belief in the coming Messiah, and in the Resurrection.

As for the concept of a coming messiah based on the text:

Daniel has a long prophecy about the Messiah's role in the Ravenous Work, that continues until the new kingdom; where then the whole earth shall know God, and the Saintly kingdom will be ever lasting.

This is then clarified across the prophets, with much of Isaiah, and Zechariah being about it; it's an Amazing Work of textual engineering.

Sorry! If you are talking about Jesus as your Messiah. The book of Daniel says nothing about him.

 

[wizanda]

Sorry!

So objectionable you don't make sense, and can't even see it....

If you are talking about Jesus as your Messiah.

Yeshua didn't claim to be the Messiah; as far as i know from prophecy, he was more like the High Priest measuring the people of Israel, with a plummet line of righteousness.

The book of Daniel says nothing about him.

Daniel 9:26 After the sixty-two weeks the Messiah shall be cut off, and shall have nothing: and the people of the prince who shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and its end shall be with a flood, and even to the end shall be war; desolations are determined.

Everything stated was self contained within Daniel's own prophecies; you seem to have trouble separating different religious texts, try reading more of them globally, it gets easier as you get used to it.

 

[Ben Avraham]

So objectionable you don't make sense, and can't even see it....

Yeshua didn't claim to be the Messiah; as far as i know from prophecy, he was more like the High Priest measuring the people of Israel, with a plummet line of righteousness.

Daniel 9:26 After the sixty-two weeks the Messiah shall be cut off, and shall have nothing: and the people of the prince who shall come shall destroy the city and the sanctuary; and its end shall be with a flood, and even to the end shall be war; desolations are determined.

Everything stated was self contained within Daniel's own prophecies; you seem to have trouble separating different religious texts, try reading more of them globally, it gets easier as you get used to it.

The Suffering Servant of Isaiah 53 aka Messiah ben Joseph was cut off but not by death but by being rejected by HaShem and Judah confirmed to remain as a Lamp in Jerusalem forever for the sake of David. (Psalm 78:67-70; and Kings 11:36)

 

[sun rise]

The title of this thread was not limited to the Jewish concept of a Messiah but it's clear that you intended to limit the discussion so I'll limit my comment to asking if you've read this story: “Joseph della Reyna Storms Heaven”.

 

[RabbiO]

The title of this thread was not limited to the Jewish concept of a Messiah but it's clear that you intended to limit the discussion so I'll limit my comment to asking if you've read this story: “Joseph della Reyna Storms Heaven”.

And you think what Ben Avraham posts is representative of, for what of a better term, mainstream Judaism because....?

 

[Brian Schuh]

The Concept of a Coming Messiah

The concept of a Messiah to come was in the hearts of the peasant Jews who were left behind after the high and middle classes were removed by the Assyrias first and later by the Babylonians. Then, the Jews who remained behind were expected to cultivate the Land, since they offered the conquerors no danger of further insurrection. It was then that the concept of a coming Messiah originated as they would pray for the return of the Messiah throughout the years the Messiah was away for having been taken into exile and until he would eventually return; especially from Babylon because the period of that exile was of only 70 years. (Jeremiah 29:10)

God through Moses said that he will send a prophet with a mitzvah that we listen to him and do as he says. That was interpreted to mean that we listen to any true prophet in every generation. You are right that the concept of a final prophet and final redeemer of Israel came much later. I hear loud and clear what you are implying and tend to think similar.

 

[Ben Avraham]

God through Moses said that he will send a prophet with a mitzvah that we listen to him and do as he says. That was interpreted to mean that we listen to any true prophet in every generation. You are right that the concept of a final prophet and final redeemer of Israel came much later. I hear loud and clear what you are implying and tend to think similar.

Please, quote the text where I can read about the prophet you are talking about whom the Lord sent through Moses.
If you mean Deuteronomy 18:15, that prophet was Joshua. (Joshua 4:14; Numbers 27:18-20)

 

[Ben Avraham]

The title of this thread was not limited to the Jewish concept of a Messiah but it's clear that you intended to limit the discussion so I'll limit my comment to asking if you've read this story: “Joseph della Reyna Storms Heaven”.

No, I have not.

 

[Brian Schuh]

Please, quote the text where I can read about the prophet you are talking about whom the Lord sent through Moses.
If you mean Deuteronomy 18:15, that prophet was Joshua. (Joshua 4:14; Numbers 27:18-20)

Right you got it. Deut 18:15. About Joshua. Later on interpreted to mean all the true prophets. And still even later in history taken to mean a messiah. But clearly referring to Joshua.

 

[wizanda]

But clearly referring to Joshua.

And just by 'coincidence', it also happening to be the same name of Yeshua; whose prophecies have all come to pass so far...

 

[Brian Schuh]

We know the messiah when a Jew fulfills the mission of messiah. Rabbi Yeshua Ben Joseph (Jesus (may that name be blotted out)) did not fulfill the mission but promised to come back to complete the mission. When he keeps his word, I will call him moshiach.

 

[wizanda]

When he keeps his word

The Word has already been kept; it is just recognition of what was said, that hasn't... Selah

So why would Yeshua want to put anyone on the guest list, if their only reason for coming, was because they wanted to eat the banquet provided; yet didn't like the bridegroom in the first place?

 

[paarsurrey]

God through Moses said that he will send a prophet with a mitzvah that we listen to him and do as he says. That was interpreted to mean that we listen to any true prophet in every generation. You are right that the concept of a final prophet and final redeemer of Israel came much later. I hear loud and clear what you are implying and tend to think similar.

Please give references from Torah.
Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Brian Schuh said: ↑
God through Moses said that he will send a prophet with a mitzvah that we listen to him and do as he says. That was interpreted to mean that we listen to any true prophet in every generation. You are right that the concept of a final prophet and final redeemer of Israel came much later. I hear loud and clear what you are implying and tend to think similar.

Please give references from Torah.
Regards

Anybody else, please
Regards

 

[Ben Avraham]

Right you got it. Deut 18:15. About Joshua. Later on interpreted to mean all the true prophets. And still even later in history taken to mean a messiah. But clearly referring to Joshua.

"To mean a Messiah!" First, Moses, than Joshua, then another, ....... then after many others, the turn of Jesus arrived,
and after Jesus, who was the next? See what I mean with the delusion of an individual Messiah? One is born, lives his span of life and dies. Are we supposed to expect a new Messiah in every generation? Obviously not! The Messiah is not supposed to die but to remain as a People before the Lord forever, aka Israel the Son of God if you read Exodus 4:22,23. That's why Prophet Habakkuk taught us about the collective concept of Messiah in Habakkuk 3:13. "The Lord goes forth to save His People; to save His Anointed One" aka Israel the Son of God. (Exodus 4:22,23)

 

[paarsurrey]

"To mean a Messiah!" First, Moses, than Joshua, then another, ....... then after many others, the turn of Jesus arrived,
and after Jesus, who was the next? See what I mean with the delusion of an individual Messiah? One is born, lives his span of life and dies. Are we supposed to expect a new Messiah in every generation? Obviously not! The Messiah is not supposed to die but to remain as a People before the Lord forever, aka Israel the Son of God if you read Exodus 4:22,23. That's why Prophet Habakkuk taught us about the collective concept of Messiah in Habakkuk 3:13. "The Lord goes forth to save His People; to save His Anointed One" aka Israel the Son of God. (Exodus 4:22,23)

Yet the Judaism people did not believe in Jesus. Please
Regards