1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Support for creationism in US at all time low

Discussion in 'Evolution Vs. Creationism' started by Jose Fly, Aug 2, 2017.

  1. Jose Fly

    Jose Fly Fisker of men

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,505
    Ratings:
    +2,820
    I never thought of it that way. Wonderful insight.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Jose Fly

    Jose Fly Fisker of men

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,505
    Ratings:
    +2,820
    When writing a book of religion, it's not exactly going out on a limb to predict "Someday, people will stop believing all this stuff". The history of religions show it's inevitable.
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  3. Jose Fly

    Jose Fly Fisker of men

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,505
    Ratings:
    +2,820
    If any of that is true, one has to wonder.......why then do Christian creationists spend so much time and effort trying to counteract this prophesy? If "the end" is inevitable and is going to be peaches and cream for you and eventually all humanity, why not hasten it?
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  4. Bob the Unbeliever

    Bob the Unbeliever Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 19, 2017
    Messages:
    4,496
    Ratings:
    +2,653
    Religion:
    unbeliever
    Or someone deep into hallucinogenic drugs, such as mushrooms or some bad rye bread.

    Authors who wrote while on LSD are not nearly as weird as "revelations"...
     
  5. Deeje

    Deeje Deeje
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    8,251
    Ratings:
    +4,138
    Religion:
    Christian JW
    "The ark was 300 cubits long, 50 cubits wide, and 30 cubits high (133.5 m × 22.3 m × 13.4 m; 437 ft 6 in. × 72 ft 11 in. × 43 ft 9 in.). It could have had about 0.9 ha (2.2 acres) of floor space. The three floors plus the wide roof span probably required, in addition to the ‘compartment’ divisions, the use of some wooden columns and beams to support the weight, as well as to give the structure necessary stability. Although the ark was caulked with tar, there would also be need for careful fitting of the timbers to ensure a reasonably watertight construction.—Genesis 6:13-16 "

    So, you see there was enough room for many more people. The whole top floor was for the humans. Considering it was about the size of the Queen Mary, there was plenty of room for more passengers.....but no one wanted a ticket. [​IMG]

    No, actually, its more like a turnstile....one precious life at a time. Each one a fully qualified minister educated in the word of God and able to become a teacher of others. We believe that is the way Jesus approached his ministry. [​IMG]
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  6. Deeje

    Deeje Deeje
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    8,251
    Ratings:
    +4,138
    Religion:
    Christian JW
    That is true to an extent....prophesy is only fully discernible in all its features with the benefit of hindsight. But Jesus said to "keep on the watch", (Matthew 24:32-34; 42-44) and he also said to look for the 'sign' (a series of events) he said would identify this period he called the "end of the age" and associated with his return. (Matthew 24:3-14) I believe the signs are all there and have been unfolding gradually over the last 100 years....only a couple of things are yet to take place. I see this as happening according to God's timing of events, not ours.
     
    #66 Deeje, Aug 3, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2017
  7. blü 2

    blü 2 Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2017
    Messages:
    3,598
    Ratings:
    +2,121
    Religion:
    Skeptical
    Don't forget that it also had to carry enough food to feed each set of animals FOR A YEAR.

    That's a LOT of chaff and biltong. The elephants alone will be on starvation rations at 90 kg a day each (total 66 tonnes pa. and without modern compression and stacking that's an awful lot of volume). And don't I recall that all the dinosaurs had to be enarked as well?
     
    #67 blü 2, Aug 3, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 3, 2017
    • Winner Winner x 1
  8. Jose Fly

    Jose Fly Fisker of men

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,505
    Ratings:
    +2,820
    That's the fascinating thing about the whole flood story......you can pick any number of subjects to debunk it. The size of the boat, the number of animals, the care of the animals, the fate of organisms that weren't aboard, diseases, parasites, the lack of geological evidence, the geological evidence that contradicts it, the source of the water, the location of the water now, the lack of genetic evidence, and on and on and on.

    Simply put, young-earth floodism is about on par with flat-earth geocentrism on the absurdity scale.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  9. DavidFirth

    DavidFirth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2017
    Messages:
    6,816
    Ratings:
    +1,320
    Religion:
    Christian
    The Apostles prophesied a lot more than that and that isn't even accurate. Most people won't believe it, not all people.

    What about the prophecy concerning Israel becoming a nation again never to be conquered again? Egypt, Syria, Lebanon and Jordan have all fallen short. They got whipped in 6 days one time.

    But I guess those were just lucky picks. :rolleyes:
     
    • Funny Funny x 2
  10. Jose Fly

    Jose Fly Fisker of men

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,505
    Ratings:
    +2,820
    Again, not exactly going out on a limb to predict that as time goes on, fewer people will believe.

    Gee, a Jewish book where Jews predict that one day they will have a country again. Who would of thunk?
     
    • Like Like x 2
  11. DavidFirth

    DavidFirth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2017
    Messages:
    6,816
    Ratings:
    +1,320
    Religion:
    Christian
    It's just blind luck that all of their neighbors attacked them at the same time and Israel stomped them in 6 days. Sure it is.
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  12. Jose Fly

    Jose Fly Fisker of men

    Joined:
    Oct 13, 2007
    Messages:
    4,505
    Ratings:
    +2,820
    Um..........ok.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. DavidFirth

    DavidFirth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2017
    Messages:
    6,816
    Ratings:
    +1,320
    Religion:
    Christian
    If you say so.
     
  14. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    14,574
    Ratings:
    +7,142
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Maybe dino steaks were used to feed the tigers, and that's actually why they ended up extinct?

    'Hey, honey, we're all out of Triceratops burgers. You okay if I kill off the T-Rex? It will help the smell...'
     
    • Winner Winner x 1
  15. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    14,574
    Ratings:
    +7,142
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Luck had nothing to do with it.
    Read the actual military history. It's fascinating. Pre-emptive action and the disorganization and complacency of it's neighbours were what led to victory. Not luck.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  16. DavidFirth

    DavidFirth Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 11, 2017
    Messages:
    6,816
    Ratings:
    +1,320
    Religion:
    Christian
    It couldn't possibly have been God, I guess. Wait a minute, maybe it could have...
     
    • Funny Funny x 1
  17. Grandliseur

    Grandliseur Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 1, 2008
    Messages:
    2,236
    Ratings:
    +576
    Religion:
    Pragmatic Christian
    You need to have the perspective of the whole, and also of the individual - to understand what is going on, for you and for the world. The two do not carry the same message.
    Individually
    Each Christian has the responsibility to live a holy life in Christ avoiding adultery, fornication, and what not. (as if this generally happens) This is what our judgment gets based on. In this then you have a lot of misbehavior by even clergy in sexual misdeeds. Obviously, in the Christian teachings (Bible, not church) a lot of these people are going to be damned, though their churches sweep it under the carpet and tell them they are forgiven. While our salvation doesn't depend on works of the Mosaic Law, it does depend on works of faith, good works, and purity in Christ.

    The world, and this question
    The study is large and very interesting. There are prophecies regarding Babylon, and Babylon the Great. We see how the world that counted in this context since Christ - was Europe. The Roman empire spread its tentacles all the way up north, only to be replaced slowly by splinter nations and, most importantly, by the now not so spiritual Christian powers of Rome. Powers that even supplanted the pagan religions of the Vikings and those on the British Isles, Russia, the works.

    The Pope became a secular power that ruled even kings. The power of the church at some point might nearly be said to be complete and total during some time of the ascend into our present time.
    Totalitarian impossibility
    In this state of affairs where the church's power reached all the way to kings and to paupers in their homes making them go to church or else (look at how in Europe, in nearly every village of every country, Scandinavia & everywhere, a church stands guard). Under such power, the churches, even having changed with the Protestants, could suffer no attack from anywhere since they were the de-facto power in all of Europe.
    the prophecy of waters
    Here the prophecy was that God's agent would cause the waters (= peoples) to be eroded away from Babylon the Great (churches, or Catholic church) so that the Great Cyrus (Christ Jesus) could conquer and come. This began to be fulfilled with Darwin. Since that time, the power of the churches has greatly waned, nearly died out presently. They can no longer hide without repercussions their evil misuse of children, etc.
    the attack
    The prophecy then is that soon, (Revelation) the nations shall attack the religious paramours of theirs formerly held so dear and totally destroy her (the churches). The nations are likened to beasts who tear up this religious harlot. However, when they attack religion they do not care what religion, what religious people, they attack. Like mindless beasts they just want to eat meat.
    attack prelude to defense
    When God sees that religion is attacked, that is OK, but when they attack his servants among the religious, this is not OK. Thus, the end begins and God attacks the nations of the world. The end has begun.

    winding up
    So, without evolution and Darwin, there could have been no weakening of the powers of the church; without this, there can be no attack on religion, without an attack, there will be no defense from God, no end of the world.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Funny Funny x 1
  18. lewisnotmiller

    lewisnotmiller Grand Hat
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    May 6, 2013
    Messages:
    14,574
    Ratings:
    +7,142
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Based on what? That Israeli military strategy decided to get on the front foot and attack Arab nations before they were invaded?

    That's smart (and ruthless) military strategy, not close adherence to theology.
    Apart from your own bias, why do you see it different? How much study of this have you actually done? I've had a possibly unhealthy interest in military strategy since I was a kid, and nothing about the 6 day war screams 'miracle'.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  19. Deeje

    Deeje Deeje
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2009
    Messages:
    8,251
    Ratings:
    +4,138
    Religion:
    Christian JW
    Well, seeing as how the flood was all God's doing and he was the one prescribing all the details to Noah, I believe that the ark stocked enough food for all on board. And since it was God who brought the animals to Noah, he was the one who chose them.

    I seem to recall a time when, during a severe famine, Elijah asked a poor widow to make him a small piece of bread with the last flour and oil that she had left. Since it was God's prophet who asked and she did as he requested, the oil and the flour never ran out until the famine was over, ensuring that the widow and her son always had something to eat.

    Who is to say that there was no divine intervention in the case of the animals on the ark? We just don't know.....can you say with any certainty that God could not have supplied extra food if he chose to? Didn't Jesus feed 5,000 people with just two loaves of bread and a few small fish? Multiplying what he had was no trouble at all for him. There were even 12 baskets of leftovers! [​IMG]

    I am amazed that humans want to put limitations on the Creator so that they can 'prove' to themselves that he can't carry out what he has spoken. He is not human.....and he has no such limitations.

    Since science has demonstrated beyond doubt that humans and dinosaurs never inhabited the earth at the same time, (I am not a YEC) it is safe to say that there were no dinosaurs on the ark. The only "monsters" described in Genesis were in the ocean and they didn't need to occupy space on board a vessel.
    [​IMG]
    Many species were long extinct by the time of man's creation...so apparently, God chose the creatures he wanted to inhabit the earth, with humans as their caretakers.
     
    #79 Deeje, Aug 4, 2017
    Last edited: Aug 4, 2017
  20. blü 2

    blü 2 Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2017
    Messages:
    3,598
    Ratings:
    +2,121
    Religion:
    Skeptical
    That too sounds wonderfully useful.

    How's it done, exactly? What did Elijah or the lady or someone else do to cause this excellent effect? I need to develop my kitchen skills, and that seems a great place to start.
     
Loading...