Sunlight is not Daylight

[Native]

I am not saying that. What I was summarizing is that Genesis 1 is saying that day and night occurred without the sun. According to Genesis, the sun, stars and moon were created on the 4th day, but day and night were divided with creation of light on the 1st day, # 1 but has no mention of the sun.

gnostic said: ↑
Genesis say that the sun, moon and stars were created on the 4th day of creation (1:14-19), therefore they exist only AFTER the Earth was created (1:1-2), and AFTER the LIGHT was created on the 1st day (1:3-5).
This LIGHT it talk of in verses 3 to 5, is what divide day from night, and morning from evening - # 2 all without the need of the SUN.

AD # 1: Of course it occurred without the Sun. In the beginning there was darkness and then it was lit up by a light. This part of the creation story just states a condition before the creation took off. You can yourself guess which kind of light it concerns. (Think for instants of Amun-Ra and the Hathor-Milky Way connection)

AD # 2: Here you refer to a light in creation which isn´t the Sun, so read AD # 1 again as it then must be another kind of light in the creation.

But you then claim that Genesis’ first light is from the Milky Way, except that Genesis specifically stated that this light on the first day was what divided day from night.

Read AD # 1!

So in that context, I don’t think the creation of light in Genesis 1:3-5 was referring to the Milky Way.

How much of the Universe was really observed/known by our ancestors?
Read AD # 1!

Anyway, I think you misread my reply, thinking that was my view. I was pointing out how unreliable Genesis is.

No not really. I was just pointing out your own confusion in that matter, lacking to connect the logical dots in a creation. Genesis is NOT unreliable - but it seems so to persons who lack the mythical, astronomical and cosmological skills.
Read AD # 1!

As to the Egyptian myths, there is no fact in it. You are simply interpreting the myth in the way it suit you, and that too have nothing to do with astronomical facts.

And there you go again, directly denying astronomical and cosmological informations in myths even if these appears in ancient texts.

As said above, you are simply fact resistent! Don´t fiddle with ancient myths if you don´t take mythical informations seriously. Stay with your Storyteller fairy tales instead.

 

[gnostic]

AD # 1: Of course it occurred without the Sun. In the beginning there was darkness and then it was lit up by a light. This part of the creation story just states a condition before the creation took off. You can yourself guess which kind of light it concerns. (Think for instants of Amun-Ra and the Hathor-Milky Way connection)

AD # 2: Here you refer to a light in creation which isn´t the Sun, so read AD # 1 again as it then must be another kind of light in the creation.

This is nothing but Tom foolery.

You are completely ignoring what Genesis 1:3-5 are saying, Native:

3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day.

This light is what -

(A) divide “light” from “darkness”,
(B) divide “day” from “night”,
(C) and divide “morning” from “evening”.​

Not only there are no mention of the Sun, there are also NO MENTION OF STARS.

Stars were created on the 4th day (Genesis 1:-14-19) along with the Sun and Moon:

14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the dome of the sky to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the dome of the sky to give light upon the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made the two great lights—the greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night—and the stars. 17 God set them in the dome of the sky to give light upon the earth, 18 to rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening and there was morning, the fourth day.

How on Earth can there be light from the Milky Way on the 1st day, when there are no stars to begin with?

If what Genesis say in both passages (1:3-5 & 1:14-19) were true, then there are no stars whatsoever. No stars, no light from the Milky Way.

Neither Genesis is correct, nor you, Native.

The clouds of gas and dust from the spiral arms would have also prevented any light from the Milky Way’s central bulge penetrating the these clouds.



The fact of matter - astronomically: what the ancient people and what people see today in the night sky is a band of light and dark spots. And these could only come from lights from stars that make these glow behind these interstellar gas and dust, that people would have seen in ancient time.

Stars from the Sagittarius arm, and even from Carina-Centaurus arm behind Sagittarius. That image above would not be from the Milky Way’s central bulge or from the galactic centre.

And the only reason there would be central bulge in the Milky Way are stars, multitudes of stars, but these stars around the bulge wouldn’t be observable from Earth, because of the stars, gas and dust on each arms that blocked our view. Not unless you have telescope that use EM wavelength to penetrate through these spiral arms’ clouds of gas and dust.

But remember, Genesis clearly stated there were NO STARS until the 4th day. I know that Hathor was associated with sky and to the Milky Way, I know about Amun too.

But you are forgetting about one thing about the Ogdoad myth from ancient Ament (Hermopolis). You talk of Amun (Amun-Ra) and talk of the Primeval Water, and you have linked Amun with the Primeval Water. His name, Amun meaning the “Hidden One” would (and should) give you an idea what Amun was a god of - the god of darkness, not to the Primeval Water.

The Primeval Water have always been associated with another god of the Ogdoad pantheon - Nu.

Have you completely forgotten that there 8 deities in the Ogdoad - 4 gods and 4 goddesses, and it was always Nu, not Amun, associated with the Primeval Water.

Second, another thing you have forgotten is that Amun was never associated with Ra, until the 18 dynasty, where the local god of Thebes from the 12th and 13th dynasty became very prominent in the 18th. In the 18th dynasty, became Amun-Min and Amun-Ra, and as Amun-Ra, Amun became a sun god.

Amun was never called Amun-Ra in the Old Kingdom dynasties (3rd - 6th dynasties). Amun was never a sun god in the Old Kingdom.

So you associating the Old Kingdom Ogdoad Amun of Hermopolis with New Kingdom Amun-Ra of Thebes, is nothing more than anachronism. You are ignoring that Amun-Ra isn’t the same one in the Ogdoad myth. You cannot even get your Egyptian myths straight.

You are talking about myths with impossible fantasies, whether it come from the Bible, or from Egyptian myths.

 

[Bear Wild]

I believe that the Bible does not contradict itself, and when we read that light was created before the sun, then the only logical explanation is that sunlight is not daylight.

That was bizarre. The music did nothing to support the misunderstanding of science. Sunlight and daylight are the same except that daylight is only present when the that part of the earth is facing the sun. This is such elementary understanding that I cannot even conceive of anyone challenging this other the out of a absolute desperate desire to make the unbelievable believable.

 

[Bear Wild]

gnostic said: ↑
Genesis say that the sun, moon and stars were created on the 4th day of creation (1:14-19), therefore they exist only AFTER the Earth was created (1:1-2), and AFTER the LIGHT was created on the 1st day (1:3-5).
This LIGHT it talk of in verses 3 to 5, is what divide day from night, and morning from evening - # 2 all without the need of the SUN.

AD # 1: Of course it occurred without the Sun. In the beginning there was darkness and then it was lit up by a light. This part of the creation story just states a condition before the creation took off. You can yourself guess which kind of light it concerns. (Think for instants of Amun-Ra and the Hathor-Milky Way connection)

AD # 2: Here you refer to a light in creation which isn´t the Sun, so read AD # 1 again as it then must be another kind of light in the creation.

Read AD # 1!

How much of the Universe was really observed/known by our ancestors?
Read AD # 1!

No not really. I was just pointing out your own confusion in that matter, lacking to connect the logical dots in a creation. Genesis is NOT unreliable - but it seems so to persons who lack the mythical, astronomical and cosmological skills.
Read AD # 1!

And there you go again, directly denying astronomical and cosmological informations in myths even if these appears in ancient texts.

As said above, you are simply fact resistent! Don´t fiddle with ancient myths if you don´t take mythical informations seriously. Stay with your Storyteller fairy tales instead.

How can you even attempt to justify this myth which had nothing to do with the reality of how this universe was created. It is a myth. Those who wrote it were created a story for their people with minimal understanding of light, planets, suns. and life. If you like the myth great but do not try to make a patchwork connection to anything meaningful to what we know today or else buy into all the myths and then out world was made from a giant.

 

[TagliatelliMonster]

When i wrote "imagine", this was just in order to get your focus on the central and luminous Light in the Milky Way - as in the image link I posted.

I'm unaware of any light that isn't being emitted by some object.

Why would it be irrelevant and unreal when our ancestors spoke of a conceptual Light compared to the modern observation of Light as a concept?

Because today we know that light isn't some concept, but a physical thing. A photon.

 

[Native]

This is nothing but Tom foolery.

You are completely ignoring what Genesis 1:3-5 are saying, Native:

That´s a novelty coming from someone who don´t believe in myths in the Creation Stories

“Genesis 1:3-5” said:

3 Then God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light. 4 And God saw that the light was good; and God separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And there was evening and there was morning, the first day.

This light is what -

(A) divide “light” from “darkness”,
(B) divide “day” from “night”,
(C) and divide “morning” from “evening”.

Not only there are no mention of the Sun, there are also NO MENTION OF STARS.
Stars were created on the 4th day (Genesis 1:-14-19) along with the Sun and Moon:

# 1- This scenario cannot be understood unless taking it as "cyclical creation" as a principle of formation, where "gas and dust" are coming together, are heated up and creating a light. This initial light shines in the darkness and of course there are no other stars, not yet.

“Genesis 1:-14-19” said:

14 And God said, “Let there be lights in the dome of the sky to separate the day from the night; and let them be for signs and for seasons and for days and years, 15 and let them be lights in the dome of the sky to give light upon the earth.” And it was so. 16 God made the two great lights—the greater light to rule the day and the lesser light to rule the night—and the stars. 17 God set them in the dome of the sky to give light upon the earth, 18 to rule over the day and over the night, and to separate the light from the darkness. And God saw that it was good. 19 And there was evening and there was morning, the fourth day.

How on Earth can there be light from the Milky Way on the 1st day, when there are no stars to begin with?

If what Genesis say in both passages (1:3-5 & 1:14-19) were true, then there are no stars whatsoever. No stars, no light from the Milky Way.
Neither Genesis is correct, nor you, Native.

You don´t believe in myths and you cannot get the Genesis to fit - STILL you have the nerve to judge me wrong!?

Well, I forgive you for doing so since you don´t believe in myths and subsequently you are no expert.

# 2 - I´ve never said the entire Milky Way lit up in the initial creative process! What I´m saying is that the FIRST LIGHT appeared in the center of what later became the entire Milky Way.

The clouds of gas and dust from the spiral arms would have also prevented any light from the Milky Way’s central bulge penetrating the these clouds.

# 3 - You presume the present Milky Way scenario was the same as in the beginning of the Genesis story, which of course is wrong. And your reference to modern technology is totally irrelevant.

Remember, we are talking of a cyclical process of formation. The Milky Way bars and arms are the secondary result from the Central Light of formation, as also the very galactic disk itself.

The fact of matter - astronomically: what the ancient people and what people see today in the night sky is a band of light and dark spots. And these could only come from lights from stars that make these glow behind these interstellar gas and dust, that people would have seen in ancient time.

Fair enough. But you if you are dealing with Genesis, you have to stay into the time of creation and describe the entire scenario as a beginning and not the result - as you also irrelevantly describes here:

Stars from the Sagittarius arm, and even from Carina-Centaurus arm behind Sagittarius. That image above would not be from the Milky Way’s central bulge or from the galactic centre.

And the only reason there would be central bulge in the Milky Way are stars, multitudes of stars, but these stars around the bulge wouldn’t be observable from Earth, because of the stars, gas and dust on each arms that blocked our view. Not unless you have telescope that use EM wavelength to penetrate through these spiral arms’ clouds of gas and dust.

As said before in # 3 You have to look at the Genesis scenario as a beginning and not the result! Taking modern instrument and their skills or loss of skills is completely irrelevant.

I know that Hathor was associated with sky and to the Milky Way, I know about Amun too.

But you are forgetting about one thing about the Ogdoad myth from ancient Ament (Hermopolis). You talk of Amun (Amun-Ra) and talk of the Primeval Water, and you have linked Amun with the Primeval Water. His name, Amun meaning the “Hidden One” would (and should) give you an idea what Amun was a god of - the god of darkness, not to the Primeval Water.

Thanks for remembering me of the Ogdoad which I´ve promoted for a long time now - so far without any understanding from your side because you evidently, as also in the Genesis, have some problems of connecting the mythical texts with a concrete cosmological formation.

Obviously you are not familiar with the general mythical term of "Primeval Waters". It represents every elementary stages and qualities which is needed in order to create everything. The "Primeval Waters" is the initial stage in where ALL the Egyptian primeval "8 deities" "rests" before the creation taks off. That is: ALL the primeval Egyptian deities are connected to the Primeval Waters.

# 4 - Amun was 1 of the 8 primordial elements and qualities which, "when they came together", resulted in "a fiery light". Here you have a description of the elementary pre-conditions of the creation itself. And this creation logically cannot describe a creation of the entire Universe as our ancestors "only" knew of the local part of the Universe, our Milky Way. It also cannot describe a creation of the Solar System as this was not mentioned as the first to be created in Genesis or in other cultural telling of Creation Stories.

Quote from - Ogdoad of Hermopolis (Khmunu) | Ancient Egypt Online

“The Ogdoad was a system of eight deities, four gods and their consorts (the number four was considered to represent completeness). Each pair represented the male and female aspects of the four creative powers or sources.

Nun and Naunet represented the primeval waters; Heh and Hauhet represented eternity; Kuk and Kuaket represented darkness; and Amun and Amunet represented air (or that which is hidden). However, the gods difffer from one source to another. Primeval darkness was sometimes represented by Gereh and Gerehet and Heh and Hehet are sometimes included as forces of chaos, possibly representing the currents of the primeaval waters. When Amun rose in prominence as a creator god in his own right, he and Amunet were replaced by Nia and Niat, gods of the void.

These eight elements interacted causing an explosion (the Big Bang?)(Me: Rubbish) and the burst of energy which was released caused the primeval mound (located at Hermopolis, but originally known as the “Isle of Flame”) to rise from the water”.
-------------------
Just as interpreted and described in the # 4: The primeval elements caused an initial light on the Primeval Mound = i.e. a symbol for the Milky Way center.

Quote from - Amun - Wikipedia
Amun acquired national importance, expressed in his fusion with the Sun god, Ra, as Amun-Ra or Amun-Re

# 5 - This reference to the Sun here is rubbish as the first to be created wasn´t the Sun as also stated in Genesis.

Here Amun-Ra refers to the initial result of the primeval elements coming together in the creation BEFORE the Sun was created. So logically, Amun-Ra represents the first light in the coming Milky Way galaxy, hence the logical connection with the Goddess Hathor who is created by the initial first central light and who resembles the Milky Way on the southern hemisphere.

This is the mythical familiarity of (Amun)Ra and Hathor which scholars are having huge troubles understanding because they simply have forgotten all about the cosmological implications in the Creation Myths. If not knowing of the initial central light in the coming galaxy. they are forced to interpret Ra as the Sun. Which is confused nonsense in all accounts.

Of course the Sun (Egyptian =RA) cannot be the prime creative force in our galaxy. Which also is stated in Genesis.

Amun was never called Amun-Ra in the Old Kingdom dynasties (3rd - 6th dynasties). Amun was never a sun god in the Old Kingdom.

I don´t care of the historical issues in ancient Egypt: I have my focus on the very stories of creation itself:

Quote from - Amun - Wikipedia
Amun acquired national importance, expressed in his fusion with the Sun god, Ra, as Amun-Ra or Amun-Re

Except from Amun-RA is NOT the sun as logically explained above here in # 5

So you associating the Old Kingdom Ogdoad Amun of Hermopolis with New Kingdom Amun-Ra of Thebes, is nothing more than anachronism. You are ignoring that Amun-Ra isn’t the same one in the Ogdoad myth. You cannot even get your Egyptian myths straight.

You are talking about myths with impossible fantasies, whether it come from the Bible, or from Egyptian myths.

Says he who don´t believe in Creation Myths and its astronomical and cosmological implications and has HUGE TROUBLE understanding Genesis - and in the Egyptian Myth of creation as well.

Honestly, it would suit you better to have a more humble approach to a fellow debater who, for a long time now, have tried to enlighten you in these issues.

 

[Native]

How can you even attempt to justify this myth which had nothing to do with the reality of how this universe was created. It is a myth. Those who wrote it were created a story for their people with minimal understanding of light, planets, suns. and life. If you like the myth great but do not try to make a patchwork connection to anything meaningful to what we know today or else buy into all the myths and then out world was made from a giant.

You´re assuming that our ancestors had "minimal understanding of light, planets, suns. and life", which is somewhat insulting our ancestors.
You can read my reply to @gnostic above here. If you like to ask further questions of connections with ancient myths and modern cosmological science, you´re welcome.

 

[gnostic]

That´s a novelty coming from someone who don´t believe in myths in the Creation Stories

And that's a very narrow-minded view.

Why would you think that it only take BELIEF to understand a myth?

There are number of ways to understand myths, and believing in the myths is only just one way to learn what these myths are saying.

But one of the problems with belief, is bias.

Thanks for remembering me of the Ogdoad which I´ve promoted for a long time now - so far without any understanding from your side because you evidently, as also in the Genesis, have some problems of connecting the mythical texts with a concrete cosmological formation.

Obviously you are not familiar with the general mythical term of "Primeval Waters". It represents every elementary stages and qualities which is needed in order to create everything. The "Primeval Waters" is the initial stage in where ALL the Egyptian primeval "8 deities" "rests" before the creation taks off. That is: ALL the primeval Egyptian deities are connected to the Primeval Waters.

# 4 - Amun was 1 of the 8 primordial elements and qualities which, "when they came together", resulted in "a fiery light". Here you have a description of the elementary pre-conditions of the creation itself. And this creation logically cannot describe a creation of the entire Universe as our ancestors "only" knew of the local part of the Universe, our Milky Way. It also cannot describe a creation of the Solar System as this was not mentioned as the first to be created in Genesis or in other cultural telling of Creation Stories.

Quote from - Ogdoad of Hermopolis (Khmunu) | Ancient Egypt Online

“The Ogdoad was a system of eight deities, four gods and their consorts (the number four was considered to represent completeness). Each pair represented the male and female aspects of the four creative powers or sources.

Nun and Naunet represented the primeval waters; Heh and Hauhet represented eternity; Kuk and Kuaket represented darkness; and Amun and Amunet represented air (or that which is hidden). However, the gods difffer from one source to another. Primeval darkness was sometimes represented by Gereh and Gerehet and Heh and Hehet are sometimes included as forces of chaos, possibly representing the currents of the primeaval waters. When Amun rose in prominence as a creator god in his own right, he and Amunet were replaced by Nia and Niat, gods of the void.

In every creation myths I have come across, Native, from the Pyramid Text and other funerary texts (Coffin Texts, Book(s) of the Dead), to cult literature (eg from Heliopolis, Hermopolis, Thebes, Abydos, Edfu, etc) of creation, it is always Nu's name (Nun's) that comes up, not Amun, in regarding to the Primeval Water.

So don't tell me what I already bloody know about the Primeval Water, Native.

All you are doing is associating Amun to Primeval Water, by proxy, because you want to link Amun to Hathor the embodiment of the Milky Way, because that's your personal belief.

I may not be expert in Egyptian religion and myths, but I know enough about what I read, and you don't need to be a "BELIEVER" to understand it. Being a believer, such as yourself, you refused to recognize there are more than one source to the myths, and believing tends to hamper understanding because they are so bloody set in their ways...such as yourself.

 

[Native]

Native said: ↑
That´s a novelty coming from someone who don´t believe in myths in the Creation Stories.

Why would you think that it only take BELIEF to understand a myth?

Note the underlined sentence. This is what we are discussing here, not myths in general.

There are number of ways to understand myths, and believing in the myths is only just one way to learn what these myths are saying.

When it comes to the factual creation in Genesis, there is just 1 way to understand this telling, and that is to investigate the logics in the telling - as we are trying to do here.

In every creation myths I have come across, Native, from the Pyramid Text and other funerary texts (Coffin Texts, Book(s) of the Dead), to cult literature (eg from Heliopolis, Hermopolis, Thebes, Abydos, Edfu, etc) of creation, it is always Nu's name (Nun's) that comes up, not Amun, in regarding to the Primeval Water.
So don't tell me what I already bloody know about the Primeval Water, Native.

"Nun" is the very description of the Primeval Waters in where the 8 "deities and qualities of creation "rests" as quoted here:
From - Cosmic Oceans: The Primordial Waters of Ancient Creation Myths
The Egyptians referred to this watery chaos of pre-creation as ‘nu’ or ‘ nun,’ a state of unlimited potential out of which the first primeval mound of solid earth would eventually arise.

Well, if you know "bloody" everything about the Primeval Water concept, then you should be able to explain the creation via the Egyptian myths in a logical way, right?

Go ahead and explain - with reference to the Ogdoad:
1) What is the pre-conditions of the creation. 2) Where were the 8 Egyptian deities/qualities situated before the creation of the first entity? 3) What is the first entity of light in the creation? 4) What are the cosmic deity familiarity created from the first entity of light?

I´m looking forward to your explanation

All you are doing is associating Amun to Primeval Water, by proxy, because you want to link Amun to Hathor the embodiment of the Milky Way, because that's your personal belief.

Why would I be that stupid to invent something in order to back up some own fantasies? Remember this from above?

Quote from - Amun - Wikipedia" - Amun acquired national importance, expressed in his fusion with the Sun god, Ra, as Amun-Ra or Amun-Re"
(Except from Ra/Amun-RA/Amun-Re is NOT the sun as logically explained above).

As the Sun logically cannot be the creator of the Milky Way and thus also the Egyptian Goddess Hathor, Ra/Amun-Ra logically cannot be interpreted as the Sun.

Here we have the usual scholarly problem of interpretation: If they know nothing of the astronomical and cosmological implications and the mythical extends in ancient myths of creation, they have no other interpretative possibilities but to take the Sun to be the creator of everything in our Milky Way.

Which is both a mythical and cosmological nonsens.They simply don´t understand the ancient myths of creation at all.

I may not be expert in Egyptian religion and myths, but I know enough about what I read, and you don't need to be a "BELIEVER" to understand it.

If you´re not an expert, the only thing left is to believe. You can read tonnes and tonnes of cultural and historic litterature and remember the context intellectually perfect.

But you´re still left into the belief department as long as you don´t work on your way to become an expert. Which includes the skills to connect the myths of Creation to real astronomical and cosmological concepts.

Being a believer, such as yourself, you refused to recognize there are more than one source to the myths, and believing tends to hamper understanding because they are so bloody set in their ways...such as yourself.

I excuse you for being that emotional - which is normal for debaters who are running out of factual arguments.

But well. Take on the task to explain the points written and asked above:

Go ahead and explain - with reference to the Ogdoad:
1) What is the pre-conditions of the creation. 2) Where were the 8 Egyptian deities/qualities situated before the creation of the first entity? 3) What is the first entity of light in the creation? 4) What are the cosmic deity familiarity created from the first entity of light?

I´m looking forward to your explanation ​

 

[gnostic]

Native said: ↑
That´s a novelty coming from someone who don´t believe in myths in the Creation Stories.

Note the underlined sentence. This is what we are discussing here, not myths in general.

When it comes to the factual creation in Genesis, there is just 1 way to understand this telling, and that is to investigate the logics in the telling - as we are trying to do here.


"Nun" is the very description of the Primeval Waters in where the 8 "deities and qualities of creation "rests" as quoted here:
From - Cosmic Oceans: The Primordial Waters of Ancient Creation Myths
The Egyptians referred to this watery chaos of pre-creation as ‘nu’ or ‘ nun,’ a state of unlimited potential out of which the first primeval mound of solid earth would eventually arise.

Well, if you know "bloody" everything about the Primeval Water concept, then you should be able to explain the creation via the Egyptian myths in a logical way, right?

Go ahead and explain - with reference to the Ogdoad:
1) What is the pre-conditions of the creation. 2) Where were the 8 Egyptian deities/qualities situated before the creation of the first entity? 3) What is the first entity of light in the creation? 4) What are the cosmic deity familiarity created from the first entity of light?

I´m looking forward to your explanation

Why would I be that stupid to invent something in order to back up some own fantasies? Remember this from above?

As the Sun logically cannot be the creator of the Milky Way and thus also the Egyptian Goddess Hathor, Ra/Amun-Ra logically cannot be interpreted as the Sun.

Here we have the usual scholarly problem of interpretation: If they know nothing of the astronomical and cosmological implications and the mythical extends in ancient myths of creation, they have no other interpretative possibilities but to take the Sun to be the creator of everything in our Milky Way.

Which is both a mythical and cosmological nonsens.They simply don´t understand the ancient myths of creation at all.

If you´re not an expert, the only thing left is to believe. You can read tonnes and tonnes of cultural and historic litterature and remember the context intellectually perfect.

But you´re still left into the belief department as long as you don´t work on your way to become an expert. Which includes the skills to connect the myths of Creation to real astronomical and cosmological concepts.

I excuse you for being that emotional - which is normal for debaters who are running out of factual arguments.

But well. Take on the task to explain the points written and asked above:

Go ahead and explain - with reference to the Ogdoad:
1) What is the pre-conditions of the creation. 2) Where were the 8 Egyptian deities/qualities situated before the creation of the first entity? 3) What is the first entity of light in the creation? 4) What are the cosmic deity familiarity created from the first entity of light?

I´m looking forward to your explanation ​

In creation myths outside of the Ogdoad myths, Nu appeared most frequently as the primeval water, eg in the Old Kingdom Pyramid Text and in the New Kingdom papyri myths of Ra, where Amun are either never mentioned at all or barely mentioned.

But you continue to think the primeval water is the Milky Way or other such nonsense about the Genesis Flood occurring in the Milky Way.

You talk of facts about the myths and the Milky Way, when what you have really nothing but goofball and woo.

Fine, make up your silky woo, because I have wasted enough of time with you.

 

[Native]

But you continue to think the primeval water is the Milky Way or other such nonsense about the Genesis Flood occurring in the Milky Way.

I´ve never said such things!
For your information - and for the 117th time - The "Primeval Waters" is NOT the Milky Way but what created the Milky Way. And "The Flood" didn´t occur IN the Milky Way, but the Milky Way resembles The Flood in the Sky.

You talk of facts about the myths and the Milky Way, when what you have really nothing but goofball and woo.
Fine, make up your silky woo, because I have wasted enough of time with you.

According to yourself, you´re (correctly) not a mythological expert so you can in fact not judge what is silly woo or golfballs.