Supreme Court has banned abortions

[Wildswanderer]

If the person is mentally incapable of breathing….
Mentally incapable of maintaining a steady heartbeat….
mentally incapable of knowing even if they exist or ever existed….
Could only live by being hooked up to a set of machines, and had no outlook to ever come off those machines….then yes. You really would be morally obliged to let them go, rather than forcing them to “live” on like that.

If you want to kill them, you need to be put in jail or executed.
If you feel morally obliged or otherwise to kill someone just because they’re a little “slow”, then you need to be “removed”.
The level of incapability that we’re talking about here is a complete lack of a functional brain, and no stored memories from a life ever lived, and not just some coma that they might “snap out of”, but rather no recovery is possible. Think Terry Schiavo. Only the deluded and emotional more distant wanted to keep her hooked up. Her loving husband knew that even if she regained consciousness, she would not want to “live” on as a vegetable, so he demanded that they disconnect her from life support.


Now then. If you want to argue that the pregnant woman should have the same rights as life support machinery, or plant grow lights, and therefore she should be forced to maintain “life” signs until the fetus is capable of survival after disconnection…..that argument could be made. As long as you have a completely funded, and maintained receptacle for all of the freshly disconnected fetuses; including raising these youngsters with good food, a good education, and unabashedly loving households, through to the ages of adulthood with no exceptions, now and for all time. AND you’re willing to argue that women’s bodies are machines, belonging to the state, with no inherent rights of their own. OK. Go ahead and make that argument to your senator or congress-person, and DEMAND that they put forward a bill to that effect. TODAY, and every day from this date onward, until it passes unanimously.

Until then, allow US citizens freedom of choice. Eh?

Not comparable, and by the way Terri Schiavo should have not been killed. She wasn't hooked up to a machine to keep her alive, only for feeding. She could have regained consciousness.

But we know that fetus will continue to develop, unlike a person in a coma that could go either way.

 

[SkepticThinker]

Antibiotics have nothing to do with what the pill is, that is etinilestradiol plus drospirenone .
The effectiveness of the pill taken regularly and without flaws is more than 99%
Source: How effective is contraception at preventing pregnancy?.


If a woman gets pregnant, despite taking the pill regularly, well..it means that her husband or boyfriend has an extraordinarily high male fertility and an extraordinary prowess.

Not quite ...

"To date, the only antibiotic proven to impact birth control pills is rifampin. This drug is used to treat tuberculosis and other bacterial infections. If you take this medication while using birth control pills, it decreases the hormone levels in your birth control pills. This decrease in hormone levels can affect whether ovulation is prevented. In other words, your birth control becomes less effective. Rifampin also decreases hormone levels in the birth control patch and vaginal ring. ...

... Other drugs may make birth control less effective, such as:

• some anti-HIV protease inhibitors
• some anti-seizure medications
• the antifungal drug griseofulvin

Birth control pills may make other drugs less effective, such as analgesics and blood pressure medications. The effects of antidepressants, bronchodilators, and tranquilizers may be increased when you use them with birth control pills."



Can Antibiotics Affect Your Birth Control?

 

[SkepticThinker]

Then, why can't she kill her toddler too?
It's her choice.
Or not, because there's another person involved who doesn't get a vote.

You already know the answer to that, given that you've tried this line several times and have been rebutted several times.

 

[Windwalker]

And again that's your opinion.

So what is that supposed to mean? That it's not an opinion any more valid that yours? That's nonsense. It is a valid, well-informed, and better argued opinion than yours. That's how this works. It's kind of common sense. Read this article to enlighten your thinking here:

No, you're not entitled to your opinion

"You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to what you can argue for.”​

Just because someone can remove a splinter that doesn't make them a surgeon.

But if they can make a better case for their argument, it does make their views more valid than yours, where you cannot support your own arguments with reason, but instead resort to facepalms and handwavings, as if that somehow bolsters your argument. It doesn't. It only confirms you have lost your argument when you resort to that. It says to everyone reading, that you've lost anything valid to say. The end.

 

[We Never Know]

So what is that supposed to mean? That it's not an opinion any more valid that yours? That's nonsense. It is a valid, well-informed, and better argued opinion than yours. That's how this works. It's kind of common sense. Read this article to enlighten your thinking here:

No, you're not entitled to your opinion

"You are not entitled to your opinion. You are only entitled to what you can argue for.”​

But if they can make a better case for their argument, it does make their views more valid than yours, where you cannot support your own arguments with reason, but instead resort to facepalms and handwavings, as if that somehow bolsters your argument. It doesn't. It only confirms you have lost your argument when you resort to that. It says to everyone reading, that you've lost anything valid to say. The end.

Here's your argument in a nutshell..

I know I can get pregnant by having sex
I don't care I'm going to have sex anyway
Oh crap I got pregnant
Oh well I will just get an abortion.

And repeat.

 

[crossfire]

So I should be able to legally kill someone born mentally incapable?

Not after they are born.

 

[Wildswanderer]

Not after they are born.

What's the difference? They are alive before they are born also. They are human before and after birth.

 

[Wildswanderer]

You already know the answer to that, given that you've tried this line several times and have been rebutted several times.

The answer is, he's a human deserving of life both before and after being born.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Not comparable, and by the way Terri Schiavo should have not been killed. She wasn't hooked up to a machine to keep her alive, only for feeding. She could have regained consciousness.

But we know that fetus will continue to develop, unlike a person in a coma that could go either way.

No, Teri was long gone:

Terri Schiavo case - Wikipedia

Sometimes it is very hard to do the right thing.

And a fetus is in the position of never being conscious in the first place. It is a poor analogy to compare the two.

 

[Subduction Zone]

What's the difference? They are alive before they are born also. They are human before and after birth.

But not a person.

 

[Subduction Zone]

What's the difference? They are alive before they are born also. They are human before and after birth.

But not a person.

 

[crossfire]

What's the difference? They are alive before they are born also. They are human before and after birth.

The difference is being dependent on someone else's body before they are born, and not being dependent on someone else's body after they are born.

 

[Wildswanderer]

The difference is being dependent on someone else's body before they are born, and not being dependent on someone else's body after they are born.

Really? Someone who is in special needs care for their whole life is certainly dependent upon somebody else's body continually. And why should that matter anyway? They are still unique humans before being born.

 

[Wildswanderer]

But not a person.

Nonsense. Babies have been born only 21 weeks old and survived. They sure look like people to me.

 

[Wildswanderer]

No, Teri was long gone:

Terri Schiavo case - Wikipedia

Sometimes it is very hard to do the right thing.

And a fetus is in the position of never being conscious in the first place. It is a poor analogy to compare the two.

They let the woman starve to death... nothing humane about that. And people have come out of that state before.

 

[Wildswanderer]

No, Teri was long gone:

Terri Schiavo case - Wikipedia

Sometimes it is very hard to do the right thing.

And a fetus is in the position of never being conscious in the first place. It is a poor analogy to compare the two.

Also thousands of sentient fetuses are killed every year.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Nonsense. Babies have been born only 21 weeks old and survived. They sure look like people to me.

That is not true. You might want to recheck your sources, and I am fairly sure that you did not see such a thing.

At any rate it has been explained to you endlessly why they are not a person until after they are born. And until you refute those explanations I will continually remind you that it is not a person. Not even according to the Bible.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Also thousands of sentient fetuses are killed every year.

They are? How are you going to prove that?

 

[Subduction Zone]

They let the woman starve to death... nothing humane about that. And people have come out of that state before.

Show me one. You need to show that a person that had massive brain damage, a brain that had no EEG activity came back from a vegetative state.

The brain on the right was Teri's. The one on the left shows a normal brain. The dark areas are liquid. It looks like Teri's brain was all but nonexistent by the time they pulled her feeding tube.

I had to be part of the same sort of decision for my father. He did have a living will, but he had an accident. He did survive, but he had severe brain damage as a result. Since it was violated the family could have decided to insert a feeding tube when he could no longer swallow. But we decided to follow his original wishes and let nature take its course. He did not want to be hooked up to all sorts of life support. It was very sad to see him continually lose abilities over ten years. I supplemented his care at a nursing home and often asked him if he was happy and while he could he usually answered yes. I can understand why Michael Schiavo fought for his wife's right to die. And I can understand why her parents opposed it. From personal experience I can see that Michael was right.

 

[Windwalker]

Here's your argument in a nutshell..

I know I can get pregnant by having sex
I don't care I'm going to have sex anyway
Oh crap I got pregnant
Oh well I will just get an abortion.

And repeat.

That it not my argument. That is your complete misrepresentation of the facts of reality in order to justify your biases.

Here's the real reality.

Your claims in red. Reality in green:

I know I can get pregnant by having sex

"I know sex can get you pregnant, but I'll take the same sensible precautions as I do in any human activity, such as driving a car, or looking both ways before crossing the street. I'm not going to live in utter fear that an accident might happen, so I'll never leave my house or have sex with anyone. I am a human, after all!

Not having sex because I might get pregnant is silly! Are these people who say this unaware that married couples don't just have sex to make babies, and that if they don't want babies they shouldn't have sex??? That's absolutely laughable, or course!"

I don't care I'm going to have sex anyway

"Of course I care, but I'm not going to quit living and hide in corner because an accident might happen. It's no different than being afraid to not drive a car, because I might have an accident either. While that is a choice for some people, to never do anything "just in case", I don't consider that a healthy way to be a human being.

Having responsible sex is a risk, even in marriage that an unwanted pregnancy may happen. Are couples to not have sex at all, unless they are willing to take on the responsibility of having a baby? I don't buy that as reality. Whoever says this is living in a fantasy reality that no normal human could live in, themselves included."

Oh crap I got pregnant

"Oh crap we got pregnant. That's what neither of us wanted, nor can afford! We tried our best, but still accidents happen. Now what? We can't have another kid! We don't have the means to support them, and that wouldn't be responsible to bring another child into the world! We might have to seek an abortion, because we can't be so selfish as to bring a child into the world we can't look after."

Oh well I will just get an abortion.

"We would never treat this so cavilarily as to say "oh well, let's just get an abortion". It's a big deal, and no couple would ever take such a decision so lightly. Whoever would suggest this, isn't living in reality. End of story".