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Techelet: Beyond Yin & Yang.

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member



The emblem yin & yang symbolizes the quasi-theological unity that exists between all polar oppositions (male/female, light/dark, good/evil, etc.). Within the philosophical realm of yin & yang, the highest order is the establishment of a perfect balance between polar oppositions.

In the Judeo/Christian philosophical genre, yin & yang circumscribe merely a "natural" balance between polar opposites. Yin & yang are merely the summum bonum of the natural world. Judeo/Christianity posits a higher order. A spiritual order. And the symbol that transcends yin & yang is the color purple known as "techelet."

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John
 
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Jumi

Well-Known Member
The emblem yin & yang symbolizes the quasi-theological unity that exists between all polar oppositions (male/female, light/dark, good/evil, etc.). Within the philosophical realm of yin & yang, the highest order is the establishment of a perfect balance between polar oppositions.
What is your source, that yin and yang being perfectly balanced is "the highest order"? In Chinese philosophy wuji is beyond the more modern taijitu-symbol, sometimes placed in the center of other yin-yang symbols or the taijitu.
 

Tumah

Veteran Member
What is your source, that yin and yang being perfectly balanced is "the highest order"? In Chinese philosophy wuji is beyond the more modern taijitu-symbol, sometimes placed in the center of other yin-yang symbols or the taijitu.
It's not even worth it. The OP has a penchant for sticking in his own interpretations and interpolations into texts and statements. He's just a Christian who likes to re-interpret Jewish texts to be about Jesus.
 

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
It's not even worth it. The OP has a penchant for sticking in his own interpretations and interpolations into texts and statements. He's just a Christian who likes to re-interpret Jewish texts to be about Jesus.
Reminds me of the von dankien types chariots of the gods phenomenona in the 70's. They would take ancient times hyrogliphs and they all pointed to aliens visiting the Egyptians . I could never figure out if they were complete idiots, or a crop circle charade. It was
prophet_able for von dankien though , 25 books worth.
 

David T

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Yes Indeed there is a higher reality the documentary matrix showed us that to be true!!! Now that some in science are getting on board with living in a simulated reality the realization that this today is the state of awareness of many in church,(southern baptists) there should be a revival of scientists flocking to church!!!
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JESUS!!! I SEE JESUS!!! SO SAID THOMAS!!!
 

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
What is your source, that yin and yang being perfectly balanced is "the highest order"? In Chinese philosophy wuji is beyond the more modern taijitu-symbol, sometimes placed in the center of other yin-yang symbols or the taijitu.

Naturally I'm speaking is generalities. Although to the extent that it doesn't distract from the topic of the thread I'm willing to go into whatever specificity you like about how eastern mysticism relates to the topic at hand.

The basic idea of the thread revolves around the concept of the duality inherent in the natural world, light/dark, male/female, good/evil, life/death, law/spirit, Jew/Gentile, as opposed to a spiritual order that transcends all natural duality. Naturalistic theologies and philosophies attempt to establish harmony between natural polar oppositions without destroying the balance between the two elements creating the polarity.

For instance, a naturalistic Judaism seeks harmony between Jew and Gentile without destroying the fabric of their difference (i.e., the law of shatnez, forbidding the direct mixture of unlike properties). Pharisaical Judaism seeks a unity that doesn't dissolves the very difference that gives the terms ("Jew" and "Gentile") their meaning. Likewise, naturalistic Judaism seeks a unity between male and female that doesn't dissolve, or eliminate, the biological difference that gives male and female their identity. St. Paul is reckoned the archenemy of naturalistic (Pharisaical) Judaism for his revelation that in a truly spiritual order there's neither Jew nor Gentile, male nor female. In one of his most cryptic statements he encourages the natural born Jew to go all the way and cut through to the bone of the truth coiled around the crux of the symbolism inherent in the founding ritual.

Which is to say that in the naturalistic form of Pharisaical Judaism the very ritual upon which
Judaism is founded, ritualistic emasculation under the chuppah (creating the "hatan"), fails to eliminate the mediator between male and female, which, the mediator, is the very flesh the Jewish sage admits is the natural distinction between male and female. The founding ritual ritualistically removes the "flesh" that creates the distinction between male and female without going all the way, ala St. Paul, in which case there would be no fleshly distinction between bridegroom (hatan) and bride.

But St. Paul goes further than that. In other places he implies that rather than "going all the way" under the chuppah (instead of in the bedroom), the natural-born Jew creates a meme (the scar that should represent emasculation) which becomes the natural distinction between Jew and Gentile. With one slip of the scribe's and the mohel's wrist, the blade that should create a new spiritual order free of the distinctions between male and female, Jew and Gentile, instead creates a mark that contrary to dissolving the distinctions (male/female, Jew/Gentile), actually magnifies the differences to the point that women are separated from men in the synagogue and marked flesh is not allowed to enter into the flesh of those not naturally born from flesh so marked.

The very cutting that should eliminate the distinction between male and female, Jew and Gentile, has become the "mark" (of circumcision) that glorifies the distinctions as though the glory of the natural world order is merely the proper balance between male and female, Jew and Gentile, and not, as St. Paul implied, the complete and total obliteration of such disunity.


John
 
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John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
Pretty standard Christian, then.

The new Blade Runner movie is an apt metaphor for Tumah's complaint. The central motif of the movie is the replicant's desire to come up with a way to procreate rather than merely replicating.

The Jewish scribe replicates the Torah scroll. He adds not a jot or a tittle to the string of consonants. He's a replicant who replicates the scroll. Likewise, the orthodox Jew practices what Professor Handelman calls a "weak exegesis" on the scroll: one that doesn't try to go all the way, i.e., create a new reading that unifies all the various threads of the scroll into something completely new. The natural-born Jew is disallowed from binding together threads of the Tanakh that represent distinct elements, male/female, Jew/Gentile, God/man. He stops short of any exegesis or interpretation that would go beyond the traditional reading of the text.

In the movie, the replicants realize what's taking an awful long time for modern Jews to realize: living things have souls. If the Torah text is to come alive, it must have a soul. And to have a soul, it must be capable of not just replicating, repeating the Masoretic reading over and over again, ad nauseaum, but it must be able to procreate.

To procreate (as opposed to replicating, ala modern Judaism) the Torah text must be engaged by an interpreter willing and able to go all the way under the chuppah. Only then can a virgin interpretation of the Torah text occur such that when it does, it should fully expect the same treatment at the hands of the replicants, and the replicators, that any virgin born thing can expect in the presence of those who see replicators and replicants as the "chosen ones" ----chosen at the factory no doubt, i.e., natural birth as opposed to a new birth ----perfected at the factory, born fine the first time, no rebirth required, soulless but perfect, so far as textual fidelity is concerned.

There's a new Torah. It wasn't made at the factory. It doesn't seek textual fidelity, perfect replication. . . It's a horror to replicants. -----It's Alive! ------It's a living Torah. It changes moment by moment. It doesn't replicate. The consonantal perfection of the scribe, even the replicating nature of in -born DNA, is absent. It's truly living. The Spirit moves it moment by moment. It's an abomination to replicants and replicators.

Why does this voice arise? One reason is surely the perceived need to understand and explain the Written Torah. But then the Oral Torah would only be a series of glosses and meager annotations. So something "more" must occasion this massive achievement. Put theologically, I would say that this "something more" is God's illimitable investiture of Being, the far-flung vastness of divine effectivity, pressing upon human consciousness on a daily basis. This divine reality precedes the Written Torah, as said earlier, and may be designated as the torah kelulah, the Torah of All-in-All--- an infinite enfoldment of all that could ever be in our world.

Professor Michael Fishbane, Sacred Attunement, p. 60-61.​


John
 
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Jumi

Well-Known Member
Naturally I'm speaking is generalities. Although to the extent that it doesn't distract from the topic of the thread I'm willing to go into whatever specificity you like about how eastern mysticism relates to the topic at hand.
I don't know how it could, to be honest, since the view presented on yin-yang isn't the one of Chinese mystics. Case in point: an aim of many "mystical oriented" schools present in China is to reach the pure yang.

I'm unsure of the Jewish mystical ideas, but know that they have deep concepts that are relatable to similar concepts in Chinese mysticism. My comments were merely on the use of the taiji-symbol in the posting, they don't really match with the eastern views.
 

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
I don't know how it could, to be honest, since the view presented on yin-yang isn't the one of Chinese mystics. Case in point: an aim of many "mystical oriented" schools present in China is to reach the pure yang.

I'm unsure of the Jewish mystical ideas, but know that they have deep concepts that are relatable to similar concepts in Chinese mysticism. My comments were merely on the use of the taiji-symbol in the posting, they don't really match with the eastern views.

Naturally we start out with generalizations. In a general sense the symbol posted in the first message represents a balance of light and dark.

You point out that this doesn't match with eastern views as you understand them so the onus is on you to at least generalize those eastern views as you understand them; specifically why do they not really match what is generalized in the first message? ---- Why does the symbol (in the first message) not represent, generally speaking, the balance between light and dark?


John
 

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
What is your source, that yin and yang being perfectly balanced is "the highest order"? In Chinese philosophy wuji is beyond the more modern taijitu-symbol, sometimes placed in the center of other yin-yang symbols or the taijitu.

Because the thread is more about techelet than eastern mysticism, yin & yang is merely being generalized:

In Chinese philosophy, yin and yang ( yīnyáng, lit. "dark-bright", "negative-positive") describe how seemingly opposite or contrary forces may actually be complementary, interconnected, and interdependent in the natural world, and how they may give rise to each other as they interrelate to one another. Many tangible dualities (such as light and dark, fire and water, expanding and contracting) are thought of as physical manifestations of the duality symbolized by yin and yang.

. . .Duality is found in many belief systems, but Yin and Yang are parts of a Oneness that is also equated with the Tao. The term 'dualistic-monism' or dialectical monism has been coined in an attempt to express this fruitful paradox of simultaneous unity/duality. Yin and yang can be thought of as complementary (rather than opposing) forces that interact to form a dynamic system in which the whole is greater than the assembled parts.[2] Everything has both yin and yang aspects (for instance, shadow cannot exist without light). Either of the two major aspects may manifest more strongly in a particular object, depending on the criterion of the observation. The yin yang (i.e. taijitu symbol) shows a balance between two opposites with a portion of the opposite element in each section.

Wikipedia.​

Techelet goes beyond "dualistic-monism." It posits a unity that annihilates, obliterates, the former duality. Techelet doesn't balance the dualism. It obliterates the former dualism in a Oneness that dissolves the former dualism into a unity with no remnant of either of the former poles.


John
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
You point out that this doesn't match with eastern views as you understand them so the onus is on you to at least generalize those eastern views as you understand them; specifically why do they not really match what is generalized in the first message?
It's not the a kind of "highest order".

---- Why does the symbol (in the first message) not represent, generally speaking, the balance between light and dark?
Because such things are not the domain of that philosophy. The symbol represents compliments of an underlying continuity. The balances change with the object being observed, but you can always find the center of gravity or center of mass.


. . .Duality is found in many belief systems, but Yin and Yang are parts of a Oneness that is also equated with the Tao. The term 'dualistic-monism' or dialectical monism has been coined in an attempt to express this fruitful paradox of simultaneous unity/duality. Yin and yang can be thought of as complementary (rather than opposing) forces that interact to form a dynamic system in which the whole is greater than the assembled parts.​

Techelet goes beyond "dualistic-monism." It posits a unity that annihilates, obliterates, the former duality. Techelet doesn't balance the dualism. It obliterates the former dualism in a Oneness that dissolves the former dualism into a unity with no remnant of either of the former poles.
How would this differ from the wuji from which yin and yang are thought to descend in Chinese philosophy? Or the perfect yang which the mystic strives for without yin(except it's not annihilation as you propose).
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
If we have a rotating disk, as a whole the center is most yin and the outermost part is yang. If we examine the outermost part the edge is yang and the part closer to the center is yin. If we examine the center, the center of the center is yin but it's edge is yang.

As far as I know, Christianity has nothing like this idea. It's a different philosophy than say God versus Satan, light against dark.
 

John D. Brey

Well-Known Member
How would this differ from the wuji from which yin and yang are thought to descend in Chinese philosophy? Or the perfect yang which the mystic strives for without yin(except it's not annihilation as you propose).

Undoubtedly there are near parallels between most of the standard Jewish concepts and those of eastern mysticism. For instance, prior to the Fall into samsara (the cycle of death and procreation, or rebirth) Adam is neither male nor female; thus neither yang (male) nor yin (female).

Only after the creation of gender (Gen. 2:21) is Adam exiled from Eden. Only then does yin & yang come into existence. It comes into existence in the Fall into samsara. ----Prior to the Fall, Adam represents a higher order than yin & yang. Eden itself is a place different from samsara. It (Eden) too transcends yin & yang.

Nevertheless, Techelet posits a realm beyond Eden, and a New Man greater than prelapsarian Adam.

The founding ritual of Judaism, brit milah (ritual emasculation) pictures a return to Eden and prelapse Adam. Brit milah pictures the removal of the flesh that made the Fall into samsara possible. The flesh added to Adam's body in Genesis 2:21 at the same time the first woman was manufactured. By ritually removing the sign of gender, the male flesh, brit milah returns the Jew to the status of prelapse Adam. The Jew is then (after brit milah) neither male nor female since in the founding ritual (brit milah) the flesh that represents that distinction is symbolically removed.

Traditional (Pharisaical) Judaism posits merely a return to Eden, a return to prelapse Adam, and thus a transcending of yin & yang that returns mankind to Eden.

Nevertheless, techelet teaches something different. It speak of a New Man who doesn't merely return to the state of mankind prior to the Fall into samsara. It speaks of a process that allows the New Man to retain the knowledge of good and evil he gained during his journey in samsara (his Fall from the gracious life in Eden) such that the very thing that Eve sought, to be like the most high God (through the fruit of the knowledge of good and evil) the New Man actually attains.

Techelet teaches of a heavenly Israel, a divine Jew, and a New Man, whose existence is the primary purpose of existence itself; a New Man who shatters the distinction not just between male and female, between prelapse Eden and earth, yin & yang, but between God and man.

The New man, who's cloaked in techelet, achieves what Eve sought in the first place; the knowledge of good and evil (received by means of the successful journey through samsara) but also the overcoming of the power of samsara, which is the power of death.

Prelapse Adam had no power over death. His life was subject to principalities and powers, such as the serpent, who he had no knowledge or power to control. ----- Likewise, the circumcised Jew receives the right to return to Eden, but not to overcome death itself, or the principalities and powers who control death.

The New Man, garmented in techelet, has power over the principalities and powers. He's no longer subject to death. He's stronger than death. He's triumphed over death.


John
 

Jumi

Well-Known Member
Undoubtedly there are near parallels between most of the standard Jewish concepts and those of eastern mysticism. For instance, prior to the Fall into samsara (the cycle of death and procreation, or rebirth) Adam is neither male nor female; thus neither yang (male) nor yin (female).
Yin and yang are not gender. So in yin-yang philosophy people who have neither sex or both still have both yin and yang, like all men and women. Even the most feminine of women has yang and most masculine of men, yin. Adam, in your philosophy, was he with body or a spirit? If he had a body he had yin and yang.

Only after the creation of gender (Gen. 2:21) is Adam exiled from Eden. Only then does yin & yang come into existence. It comes into existence in the Fall into samsara. ----Prior to the Fall, Adam represents a higher order than yin & yang. Eden itself is a place different from samsara. It (Eden) too transcends yin & yang.
This sounds symbolic. Samsara is more Buddhist, it's better to use Wuji or the Dao when talking about yin-yang as these both transcend it.

The founding ritual of Judaism, brit milah (ritual emasculation) pictures a return to Eden and prelapse Adam. Brit milah pictures the removal of the flesh that made the Fall into samsara possible. The flesh added to Adam's body in Genesis 2:21 at the same time the first woman was manufactured. By ritually removing the sign of gender, the male flesh, brit milah returns the Jew to the status of prelapse Adam. The Jew is then (after brit milah) neither male nor female since in the founding ritual (brit milah) the flesh that represents that distinction is symbolically removed.
This would be something that is not found in the Chinese, since removing masculine parts doesn't make a person pure yin.

The New Man, garmented in techelet, has power over the principalities and powers. He's no longer subject to death. He's stronger than death. He's triumphed over death.
This sounds like something Chinese mystics speculate about when talking about pure yang, but I assume it's a different idea like the basis you've presented is different.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me



The emblem yin & yang symbolizes the quasi-theological unity that exists between all polar oppositions (male/female, light/dark, good/evil, etc.). Within the philosophical realm of yin & yang, the highest order is the establishment of a perfect balance between polar oppositions.

In the Judeo/Christian philosophical genre, yin & yang circumscribe merely a "natural" balance between polar opposites. Yin & yang are merely the summum bonum of the natural world. Judeo/Christianity posits a higher order. A spiritual order. And the symbol that transcends yin & yang is the color purple known as "techelet."

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John

I believe balance is a purely materialistic view.
 

Rival

se Dex me saut.
Staff member
Premium Member
I believe it is premature to declare someone Christian who has not declared himself to be one. But maybe you know something from another thread.

.
The only ignorance of reality here is the Christian ignorance of the reality that Jesus fits none of the messianic prophecies in Tanach.
 
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