-
Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.
Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:- Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
- Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
- Access to private conversations with other members.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!
The Bible And Science: Insects
- Thread starter Earthling
- Start date
sooda
Veteran Member
Locusts and grasshoppers are alike except locusts sometimes congregate and swarm.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
I know. Literalists trying to defend the errors in the Bible, even the tiniest of errors, tends to backfire quite often. Most atheists do not care at all about such minor errors as this. The only thing that makes them interesting is the doomed attempts to defend them.
Swarming behavior is triggered by overcrowding an the continually rubbing of the legs that stimulates the production of the hormone serotonin and the phase change to swarming. This has been simulated in the lab by stroking the legs of individuals until the response is triggered. I forget how many strokes on average were required for the phase shift, but I recall it was in excess of 500 times.
It looks like a horse lubber grasshopper. I have collected these in trips through Mississippi. These are used in morphology classes for dissection, because of their size and they are a good generalized insect model.
I know that many can, but I do not know that all swarm. The locust is just a big grasshopper that flies, but like the grasshopper in the photo, not all grasshoppers fly.
I'm still not sure all grasshoppers swarm.
Swarms used to be a big pest problem in the western United States, but pest levels here are generally more isolated and local these days.
Subduction Zone
Veteran Member
It appears that the answer is no:
I'm still not sure all grasshoppers swarm.
What's The Difference Between Grasshoppers and Locusts?
That seems about the size of it. Apparently some species that do not normally swarm can, but generally they do not. I learned a lot about these beasties from a guy named Allan Showler about 25 years ago and have forgotten a lot of it. This has been worth the review if for nothing else.
sooda
Veteran Member
The pics I posted look like the big locusts in Arabia that swarm by the millions (or zillions) from time to time.
Why would anyone bother to defend this silly scripture. Bats are Mammals!
sooda
Veteran Member
They won't get into your hair or mouth if you wear a piece of mosquito netting over your head.
I can see that. The horse lubber grasshopper is a pretty large species in North America and would come about as close as anything we have here in size with the locusts of North Africa and the Middle East.
Grasshopper development is referred to as hemimetabolous or incomplete metamorphosis, where juveniles look like smaller versions of adults, but without fully developed wings. With its truncated wings, the horse lubber in the picture you provided looks like an immature version of a locust. The other picture you posted looks like a species of Melanoplus. A common genus with species around the US. It is smaller than the horse lubber and much smaller than the true locust.
Fear seems to be a big thing with literalists. They fear that their belief will turn to dust if the Bible is not deified.
sooda
Veteran Member
The newly hatched are called nymphs.. I'd forgotten.. and they are like green worms and can't fly the first week after they hatch.. The streets with slick with mashed nymphs.
There is something terribly wrong if your religion is in danger of collapse over some ancient myths.
I've read accounts and seen photos of the vast numbers of these things marching around looking for food.
Not the religion so much as those poor misguided people. It is their belief that is in danger of collapse or at least they think so.
Yes. Nymph refers to the juveniles.
Shad
Veteran Member
A video is not a demonstration that a specific species can only walk on 4 of the 6 legs. For all we know the grasshopper is only using 4 as that is all that was necessary such as low speed movement. You need to provide a reference to a specific species that is incapable of using the leaping legs for non-leaping movement.
Earthling
David Henson
The OP never even suggested that the creatures in question could only walk on 4 legs. So much time wasted just because, apparently, either no one has read the OP or they have no reading comprehension skills. Just read it.
Shad
Veteran Member
I read it. The sole criteria was "walked on 4 legs" not had 4 walking legs. I can get my dog to walk on 2 legs but that does not mean it has only 2 walking legs. Biblical writers probably never made any observation as they were part of the elite. They confused a single purpose with all functions.
Does the dung beetle have 4 or 6 legged walking movement? It uses it's back legs for other purposes.
Last edited:
Skwim
Veteran Member
I'm not trying anything of the sort. I'm showing you the Bible is wrong. Grasshoppers don't "typically walk on only four legs."
In other words one would be equally correct in saying "insects walk on one leg" (along with the other five of course)" or "insects walk on two legs" (along with the other four of course), or "insects walk on three legs" (along with the other three of course), or "insects walk on four legs" (along with the other two of course), or "insects walk on five legs" (along with the other leg of course), or insects walk on six legs. All in all a pretty inane point you're trying to make.
.