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The Bible and Homosexuality

Discussion in 'Religious Debates' started by Green Gaia, Mar 30, 2004.

  1. Pah

    Pah Uber all member

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    That may be true, Dan but I don't see that distinction in the differing sequences.

    From http://www.religioustolerance.org/ev_bibl.htm
    I would think that spiritual and physical, if not done together, is a chicken and egg quandry.

    And I don't think that accounts for the inconsistencies when taken literally

    There are aslo indication from analysis of the style of the written Hebrew that the second story was written several centuries before the first (which was written after the Babylonian captivity) Couldn't the physical and spiritual have been written at the same time? Why the time lag from one to the other?

    The time lag is also indicitive of the separate authors of each account "E" (for the name of God used - Elohiym) wrote the first story and "J" (from the German for Yalweh) used in the second.

    Another theroy of why there are two is that they answer different questions. The first answers the question of origin and the second answers the "why" of life

    For a ctitical analysis of an Internet Apologist, Robert Turkel (writting under the name J.P. Holding) see http://members.aol.com/bbu85/nous.htm
     
  2. Runt

    Runt Well-Known Member

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    And did he talk back? Did you ask "Jesus, is homosexuality a sin?" And did he actually answer you? And how do you know that the answer was not just your mind giving you the answer you wanted?

    Alright, fine, within the context of the Christian religion my comparison is weak. However, I don't believe that the Bible is anything more than an interesting book, so I guess it was kind of dumb of me to look for ANY evidence in the Bible. (That would be, to me, like looking for evidence in Dr. Seuss). I personally don't think there is anything wrong with homosexuality, and I personally don't care what the Bible says about it because I don't regard the Bible as an authority... so.. yeah.

    I was told that by a Hebrew teacher who happens to go to my church. I think he is a fairly good authority... are YOU a teacher of Hebrew, or did you just look up the word in a Hebrew to English dictionary?

    And isn't the Godhead still a little pagan? I mean, many pagans believe all Gods are manifestations of one ultimate God... which sounds to me what the Godhead is: three manifestations of one ultimate God.

    Gee, that sounds a lot like what I do... I research a topic and then think about it for a while. Often this yields affirmative results, just like your "asking the prophet" does... Only, I don't claim that the Holy Spirit has given me answers... I think they came from within myself...

    Sounds to me like you are doing something similar... only you are deciding that the conclusions you have drawn are true BEFORE you really think about them, and therefore have a 100% success rate because you don't "pray" until you believe you've already found the answers.

    Okay, so millions of people are reading different versions of the Bible and having FAITH that their own individual version is correct? It seems to me, then, that there are a lot of good Christians being screwed over simply because they have not been "blessed" enough to come across the "true translation", which is basically their only ticket into heaven.

    You seem pretty convinced that you know God's thoughts and opinions better than other people... but God is much smarter than you, and couldn't possibly think the way you believe him to. He's probably above petty concerns like homosexuality. It seems like the Bible was written by a bunch of men putting words into God's mouth so that they could enforce their personal moral values on everyone else.

    Yes, but understanding the exact nuance of a word used by such a culture is difficult, even if you do know the culture well. Think about contemporary literature and how much time people spend trying to decipher the words of poets and authors who are still alive! And these pieces of literature were A) written in a time period and culture that the readers are familiar with, B) written in the native language of the readers, and C) free from any claims of having been inspired by God. If the Bible is supposed to be easy to understand for people who know the language and context in which it was originally written, then why are there so many different interpretations (even among those who seek to interpret the Bible literally) made by people who are supposed to be EXPERTS in that field of study?

    Give me a break, most people are not an expert even of their OWN language. For example, why do you think that people continue to study English all the way into graduate school? Because it takes years and years of study to claim to be “an expert” in ANY one language… only linguists can claim that! I mean, don’t get me wrong… you MAY be a linguist (you are certainly more fluent in Spanish than I am), but that’s a pretty outstanding claim to make, that you are an expert in several languages! If you are… well, right on! But I doubt you really are…

    Hmm… actually, according to my dictionary, we are both wrong… apparently the damn thing is “pasar la aspiradora”. No “por”, no “a”. Oh well… this just goes to show the problem of translation. What if people don’t even know the language well enough to make an accurate translation?

    Thanks… I think… *doesn’t speak Spanish well enough to know if that was intended as an insult or not*
     
  3. LCMS Sprecher

    LCMS Sprecher Member

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    "If the Bible is supposed to be easy to understand for people who know the language and context in which it was originally written, then why are there so many different interpretations (even among those who seek to interpret the Bible literally) made by people who are supposed to be EXPERTS in that field of study?"
    - Runt

    Because everyone wants the Bible to say what they want it to say. Take this thread for example, you have two interpretations of the Bible on hand here (a liberal version that is unfounded and wants to see a Biblical "ok" for homosexuality, and a literal conservative viewpoint that believes that God meant what He meant not something else). People interpret the Bible in whatever way they want it to read. Thomas Jefferson cut out the miracles in the Bible because he didn't believe in them. Does that mean they didn't happen? When it comes down to it, the question is what is your hermenutic?
     
  4. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    Yes. Yes. Yes. It takes a long time to learn to distinguish, but I've been at it for a long time.
     
  5. dan

    dan Well-Known Member

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    I will be a professor of ancient languages when I graduate.

    Well, the truth is constantly being offered them, but Satan is very good at getting them to think that it is false.


    The procreative power is nothing less than the very power of God, and there is nothing He takes more seriously.

    Perfectly logical doubt. If you'd like to test me you're welcome.

    It was tongue in cheek. I apologize, I get a little sarcastic sometimes; but I'm working on it.
     
  6. Runt

    Runt Well-Known Member

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    Well, kudos to you! And I'm not being sarcastic... I think that's awesome. I'd study ancient languages if I had the opportunity, but my Dad says if he is paying for my college, then I sure as hell better be getting a degree in something "useful"! >.<

    I'm not talking about the people who have decided the Bible is false. I'm talking about the ones who think that their own interpretation (or that of their church) is the one and only "right" one, and that everyone else (other Christians included) is going to Hell. It just seems like there are a lot of really generally good people who honestly want to obey God, but who, according to the beliefs of others, are going to Hell simply for believing their interpretation of the Bible is correct when it isn't.

    Regardless of whether or not homosexuals act on their desires/nature or not, the fact of the matter is that just because they suppress themselves does NOT mean that they are going to go and find a person of the opposite sex with which to have babies! So what does it matter? It's not like they're "wasting it"... they aren't going to have sex with the opposite sex anyway, so what is the big deal?

    Wrt Xnmt, rx Tn pn ink sS?

    HINT: This is a real language but is not written as it should be.
     
  7. painted wolf

    painted wolf Grey Muzzle

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    oohhh.. a linguistics challange... sounds like fun... here is one.

    Tsa!ni ithulaha tsosdilawitsido!hi

    Tsa!ni gohigi oginali nige:so

    ok , two...
    I would have written them in the origional alphabet but the font isn't working.

    ps, how do you know what god takes most seriously over anything elce?
    I mean god takes a lot of things seriously right?

    wa:do
     
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