The Bible and aliens

[robocop (actually)]

yes the galaxies spreading apart may mean something different then the big bang... water in space or mass being created, but when this combines withm Type IA supernovae and the microwave background, there was a big bang. However small thingsd in it can be like the infinite/infinitesimal.

I have my own theory of quantum mechanics, that particles can communicate because they are made up minds just like our cells, brain, and galaxies dcan. I will have to check up on the experiments of quantum mechanics though.

I wasn't so much endorsing homosexuality... I was asking why would a homosexual male for instance have to have sex with a female to ascend; a person who is not interested in sex too?

Sensual meditation is just practice, but it prepares humanity for the future.

Yes I do need to keep digging deeper, but the medication I'm on makes it hard for me just to read.:sorry1:

 

[robocop (actually)]

I looked up quantization of certain physical properties, wave-particle duality, principle of uncertainty, and quantum entanglement.

For me, it is just magic tricks from particles communicating at a certain time in the experiment and I see no "God" here.

I think time is different for smaller things so they can communicate below the speed of light even if to themselves they are communicating very far.

 

[robocop (actually)]

I know I'm not batting 1000 with you, but "those who came from the sky" translated into Hebrew starts and ends with the word for G-d in the Bible:

אלה שבאו מהשמיים

 

[Ben Dhyan]

yes the galaxies spreading apart may mean something different then the big bang... water in space or mass being created, but when this combines withm Type IA supernovae and the microwave background, there was a big bang. However small thingsd in it can be like the infinite/infinitesimal.

I have my own theory of quantum mechanics, that particles can communicate because they are made up minds just like our cells, brain, and galaxies dcan. I will have to check up on the experiments of quantum mechanics though.

I wasn't so much endorsing homosexuality... I was asking why would a homosexual male for instance have to have sex with a female to ascend; a person who is not interested in sex too?

Sensual meditation is just practice, but it prepares humanity for the future.

Yes I do need to keep digging deeper, but the medication I'm on makes it hard for me just to read.:sorry1:

The cosmic microwave radiation background equally shows the Universe is infinite...for it is omnipresent throughout the cosmos just like dark matter, zero point energy, quantum vacuum, etc...there is no way of proving it is finite in its spacial limits.

But robocop...we can to and fro on these matters and it won't change reality..whatever the truth, it forever remains on the other side of the theories, equations, descriptions,,,yea..even knowledge. The thing about the human brain is that it works in conceptual patterns sequenced in time to represent or model reality...whereas reality itself absolutely itself, regardless of theories or opinion.

Iow...all the descriptions, equations, symbols, language, etc., created by the human mind to describe reality are only mental representations of reality..they can never ever be a substitute for reality. So while there is still some satisfaction and enjoyment in discussing these things...as serious aspirants of truth...we must do something to transcend our present state and realize truth directly...not indirectly through a mortal instrument operating in space time.

Ok..I understand now you weren't endorsing homosexuality.

That's ok..all meditation is helpful to bring about correction to the errors of our functioning...belief will never do it....the errors of our mind need to be corrected for liberation to occur. No matter we sometimes go down a wrong track...so long as we continue meditation practice...the error will be corrected...there are Elohim guides helping each and every soul that makes a sincere effort...regardless of the race, religion, gender, or colour.

No sweat...though no doubt you are going through your trials and for that you have my sympathy...medication can even be helpful in these matters so just work with what you've got ....clearly the path is difficult. Matthew 7:13,14 “Enter through the narrow gate. For wide is the gate and broad is the road and easy it is that leads to destruction, and many enter through it. But small is the gate and narrow the road and difficult it is that leads to eternal life, and only the sincere will find it."

I looked up quantization of certain physical properties, wave-particle duality, principle of uncertainty, and quantum entanglement.

For me, it is just magic tricks from particles communicating at a certain time in the experiment and I see no "God" here.

I think time is different for smaller things so they can communicate below the speed of light even if to themselves they are communicating very far.

Particles are made of energy...quantum vacuum/dark energy...this dark energy is omnipresent...God's omniscience is beyond time...relativity and speed of light are of little consequence in this context. But what I said above applies...let's not to and fro on conceptual ideas of the physical universe...and instead explore, to the extent conceptualizations can be useful, the spiritual goal. The Elohim can guide us always in an infallible way towards our goal...not that we always desire to do the hard yards required...but the goodies always win in the end!

I know I'm not batting 1000 with you, but "those who came from the sky" translated into Hebrew starts and ends with the word for G-d in the Bible:

אלה שבאו מהשמיים

Yes...and Elohim can be plural...whereas YHWH is never translated as God but Lord...which is singular. My guess is the YHVH is the sumerian God EA and the Elohim are the Sumerian Annunaki.

Btw,..it is said by scholars that it was the ten northern tribes of Israel who primarily worshipped the Elohim whereas the two southern tribes Judah and Benjamin worship YHWH. When the northern tribal areas were conquered...the refugees who fled to the south brought their scripture with them which together with southern scripture was redacted to give us the old testament we have today.

 

[robocop (actually)]

Dear ben d,
The thick book with the sun and the ocean is meant to be “simple, matter-of-fact and comprehensive.”
Upon careful study it is more and more of a “solid monument.”
The words and sentences are easily readable, but esoteric meanings and definitions can excite a lot of research.
It is compact to the point that hundreds of books about it that are its size might be written that are far thicker than normal books with philosophy.
It is irrefutable proof that from the Bible we can see in the past beings who were far ahead of us and that in modern times these beings are still in charge of and ahead of us. That means you can test it against what writing should be say 2000 years from now and it will hold up!
It is scientific and religious at the same time. It is supposed to be researched.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Friend robocop....I have read most of the material in that book (Intelligent Design - Message from the Designers) previously, it was included in the earlier Raelian books I read.....though the sensual meditation appears new to me...which is not meditation as I understand it to be, but rather reminds me of Tantric practices of the Hindu tradition and Mantik Chia's 'Taoist Secrets of Love'.

All religious practice including the so called 'sensual meditation' may prepare the aspirant for the real meditation which is a solitary practice of stilling the mind. Ultimately if one is to leave the body...it can't be done while the body is occupied in sensual meditation. One must first be practice a meditation that stills the mind before the body can be left. Does that make sense to you?

However aspirants must a reach a prerequisite level of 'worthiness/unfoldment' that can take a lifetime/s before the penultimate portal is reached whereby ascension is the next and final step...leaving the body permanently through realizing immortality. :namaste

 

[robocop (actually)]

Yes I believe all of this. :yes: and yes you named the book correctly.

That stlling the mind is not meditation... it is contemplation. Contemplation means you sense nice things and still your mind... any thought that comes in you quickly delete. It helps to clear your mind when you think.

Personally, I think Hinduism is an atheist religion (because a God was described with many legs and arms, like it was just many extraterrestrials) that has some form if not a complete form of the correct meditation and may be the only ones beside us that does. Hinduism's meditation is different than ours but they are both good meditation.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Yes I believe all of this. :yes: and yes you named the book correctly.

That stlling the mind is not meditation... it is contemplation. Contemplation means you sense nice things and still your mind... any thought that comes in you quickly delete. It helps to clear your mind when you think.

Personally, I think Hinduism is an atheist religion (because a God was described with many legs and arms, like it was just many extraterrestrials) that has some form if not a complete form of the correct meditation and may be the only ones beside us that does. Hinduism's meditation is different than ours but they are both good meditation.

robocop...firstly...as a westerner, it is natural that you do not understand the nuance associated with concepts relating to the Hindu tradition....meditation is a translation of the Sanskrit dhyana. Dhyana involves the cessation of all thought process....no neuron firings....so that cosmic consciousness is directly present in the mind and not being obscured by having thoughts about cosmic consciousness in the mind. Do you see the difference...thoughts about cosmic consciousness actually prevent the direct apprehension of cosmic consciousness.

Secondly...Hinduism is not atheistic...perhaps you mean pantheistic? Now they both have a celestial hierarchy...Christianity has Seraphim, Cherubim. Archangels, Angels, Satan, Demons, etc.,...Hindu has Brahma, Vishnu, Shiva, etc......and both have a supreme and absolute God...the Hindu supreme God is Brahman. Now this is where the big difference is evident...Brahman is truly the unity of all that is....Brahman can't be confined by any space (infinite), can't be limited to any time (eternal), can't be limited to any dimension (omnipresent), can't be described by any words, and can't be known by any knowledge...but the Christian theology generally considers God as separate from his cosmic creation and therefore establishes a dualistic cosmos...there is the cosmos...and there is God outside of it.

So you can see in the Hindu tradition...it is understood by the disciple that is is essential to remove any perceived separation from God (Brahman), to realize cosmic consciousness/ union/ ascension. Whereas in the Christian tradition...the disciple understands (wrongly imo), that only Jesus could realize union with God, and that salvation comes from being chosen by God for residence in Heaven for good works performed, etc.,...and thus duality is the norm.

Now I ask you....if in Genesis 2:7....."Then the Lord God formed a man from the dust of the ground and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life, and the man became a living being".....it follows that God is not separate from what and who we are when it comes to consciousness. Without the spirit of God in us, there is no mind and no life. The sense we each have as an 'I' actually arises because of the breath of God in us...therefore the theological and psychological idea that God is outside of cosmic creation is in error. And it is the error God warned Adam about in Genesis 2:17 "...but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die.”...this denotes the fall from being in a state of..."the Father and I are one" (union), to a state of I am I and God is God (dualism).

The mysteries of God will only be revealed when the aspirants draws close to God...as that happens...the 'I' of the aspirant is overwhelmed by the greater 'I AM' of God and ultimately the apparent separation is removed fully....that is ascension!

 

[robocop (actually)]

You are still making some mistakes in meaning odf words and reading the wrong word; breath of life is different than breath of consciousness.

Why dfo I have a unity-duality problem? For me it is a unity of all non-God?

Thank you for the many corrections about Hinduism. Meditation and contemplation are both important.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

You are still making some mistakes in meaning odf words and reading the wrong word; breath of life is different than breath of consciousness.

Why dfo I have a unity-duality problem? For me it is a unity of all non-God?

Thank you for the many corrections about Hinduism. Meditation and contemplation are both important.

robocop....so far as the 'breath' of life given by YHWH to the body of 'clay'....my understanding is that it is synonymous with 'spirit'....'spirit' in turn is 'divine beingness'....do you agree? Without the spirit of God in the body, there is no living soul present. Self consciousness comes from this spirit...not from the brain computer...there are now artificial intelligence computers in operation that approach the number of logical operations per second of human brain synapse firings...but they don't have a real 'I' that goes with a living soul.

Ok...you say the unity of all non-God. Sure...that is a valid statement...but let's go further...I personally am not God. but though I am non-God, I am of God....for my existence is analogous to a cell in the body of God...I live, move, and have my being in God. So from the God perspective, I am not non-God, but a part of God. So the unity/duality debate comes about from this apparent paradox...looking it from the pov of a human mind...God is separate,...but from the God perspective, each human soul/mind is not separate. This is what Dhyana is about...to transcend the apparent duality/non-duality paradox and realize the non-duality state of God awareness.

Thank you in return..yes, meditation and contemplation are very important.

 

[robocop (actually)]

dear ben d,

Let me just clarify my position.
I believe in Relativity. It keeps getting tested in new more accurate ways. I don't believe in quantum mechanics but particle communication; I don't think anyone understands it. I like string theory but when will we ever test it? I believe in the big bang theory. Multiple big bangs can create a trailing off galaxy and I think the vectors would cancel out into 1.

Yes my book is "Intelligent Design: Message from the Designers." I base all that I do on it. Here is what I said about it.

Dear ben d,
The thick book with the sun and the ocean is meant to be “simple, matter-of-fact and comprehensive.”
Upon careful study it is more and more of a “solid monument.”
The words and sentences are easily readable, but esoteric meanings and definitions can excite a lot of research.
It is compact to the point that hundreds of books about it that are its size might be written that are far thicker than normal books with philosophy.
It is irrefutable proof that from the Bible we can see in the past beings who were far ahead of us and that in modern times these beings are still in charge of and ahead of us. That means you can test it against what writing should be say 2000 years from now and it will hold up!
It is scientific and religious at the same time. It is supposed to be researched.

Everything may have been communicating in the past, but I think we've drifted apart. A human can observe and communicate with more and more; galaxies, cells and more. But there will always be areas too massive or too small mass for them to not be reachable until later.

 

[Ben Dhyan]

dear ben d,

Let me just clarify my position.
I believe in Relativity. It keeps getting tested in new more accurate ways. I don't believe in quantum mechanics but particle communication; I don't think anyone understands it. I like string theory but when will we ever test it? I believe in the big bang theory. Multiple big bangs can create a trailing off galaxy and I think the vectors would cancel out into 1.

Yes my book is "Intelligent Design: Message from the Designers." I base all that I do on it. Here is what I said about it.

Everything may have been communicating in the past, but I think we've drifted apart. A human can observe and communicate with more and more; galaxies, cells and more. But there will always be areas too massive or too small mass for them to not be reachable until later.

Fine robocop...no problem...I wish you all the best...God bless. :namaste

 

[robocop (actually)]

You forgot this part about "Intelligent Design: message From the Designers":

Dear ben d,
The thick book with the sun and the ocean is meant to be “simple, matter-of-fact and comprehensive.”
Upon careful study it is more and more of a “solid monument.”
The words and sentences are easily readable, but esoteric meanings and definitions can excite a lot of research.
It is compact to the point that hundreds of books about it that are its size might be written that are far thicker than normal books with philosophy.
It is irrefutable proof that from the Bible we can see in the past beings who were far ahead of us and that in modern times these beings are still in charge of and ahead of us. That means you can test it against what writing should be say 2000 years from now and it will hold up!
It is scientific and religious at the same time. It is supposed to be researched.

 

[robocop (actually)]

Does anyone have anything they would like to discuss that is on topic, ben d if he wants?

I might have been too far with my posts, so I'm hoping to chill.

 

[robocop (actually)]

I would like to move on.

I just looked up Gen 1:4-5. Genesis 1:4 says God saw that the light was good. That to me means the earth and the Sun were tested for their interactions.
The next two parts are:

and God divided the light from the darkness, and it was evening and it was morning one day.

Try to see what I mean here: This can be calculated but its much easier on a globe with lattitude and longitude lines and a tilted axis with a ruler on it for how it spins.

It takes 2160 x 12 years for the axis to revolve around the top of the earth, and the tilt is 23.4 degrees. Each of those 2160 years can be considered a day, because it passes through one constellation of the 12 zodiac constellations.

2160 years is enough, and if you have a globe please use it because I didn't want to calculate, but 2160 years is enough to bring a part of the globe seeing day half the year to 16 hours a days, and vice versa. That's a nice 3/3 to 2/3 and then for another part 2/3 to 3/3, so if our creators were testing the light, that would be a good time frame for them to do it, do you think?

 

[robocop (actually)]

(that would be dividing the light from the darkness and also this is my opinion)

 

[Ben Dhyan]

(that would be dividing the light from the darkness and also this is my opinion)

I don't know about that robocop...but this precession is the cause of alternate ice age and interglacial periods due to receiving less or more solar radiation on the Earth's surface.

Fwiw...over the last 500,000 years, there has been 5 interglacial warm periods of about 15,000 years duration separated by ice age of about 115,000 years period. We are now about 11,000 years of interglacial warmth so the next ice age may begin relatively soon. And with the less solar radiation, it will not be possible to grow enough food to feed 7 billion plus humans....but that's a problem for the future.

[youtube]CUZOXczMfMo[/youtube]

 

[robocop (actually)]

Dear ben d and others,
I think farmers can always innovate to help feed everyone, but there are evil systems involved that take advantage of this, and yet still many people are starving because they cannot afford food. Jesus said there would always be poor right? Hopefully not.
Now about these glacial and interglacial periods.

If they were measured underground they are accurate temperature records so I don’t see the reason our creators would have had to show up except way late in the game since they can just see the temperature records for themselves. Since the earth was covered with water, I think they only needed to measure the heat reflecting off of it. Dinosaurs could have been around in past generations, and they could have even cloned them in our day.

If they were measured above ground, why the gaps and sudden spurts in fossil history? Rather, they created life recently, but kept having to nuke it entirely to get a new ecology that was stable. This would lead to a very long measurement, as well as peeking up and not peeking down.

So a day couldn’t be a day if the creators weren’t there.
Now about this data and precession.
NOAA Paleoclimatology Program - Perspective on Abrupt climate Change says it took 5 complete precessions to make a cycle; what does 5 precessions have to do with anything (even if it is accurate)? Plus the cycles are all different lengths in your graph. These don’t correspond to switching North and South poles and have nothing to do with a day.

But I like entertaining the idea that the days of creation are much longer than 2160 years. The mind is bewildered by this!

 

[NewGuyOnTheBlock]

I am an avid Star Trek/Star Wars fan and enjoy hypothesizing about life on other planets. It is pretty much a statistical impossibility that we are the only intelligent life in our galaxy, and improbable that we are the only "advanced" life. A civilization that has been around longer than us, it only stands to reason that they would progress further; and while I see interstellar travel and improbability, I don't see it as an impossibility.

Even to the most skeptical of minds, mine included, there are many reports of many sightings that are hard to explain. Japan Air Lines Flight 1628 is quite compelling. There are lots of unexplained phenomenon, and I feel it is way too early in the game to simply dismiss extraterrestrial visitation from the phenomenon. However, many of the so-called sightings are easily explained as meteorological or man made in nature. While the most rational answer is not always the right answer, well, usually it is. So, my standard of what is "compelling" is pretty high; but I still find that certain reports meet that criteria.



HOWEVER, Here are the problems I have with your ... (Doctrine? Belief? Theory? Idea?)

You have done more than "be open" to the "possibility". You have accepted this possibility as truth and have done so on inadequate evidence. Not only have you accepted a possibility as truth, you have devoted your life to it. And, not only have you devoted your life to it, you have (by the meaning of your holy symbol) given them a benevolent character. So, something that could be true is already true, devoted your life to an unproven possibility, and you have attributed a benevolent character to that mere possibility.

Oh, don't call what you are doing "science". It is not science. Science is a methodology of thinking. For anything to fit the definition of a "theory", it must be Testable, Observable, Repeatable, Falsifiable and must form a predictive model of reality. The Alien theory meets not ONE of those criteria. Moreover, scientific discovery starts with a question, then follows the trail of evidence in order to try to answer that question. What is going on here, however, is we have determined the outcome then sought a trail of evidence to validate that presumed outcome. Completely opposite of what Science is and how science works.

Yours is a tantalizing and fun idea; but an idea is all that it is.

Unless requested or given "permission", if you will, I will not post further; but I felt I needed to say something.

Take care!

 

[Ben Dhyan]

Now about this data and precession.
NOAA Paleoclimatology Program - Perspective on Abrupt climate Change says it took 5 complete precessions to make a cycle; what does 5 precessions have to do with anything (even if it is accurate)?

Plus the cycles are all different lengths in your graph.

I can't find any reference on the NOAA site that talks about 5 precessions to make a cycle?

Concerning the different lengths of ice ages and interglacials...this is due to the precession and earth orbital cycles....these cycles are known as the Milankovitch cycles...read up on it here...Milankovitch cycles - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia