The Church's Introduction to The Book of Mormon

[Watchmen]

Hi Friends.

First, let me say I do NOT want this to be a debate, and so I'm posting this topic in the DIR forum. And I promise to stick to the rules!

I'm very curious about your understanding of the Church's introduction to the Book of Mormon. The Church's prior introduction described the Lamanites as the "principal" ancestors of Native Americans. That was changed several years ago to describe the Lamanites as being "among" such ancestors.

What was/is your understanding of what the Church meant by "principal"? Why did the Church change the wording?

Again, I don't want this to be a debate. Pastor John and I have already argued about this topic in another thread and I don't want to recreate that here. I'd like to see what other members have to say about the topic.

Thanks.

 

[Katzpur]

My feelings are that when the word "principal" was used, that is what the Church leadership felt was the case. When scientific evidence surfaced indicating that this was not the case, they changed the wording to "among." I don't see the use of either word as having come about by revelation.

 

[Watchmen]

My feelings are that when the word "principal" was used, that is what the Church leadership felt was the case. When scientific evidence surfaced indicating that this was not the case, they changed the wording to "among." I don't see the use of either word as having come about by revelation.

I agree. But my question is a little different. What did the Church intend when it used the word "principal"?

 

[Katzpur]

I agree. But my question is a little different. What did the Church intend when it used the word "principal"?

I think they believed today's American Indians to be "primarily" or "mainly" descended from the Lamanites.

 

[Watchmen]

I think they believed today's American Indians to be "primarily" or "mainly" descended from the Lamanites.

Got it. Thanks. I agree.

 

[Prestor John]

The adjective "principal" means "most important" and I believe that Bruce R. McConkie used that adjective in the original Introduction to describe the quality or impact of having Lamanite ancestry, not necessarily the quantity of ancestors.

If Native Americans descend from the Lamanites, they would be the "most important" ancestors because through them the Native Americans would have direct lineal access to the covenanted promises God made to Abraham.

It would be an example of God's Word being fulfilled that all the kindreds of the world would be blessed through Abraham's seed.

I understand that many believe that the original Introduction supported the idea that the Lamanites were the "majority" ancestors of the Native Americans, but I believe that to be a false conclusion based on an incorrect inference made about the adjective "principal".

 

[Watchmen]

The adjective "principal" means "most important" and I believe that Bruce R. McConkie used that adjective in the original Introduction to describe the quality or impact of having Lamanite ancestry, not necessarily the quantity of ancestors.

If Native Americans descend from the Lamanites, they would be the "most important" ancestors because through them the Native Americans would have direct lineal access to the covenanted promises God made to Abraham.

It would be an example of God's Word being fulfilled that all the kindreds of the world would be blessed through Abraham's seed.

I understand that many believe that the original Introduction supported the idea that the Lamanites were the "majority" ancestors of the Native Americans, but I believe that to be a false conclusion based on an incorrect inference made about the adjective "principal".

And my second question was "Why did the Church change the wording?" Thoughts?

 

[Prestor John]

And my second question was "Why did the Church change the wording?" Thoughts?

The Church never had an official position on where the events of the Book of Mormon took place, if the peoples of the Book of Mormon were the first, last, or only inhabitants of the Americas or if they have left any significant genetic evidence.

Since the late 1800s, Church leaders made it very clear that anyone who tried to resolve any of these mysteries was doing so according to their own interpretation and none of their theories were the official position of the Church.

Therefore, as research concerning the Amerindians began to bear fruit, many of these unofficial theories began to be questioned, challenged and debunked.

None of these theories represented the actual position of the Church on these matters.

The idea that the Lamanites were the "principal" or "most important" ancestors of the Ameridians was a doctrinal position that lay unaffected by the collapse of these unofficial theories.

However, many ignorant people (members and non-members of the Church) who did not know the actual position of the Church on these matters became convinced that these unofficial theories were the actual positions of the Church.

Rather than clearing up this confusion, the use of the word "principal" seemed to generate even more confusion as many people incorrectly interpreted the word.

So, to avoid further confusion, the Brethren decided to make the change over a decade ago, to clear up the official position of the Church.

The Church does not want to appear to be making a claim that it never made.

 

[Watchmen]

The Church never had an official position on where the events of the Book of Mormon took place, if the peoples of the Book of Mormon were the first, last, or only inhabitants of the Americas or if they have left any significant genetic evidence.

Since the late 1800s, Church leaders made it very clear that anyone who tried to resolve any of these mysteries was doing so according to their own interpretation and none of their theories were the official position of the Church.

Therefore, as research concerning the Amerindians began to bear fruit, many of these unofficial theories began to be questioned, challenged and debunked.

None of these theories represented the actual position of the Church on these matters.

The idea that the Lamanites were the "principal" or "most important" ancestors of the Ameridians was a doctrinal position that lay unaffected by the collapse of these unofficial theories.

However, many ignorant people (members and non-members of the Church) who did not know the actual position of the Church on these matters became convinced that these unofficial theories were the actual positions of the Church.

Rather than clearing up this confusion, the use of the word "principal" seemed to generate even more confusion as many people incorrectly interpreted the word.

So, to avoid further confusion, the Brethren decided to make the change over a decade ago, to clear up the official position of the Church.

The Church does not want to appear to be making a claim that it never made.

I think President Kimball made it very clear that all Indians (not to mention Polynesians) were descendants of Lamanites, but as this is a DIR forum I won't debate it. Thank you for sharing your perspective.

 

[Watchmen]

Anyone else have any thoughts? Clear? Deep Shadow?

 

[Prestor John]

I think President Kimball made it very clear that all Indians (not to mention Polynesians) were descendants of Lamanites, but as this is a DIR forum I won't debate it. Thank you for sharing your perspective.

Yes, as I said, many leaders in the Church have held that opinion, despite the Book of Mormon being silent on the issue.

Yet, I will remind you, that an opinion held by a leader of the Church does not necessarily constitute doctrine for the entire Church.

In order for an idea to become the official doctrine of the Church, it needs to be submitted for discussion and vote before the General Authorities of the Church and an official statement made.

I could quote many other Church leaders who claim that the Church has no official position on the descendants of the Lamanites, if you'd like.

I wouldn't want this to turn into a debate though.

Suffice it to say that there are Church leaders who have spoken out against the position postulated by President Kimball and others and that their position is not the official position of the Church.

 

[Watchmen]

Yes, as I said, many leaders in the Church have held that opinion, despite the Book of Mormon being silent on the issue.

Yet, I will remind you, that an opinion held by a leader of the Church does not necessarily constitute doctrine for the entire Church.

In order for an idea to become the official doctrine of the Church, it needs to be submitted for discussion and vote before the General Authorities of the Church and an official statement made.

I could quote many other Church leaders who claim that the Church has no official position on the descendants of the Lamanites, if you'd like.

I wouldn't want this to turn into a debate though.

Suffice it to say that there are Church leaders who have spoken out against the position postulated by President Kimball and others and that their position is not the official position of the Church.

If the Church has no official position on the descendants of the Lamanites, why do they say anything about that topic in the Introduction?

 

[Prestor John]

If the Church has no official position on the descendants of the Lamanites, why do they say anything about that topic in the Introduction?

Actually read all of my comments and you will have your answer.

 

[Watchmen]

Actually read all of my comments and you will have your answer.

The Introduction now says the Lamanites are among the ancestors. Isn't that an official position if it's in the Introduction?

 

[Prestor John]

The Introduction now says the Lamanites are among the ancestors. Isn't that an official position if it's in the Introduction?

No.

The beliefs that the Lamanites are the "most important" ancestors or "among" the ancestors of the Amerindians are beliefs recorded in the Book of Mormon.

It is the Book of Mormon that made these claims, not "the Church."

I think this will become clearer when I mention another example: "same-sex marriage"

"The Church" believes and teaches that the scriptures contain the Word of God, therefore, "the Church" accepts that what is written in the scriptures is the truth.

"The Church" believes and teaches that marriage is only between a man and a woman and that it was instituted by God. This is not a position that "the Church" decided to take, it is believed to be the Lord's position as revealed in the scriptures.

"The Church" also believes and teaches that homosexuality is sexual sin that should be avoided. This is not a position that "the Church" decided to take, it is believed to be the Lord's position as revealed in the scriptures.

However, the concept of "same-sex marriage" is not discussed in the scriptures, therefore, "the Church" had to decide what position to take on this issue while relying on the scriptures and revelation.

The practice of refusing to baptize a child of a same-sex household until they reached the age of eighteen is not found in the scriptures, therefore, it is evident that the decision was made by "the Church" to take that official position.

"The Church" believes that this is the Lord's position on the matter, but the decision was made through the process of discussion and personal revelation, not solely an appeal to the scriptures.

If "the Church" were to make a claim about where the events of the Book of Mormon took place, or if the Lehites were the only people to inhabit the Americas, or who exactly were descended from the Lamanites today - then "the Church" would be taking an official position because none of those things were recorded in the Book of Mormon.

However, since the Book of Mormon does record that descendants of the Lamanites would be "among" the Amerindians and that they would be considered the "most important" ancestors - "the Church" did not take an official position by repeating what the Book of Mormon had already claimed.

Claims made in the Book of Mormon are not claims made by "the Church", but they are rather claims made by the ancient writers of the Book of Mormon, which "the Church" believes to be true.

Did this help clear up the confusion at all?

 

[Watchmen]

No.

The beliefs that the Lamanites are the "most important" ancestors or "among" the ancestors of the Amerindians are beliefs recorded in the Book of Mormon.

It is the Book of Mormon that made these claims, not "the Church."

I think this will become clearer when I mention another example: "same-sex marriage"

"The Church" believes and teaches that the scriptures contain the Word of God, therefore, "the Church" accepts that what is written in the scriptures is the truth.

"The Church" believes and teaches that marriage is only between a man and a woman and that it was instituted by God. This is not a position that "the Church" decided to take, it is believed to be the Lord's position as revealed in the scriptures.

"The Church" also believes and teaches that homosexuality is sexual sin that should be avoided. This is not a position that "the Church" decided to take, it is believed to be the Lord's position as revealed in the scriptures.

However, the concept of "same-sex marriage" is not discussed in the scriptures, therefore, "the Church" had to decide what position to take on this issue while relying on the scriptures and revelation.

The practice of refusing to baptize a child of a same-sex household until they reached the age of eighteen is not found in the scriptures, therefore, it is evident that the decision was made by "the Church" to take that official position.

"The Church" believes that this is the Lord's position on the matter, but the decision was made through the process of discussion and personal revelation, not solely an appeal to the scriptures.

If "the Church" were to make a claim about where the events of the Book of Mormon took place, or if the Lehites were the only people to inhabit the Americas, or who exactly were descended from the Lamanites today - then "the Church" would be taking an official position because none of those things were recorded in the Book of Mormon.

However, since the Book of Mormon does record that descendants of the Lamanites would be "among" the Amerindians and that they would be considered the "most important" ancestors - "the Church" did not take an official position by repeating what the Book of Mormon had already claimed.

Claims made in the Book of Mormon are not claims made by "the Church", but they are rather claims made by the ancient writers of the Book of Mormon, which "the Church" believes to be true.

Did this help clear up the confusion at all?

The question is about the official position of the Church. It is not about claims in the Book of Mormon. The Introduction was written by the Church. Is not the statement that the Lamanites are among the ancestors of the Native Americans an official position of th Church? If not, why did the Church put that there (why did they write the Introduction at all if not to communicate some position)?

 

[Prestor John]

The question is about the official position of the Church. It is not about claims in the Book of Mormon. The Introduction was written by the Church. Is not the statement that the Lamanites are among the ancestors of the Native Americans an official position of th Church? If not, why did the Church put that there (why did they write the Introduction at all if not to communicate some position)?

Have you not read the Introduction to the Book of Mormon?

Do you not know the purposes of writing an introduction to a book?

An introduction to a book describes the scope of the book and gives a brief explanation or summary of it.

-The Introduction to the Book of Mormon summarizes the history and doctrine contained in the Book of Mormon, including the visit of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ.

An introduction may also explain certain elements that are important to understand about the book that may not be part of the main text.

-The Introduction to the Book of Mormon also describes; the retrieval of the plates, the source of translation of the plates and the many testimonies of the truthfulness of the translated work.

An introduction is included so that readers can have an idea about the book before they actually start reading it.

-The Introduction to the Book of Mormon claims that it is a book of scripture and includes an invitation to read, ponder and pray about what is contained in the Book of Mormon, as well as a promise that a spiritual witness as to its truthfulness can be received through the power of the Holy Ghost.

- Finally, the Introduction to the Book of Mormon testifies of; the living reality of the Lord Jesus Christ, the prophetic calling of the Prophet Joseph Smith and the Restoration of the Lord's Church today.

There is no "position" about the Book of Mormon contained in the Introduction that is not also contained in the Book of Mormon.

The Book of Mormon claimed that after the destruction of the Nephites, the Lamanites would dwindle in unbelief and would eventually be scattered by the Gentiles who would come to take possession of the promised land.

However, it is also recorded in the Book of Mormon that the Lord promised that the Lamanites would not be completely destroyed and that He would perform a great work of restoration among the Gentiles which would eventually cause the descendants of the Lamanites to remember that they had come from the House of Israel and that the covenanted promises made to Abraham could be extended to them as well.

The Church did not write the Book of Mormon, therefore, the claim that the descendants of the Lamanites are among the Amerindians was a claim made by the writers of the Book of Mormon, not the Church.

 

[Watchmen]

Have you not read the Introduction to the Book of Mormon?

Do you not know the purposes of writing an introduction to a book?

An introduction to a book describes the scope of the book and gives a brief explanation or summary of it.

-The Introduction to the Book of Mormon summarizes the history and doctrine contained in the Book of Mormon, including the visit of the resurrected Lord Jesus Christ.

An introduction may also explain certain elements that are important to understand about the book that may not be part of the main text.

-The Introduction to the Book of Mormon also describes; the retrieval of the plates, the source of translation of the plates and the many testimonies of the truthfulness of the translated work.

An introduction is included so that readers can have an idea about the book before they actually start reading it.

-The Introduction to the Book of Mormon claims that it is a book of scripture and includes an invitation to read, ponder and pray about what is contained in the Book of Mormon, as well as a promise that a spiritual witness as to its truthfulness can be received through the power of the Holy Ghost.

- Finally, the Introduction to the Book of Mormon testifies of; the living reality of the Lord Jesus Christ, the prophetic calling of the Prophet Joseph Smith and the Restoration of the Lord's Church today.

There is no "position" about the Book of Mormon contained in the Introduction that is not also contained in the Book of Mormon.

The Book of Mormon claimed that after the destruction of the Nephites, the Lamanites would dwindle in unbelief and would eventually be scattered by the Gentiles who would come to take possession of the promised land.

However, it is also recorded in the Book of Mormon that the Lord promised that the Lamanites would not be completely destroyed and that He would perform a great work of restoration among the Gentiles which would eventually cause the descendants of the Lamanites to remember that they had come from the House of Israel and that the covenanted promises made to Abraham could be extended to them as well.

The Church did not write the Book of Mormon, therefore, the claim that the descendants of the Lamanites are among the Amerindians was a claim made by the writers of the Book of Mormon, not the Church.

Where in the Book of Mormon does it claim the Lamanites are among the ancestors of the American Indians?

Where in the Book of Mormon does it claim the Lamanites are the principal ancestors of the American Indians?

Thanks.

 

[Prestor John]

Where in the Book of Mormon does it claim the Lamanites are among the ancestors of the American Indians?

Where in the Book of Mormon does it claim the Lamanites are the principal ancestors of the American Indians?

Thanks.

I'm willing to share if you answer one question first.

The Book of Mormon does not use the exact word "principal" or the exact terms "Native American", "American Indian" or "Ameridians" to describe the descendants of the Lamanites, but it does claim that the Lamanites would remain in the promised land and be scattered by the Gentiles and it describes the importance of the scattered Lamanites living among the Gentiles.

Are you going to be lame and claim that the Book of Mormon is not making those claims because it does not use the exact wording or are you going to be honest?

 

[Watchmen]

I'm willing to share if you answer one question first.

The Book of Mormon does not use the exact word "principal" or the exact terms "Native American", "American Indian" or "Ameridians" to describe the descendants of the Lamanites, but it does claim that the Lamanites would remain in the promised land and be scattered by the Gentiles and it describes the importance of the scattered Lamanites living among the Gentiles.

Are you going to be lame and claim that the Book of Mormon is not making those claims because it does not use the exact wording or are you going to be honest?

I'm not looking for exact wording. What have you got?