Status, Value and Treatment of Parents.

[Smart_Guy]

Hello guys.

Do your beliefs teach special status, value or treatment for parents? Please share them with us, if they exist. I'll start with that of Islam.

Here are some verses from the Quran:

Quran 17 verses 23-24 (talks about both parents)
And your Lord has decreed that you not worship except Him, and to parents, good treatment. Whether one or both of them reach old age [while] with you, say not to them [so much such as] "pfft" and do not repel them but speak to them a noble word. And lower to them the wing of humility out of mercy and say, "My Lord, have mercy upon them as they brought me up [when I was] small."
Comment: God is putting good treatment to parents right next to what He wants the most; worshiping Him. This shows how important parents are.

Quran 31 verses 14-15 (has special point for the mother)
And We have enjoined upon man [care] for his parents. His mother carried him, in weakness upon weakness, and his weaning is in two years. Be grateful to Me and to your parents; to Me is the [final] destination. But if they endeavor to make you associate with Me in worship that of which you have no knowledge, do not obey them but accompany them in [this] world with appropriate kindness and follow the way of those who turn back to Me [in repentance]. Then to Me will be your return, and I will inform you about what you used to do.
Comment: Here God says that even in case the parents try to push us to worship other than Him, which is the greatest sin to Him, we are still required to be kind to them.

Quran 46 verse 15 (first part. Again, specially about the mother)
And We have enjoined upon man, to his parents, good treatment. His mother carried him with hardship and gave birth to him with hardship.
Comment: Emphasis on the the hardship the mother has in the maternity stage is a way to make us appreciate the mother.


And now from the Islamic heritage and Hadeeth:

Prophet Muhammad PBUH (stands for peace be upon him) said: "who obey their parents, obey God, and who disobey their parents, disobey God."

A man once came to prophet Muhammad PBUH asking for Jihad opportunity. The Prophet asked him: "are your parents alive?". The man answered with yes. The Prophet then told him "then your jihad is with them".

In a similar setting, another man came to the Prophet inquiring about jihad and traveling seeking God. The Prophet asked him if his parents were alive and the main said that both of them are. He then asked him if he's seeking credit from God, and the man said yes, the Prophet told him to go back to them and give them good company.

A man once asked the Prophet "who's more deserving of my kindness and good company?" The Prophet said "your mother". The man asked "then who?", the Prophet said "then your mother". The man asked for the third time and got the same answer. Then the man asked for the fourth and last time and this time the answer was "your father".

Comments:
Prophet Muhammad is prioritizing parents over the opportunity of jihad and traveling to seek what pleases God of finding career, getting married, seeking knowledge, etc. This shows how important parents are.

That was what I managed to recall, and there are other examples. Please share what you have in your beliefs, if any.

Important note and a reminder:
This is not preaching. The Comparative Religion section is to compare religions in specific points and the thread is about the specific point of parents. Remember also that this section in not open for debates. If there is any, you can start your own thread about it in the right section. However, asking for clarifications or pointing out what could be a mistake are not debates and are allowed.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I have others. This is from Nichiren Shonin. A Buddhist monk who gave commentary on The Buddha's scripture. Here he is talking about the importance of ones mother.

Lecture 13 - Letter to Toki Jonin

Noblest Are Those Who Love Humanity

Shakyamuni Buddha was a traveler. Throughout his life, he was continually active and on the move.

"I will visit that place --- for there are people there." Spurring himself to action, he walked on, his gaze fixed on the distant horizon. Shakyamuni sincerely loved human beings.

As he made his way through each place, he must have thoroughly enjoyed encountering new friends and discovering new qualities and virtues in old friends. Transcending all superficial differences, he drew out each person's goodwill and created heart-to-heart bonds of benevolence. Weaving such a spiritual fabric was doubtless his greatest joy. His spirit was that of a true champion of humanism.

A Buddhist text relates how once Shakyamuni came upon a sick person. Shakyamuni, however, would not forsake him. He approached the man, who was filthy, and warmly comforted him. Helping him up, Shakyamuni led him outdoors and washed him. While the man was bathing, Shakyamuni even changed his bedding.

Those observing this wondered why the Buddha was going to such lengths for the sick man. "If you wish to serve the Buddha," Shakyamuni told them, "then you should tend to the sick." (1) This is a well-known anecdote.

Sickness is not merely a physical phenomenon; it invariably signals the presence of spiritual malady, too. In seeking to cure someone's illness, we should spare no effort, leave no stone unturned. In the above instance, Shakyamuni's intention was probably to indicate that the path of Buddhism lies solely in working and taking action among people.

Because Shakyamuni loved people, many gathered around him, drawn by his thoroughly humane conduct. And, naturally, the atmosphere around him was always lively and bright. The same was true of Nichiren Daishonin. In the Daishonin's presence, people doubtless felt free to voice the thoughts and feelings in their innermost hearts.

The Daishonin was of course a strict mentor and teacher. But at the same time, from his many letters, we can see that people felt absolute assurance in confiding in him. He knew everything about them.

In the Daishonin's presence, even adults would become as honest and open as children. Almost without realizing it, they would reveal their genuine, unaffected selves, their true faces.

Toki Jonin was one such follower. From the Daishonin's letters to him, we can infer that Toki Jonin must have been very concerned about his mother. And the Daishonin respected and treasured his feelings. He gave him the support and encouragement he needed to conduct himself with true filial devotion toward his mother.

In the Gosho that we are studying this time, (2) we can sense the Daishonin's immense spirit of love and humanity.

I have received one unlined kimono.

Among the Buddha's disciples there was one monk who, when the Buddha was in a place where there was famine and was restricted in his activities because of the shortages, sold his clerical robes and gave the money that he received to the Buddha.

The Buddha asked him where the money had come from. So the monk told him how he had acquired it, relating everything exactly as it had happened.

The Buddha then declined the offering, saying: "The surplice is the Dharma robe for the enlightenment of all Buddhas over the three existences. I do not have the power to requite such an offering." So the monk asked, "Then what should I do with the money that I received for my surplice?" In response, the Buddha asked him, "Do you have a dear mother?" When the monk replied that he did, the Buddha told him, "You ought to offer this money from the surplice to your mother." The monk then said to Shakyamuni: "The Buddha is the most venerable being in the threefold world. He is the eye of all living beings. Even if it were a robe broad enough to wrap in itself the entire universe, or a surplice large enough to cover the earth, the Buddha is certainly worthy of such an offering My mother is as ignorant as a cow and more thoughtless than a sheep. How could she possibly be worthy of the offering of a surplice?"

The Buddha replied: "Who gave birth to you? Your mother did. Doesn't she therefore fully deserve to receive the offering of this surplice?" (Gosho Zenshu, p. 968)

This episode vividly conveys the humanism of Buddhism. It portrays the spirit of a disciple to want to assist his mentor, and the concern of the mentor for the disciple and also his mother. It is a beautiful story.

(Cut)

When the Daishonin saw the robe that Lord Toki had sent, he must have fondly recalled the face of his follower's mother. The Daishonin is said to have spent time at Toki Jonin's manor after the Matsubagayatsu Persecution in 1260. Probably he had grown close to Lord Toki's mother.

More than 10 years had passed since then. In those days, a person more than 90 years old would have been extremely long-lived. The Daishonin must have been concerned about how difficult needlework would have been for Toki Jonin's mother. His sentiments are expressed in the sentence, "She must have strained her eyes and expended her life to make it."

Toki Jonin was 60 at the time. But even after reaching an advanced age, the parent, as they say, is still the parent and the child is still the child. Toki Jonin no doubt wondered how he could reply to his mother's warm consideration.

"That's it," he probably thought, "I'll offer the robe to the Daishonin. Both he and my mother will be pleased." While there is no way of knowing whether this was his intent, the unlined kimono was delivered to the Daishonin.

The Daishonin's sense of gratitude may well have been accompanied by some hesitance. He couldn't nonchalantly accept an item that was invested with such profound love. The tale that the Daishonin relates in this reply sheds light on his feelings.

Although he was reluctant to accept the garment? to return it would amount to rejecting the sincere spirit with which it had been offered. Under the circumstances, the Daishonin acknowledges Toki Jonin's sincerity and conveys the greatest thanks and encouragement to the latter's mother.

The Daishonin says that by his wearing this robe, Bonten, Taishaku and all heavenly deities would know the ardent spirit of mother and son in making the offering. He says that the Buddhist gods in the 10 directions would definitely protect them. And he concludes the letter telling them that their benefit in making such an offering would illuminate their lives in lifetime after lifetime, eternally.

What joy the mother and son must have felt on receiving this response! Toki Jonin, in his joy at conducting himself in the most dutiful manner toward his mother, must have felt the deepest gratitude to the Daishonin.

"What matters is one's heart" (The Major Writings of Nichiren Daishonin, vol. 5, p. 289). Here we see a beautiful exchange take place: a mother who undertakes painstaking effort out of concern for her son; a disciple who is motivated by concern for his mother and his mentor; and the mentor who, out of his concern for the mother and son, does his utmost to bring out the best in all their efforts. This is the world of Buddhism.

The year after this letter was sent, in February 1276, Toki Jonin's mother passed away with him, his wife and other relatives watching over her. According to one account, she was 93 when she died.

Toki Jonin held an important position in society [as a vassal of Lord Chiba, governor of Shimosa Province (present-day Chiba Prefecture), with a rank comparable to that of a steward], and was also a central figure among the Daishonin's followers.

Toki Jonin's wife also looked after his mother attentively.

One of his mother's grandchildren struggled for kosen-rufu at the Daishonin's side, and later two of her grandchildren were active under Nikko Shonin. Embraced by the mercy of the original Buddha, the life of Toki Jonin's mother was doubtless one of great satisfaction and victory. It was the drama of a woman who, though ordinary and without any special distinction, lived earnestly and realized victory. Buddhism exists to help such valiant individuals become happy.

When we base our lives on the great wish for kosen-rufu, regarding each effort as "like dew entering the ocean, or soil being added to the earth," then our petty lesser self gives way to the greater self that shines with eternal victory. Our every effort turns into an ocean of benefit, an earth of good fortune.

I hope each of you will be confident that, just as Nichiren Daishonin promises, you have already entered this path. And that, therefore, you will treasure your heart of faith.

The "Letter to Lord Toki," while short, is pervaded with warmth. In it, we glimpse warm heart-to-heart exchange between the Daishonin and his followers. Because of their bond with the Daishonin and sense of inner security that this brought, his followers could endure ordeals and struggle with all their might for kosen-rufu.

"How can I help others experience joy? How can I help them practice in high spirits and really exert themselves?" It goes without saying that someone who gives no thought to these questions and does not respond to members' needs is not qualified to be a leader in the humane world of Buddhism.

Our practice has to be based on strong prayer for the happiness of each person. Donning Toki Jonin's robe, which was imbued with sincerity, the Daishonin, too, prayed to the Buddhist gods.

When we sincerely pray, without fail the Buddha wisdom to know how to encourage others will well forth. Our movement of kosen-rufu is to expand this world of encouragement.

(This concludes President Ikeda's lecture on "Letter to Lord Toki.")

 

[Unveiled Artist]

@Smart_Guy

This tells of the love of a father to his children. Its a story and anology of how The Buddha uses different means based on the people to help them see for themselves the way from suffering.

The Burning House

 

[Laika]

I think my beliefs are almost a thinly vieled hostility towards the family as an institution of social control and sexual repression in which the necessity of both marriage and inheritence reflect property relations and not people's actual behaviour or feelings. Treating Parents as having status is like saying they have "authority" but it's not necessarily deserved. you can get bad parents and sometimes kids have a right to defend themselves from unreasonable demands. There is no "natural" bond between parents and children beyond the fact they are stuck with each other.

free love is more natural in terms of how people behave whereas monogamy can be really artifical and restrictive. Free love is however not necessarily workable unless society is willing to take responsibility for child care and domestic tasks (such as communal kitchens, dining areas or washing and drying clothes, etc so people don't have to do it "within the family" but so it's shared). The model of the "nuclear family" strikes me as somewhat *cough* fascist. family life is where children learn to lie and negioate conflicts and throwing the idea of (unearned) authority or status in there is a bit dangerous because it instills a value in obedience and discipline that in latter life is not necessarily very constructive. there is a balance to be struck though because parents can know better than their kids- but it's not because they are "parents" or genetic/biological ties means they somehow have a "special" ability to communicate (especially when you hit the teenage years). when they are right its only because they are adults and have more experiences to draw on, nothing else. sometimes they care but it can often be misplaced.

I get along with my parents and we have a "working" relationship but it isn't really "loving". are they physically abusive? no. neglectful/psychologically abuse? yes. it's not "all the time" but it still happens and I have to be vigilent and watch out for it when it happens. All three of us are a bit nuts and putting us in a small house together means we bump off each other as well as having good moments. we each need time to ourselves when we get space as it gets a bit crowded. I'm "kind" to my parents but it's not necessarily out of defference (and I feel insulted when my parents expect it to be). I love them, but being nice to them helps keep the peace too and can be borderline appeasement. It's hard to know where to draw the line and tell them to **** off.

Before you ask, I was a saint as a kid. Then I grew up and realise that not standing up to my parents was screwing me up and I was missing out on having fun like all the bad kids who we're alot happier for it, so I'm a little more combatative now.

 

[Valjean]

Parents owe care to their children. Children owe nothing, in particular, to their parents.

 

[Aupmanyav]

The story of Lord Rama is illustrative. He went into a 14-year exile to save his fathers word. About mothers, he is famously supposed to have said:

"Janani janma bhoomishcha, swargadapi gariyasi" (Mother and motherland are greater than heaven.

There are other stories as well. That of Shravana who carried his blind parents on the two sides of a carrying pole to fulfill their desire to visit pilgrimage centers*. And that of King Puru, who gave his youth to his father, King Yayati, so that Yayati can fulfill his unquenched sexual desires.

Parents are no less than Gods and Goddesses.

* The attached story is that Lord Rama's father, Dasaratha, was adapt at shooting arrow at the source of a sound. He was out for hunting in the forest. Shravana's parents were thirsty and asked him to bring some water. Dasaratha heard the rustling because of Shravana's tread and thinking that it was some animal, hot the arrow, hitting the young man. Shravana asked Dasaratha to take water to his parents. When Dasaratha gave water to Shravana's parents realized that it was not there son. Dasaratha told them of his mistake. The old couple cursed Dasaratha that he will also suffer the separation from his son as they are suffering and promptly died. Later, When Lord Rama had left for the forest, Dasaratha also did not survive the separation from his dearest son.

Parents owe care to their children. Children owe nothing, in particular, to their parents.

Hindus believe that all people have a debt towards their parents ('Pitri Rina', one of the three debts of a man), since the person gets the birth because of them. The debt is re-payed only when a person raises his children too in a good way.

 

[Subhankar Zac]

Hinduism, Vaishnavism mainly can be interpreted both ways...
The first is of pure devotion and another of choosing dharma over family.

The Story of Rama who accepted 14 years of exile to keep his father's promise shows the devotion he had towards him.
Rama forgave Kaikeyi for causing him to be banished from Ayodhya and Asked Bharata to forgive Kaikeyi, his mother, for what she had done to the family.

In Mahabharata, When Arjuna Marries Draupadi and along with his 4 other brothers enters the hut where Kunti was cooking. When Yudhistir said "Look mother, what we have received today" and Kunti without looking says to divide the Gift among themselves. Taking the words of their mother as an unquestionable order, the pandavas together married Draupadi.

The alternate interpretation can be found in the most sacred Text of Vaishnavas and Hindus in general- Bhagavad Gita.
Where Arjuna seeing his Great grandfather in the opposing party, knowing that he has to kill him, fell in a great dilemma... However, Krishna then spoke to Arjuna to choose Dharma and justice over personal preferences and attachments.
Later with a heavy heart and tears, the Pandavas attacked The mighty Bhishma and Arjuna immobilized him with thousands of arrows.

 

[bobhikes]

If you are lucky enough to have parents take care of you and guide you until you can get out on your own, then you should respect and spend time with you parents always.

 

[SomeRandom]

Religiously speaking, I suppose the belief is to honor one's parents as one of the highest authorities in life. Even to the point of one's in laws being of equal treatment. To respect them above all else and to disrespect them is to cast shame upon one's self and cause great personal dishonor (unless they are legitimately abusive of course.) Having said that, I often lash out at my ma because I am always just so angry. But I do value her, even if I don't always show it.

I remember one story of Ganesh as a child. He was told to circle around the world three times as fast as he could (I think he was in a race or it was just a random challenge of intelligence and honor. I can't remember) anyway, he ran around his parents three times. When asked why he did this instead of the task, he replied that his parents were his world and thus did what was asked of him.

 

[Twilight Hue]

Respect is accorded to how one is treated and as to how one treats others, weither it be parent or friend or other.

Relationship really makes no difference.

 

[arthra]

Do your beliefs teach special status, value or treatment for parents? Please share them with us, if they exist. I'll start with that of Islam.

The Baha'i view I believe follows:

The fruits that best befit the tree of
human life are trustworthiness and godliness,
truthfulness and sincerity; but greater than all,
after recognition of the unity of God, praised and
glorified be He, is regard for the rights that are
due to one's parents. This teaching hath been
mentioned in all the Books of God, and reaffirmed
by the Most Exalted Pen. Consider that which the
Merciful Lord hath revealed in the Qur'án, exalted
are His words: "Worship ye God, join with Him
no peer or likeness; and show forth kindliness and
charity towards your parents..." Observe how
loving-kindness to one's parents hath been linked
to recognition of the one true God! Happy they
who are endued with true wisdom and understanding,
who see and perceive, who read and understand,
and who observe that which God hath
revealed in the Holy Books of old, and in this
incomparable and wondrous Tablet.

(Baha'u'llah, The Kitab-i-Aqdas, p. 139)

In terms of Baha'i marriage parents' free permission must be sought unless they are incompetent.

 

[Valjean]

Why do people choose to have children, anyway? Social pressure? Unavoidable products of lust? To give their lives purpose or meaning? Old-age insurance?

Is a social contract valid if it's 'agreed on' by only one side? Does a party who had no part in the agreement responsible to the contract's authors?
If you take it upon yourself to come over and mow my lawn, do I have an obligation to pay you? If you take it upon yourself to create me, without consultation or mutual agreement, for your own pleasure or selfish reasons, do I have any obligation towards you?

 

[arthra]

Why do people choose to have children, anyway? Social pressure? Unavoidable products of lust? To give their lives purpose or meaning? Old-age insurance?

Is a social contract valid if it's 'agreed on' by only one side? Does a party who had no part in the agreement responsible to the contract's authors?
If you take it upon yourself to come over and mow my lawn, do I have an obligation to pay you? If you take it upon yourself to create me, without consultation or mutual agreement, for your own pleasure or selfish reasons, do I have any obligation towards you?

Valjean,

I suppose I could respond.. for me personally having a family has been probably one of the most meaningful parts of my life and now I'm approaching the end of my life but looking back and recalling my own upbringing this is for me what community is about and where we learn love and respect for each other and contribute to society and our larger community.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I feel that respect should earned, ultimately. I love and respect my mom because she did her best with what she had, and she loved me dearly and was very proud of me, even though I don't feel that I deserved it. She always afforded me my freedom and was very accepting of me, too. However, I hate my dad. He ran off about 20 years ago. He was physically and psychologically abusive. He has a pattern of living off the women he gets involved with, fathering children, sleeping around and then running off. He's also a criminal and gets into trouble with the law. I hope he dies soon, and that he suffers horribly before he dies. It's not fair that my mother suffered and died from cancer at 65, but his worthless *** is still around. The same goes for most of the rest of my relatives.

There is no "natural" bond between parents and children beyond the fact they are stuck with each other.

Neuro-biological bonds, such as hormones and such, between the mother and the baby.

free love is more natural in terms of how people behave whereas monogamy can be really artifical and restrictive. Free love is however not necessarily workable unless society is willing to take responsibility for child care and domestic tasks (such as communal kitchens, dining areas or washing and drying clothes, etc so people don't have to do it "within the family" but so it's shared).

Not really. Monogamy tends to be more beneficial for child rearing and society as a whole, from what sociological and anthropological research says.

 

[Laika]

Neuro-biological bonds, such as hormones and such, between the mother and the baby

I'd call that emotional rather than Natural but that's mainly because I'm thinking of the word as to do with God/Religion "natural law" rather than biology, but I take your point.

Not really. Monogamy tends to be more beneficial for child rearing and society as a whole, from what sociological and anthropological research says.

I agree that Monogamy is better for child rearing but that doesn't mean adults don't get tired of looking after the kids and want someone else to help out occassionally, or else want an "adventure" with someone other than their current partner. that's really what I mean by free love; it's not restricted by the demands of looking after the kids or the assumption that marriage is "till death do us part". free love is more about having better relationships because you overcome inhibitions rather than more of them (which taken to it's extreme is very often a reflection of sexual repression and inhibition rather than a fulfilled love/sex life).

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

I'd call that emotional rather than Natural but that's mainly because I'm thinking of the word as to do with God/Religion "natural law" rather than biology, but I take your point.

It's emotional, but based on biology.

I agree that Monogamy is better for child rearing but that doesn't mean adults don't get tired of looking after the kids and want someone else to help out occassionally, or else want an "adventure" with someone other than their current partner. that's really what I mean by free love; it's not restricted by the demands of looking after the kids or the assumption that marriage is "till death do us part". free love is more about having better relationships because you overcome inhibitions rather than more of them (which taken to it's extreme is very often a reflection of sexual repression and inhibition rather than a fulfilled love/sex life).

I don't agree with the nuclear family model, as I think that grandparents, aunts, uncles, extended family and friends are important in rearing children. But I don't agree with "free love", either. Most people do not seem to be "wired" that way. and it only rarely seems to work for some people when it's a consensual thing. It's probably also best not to do it when you're raising kids.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Why do people choose to have children, anyway? Social pressure? Unavoidable products of lust? To give their lives purpose or meaning? Old-age insurance?

Basically biology. That life is more interesting with some one to share with it. And when one is married nice to have a play thing in addition. Once the play thing arrives then one is responsible for it. That is how it goes on. Social pressure, old age insurance too wherever it is applicable.

 

[Valjean]

Basically biology. That life is more interesting with some one to share with it. And when one is married nice to have a play thing in addition. Once the play thing arrives then one is responsible for it. That is how it goes on. Social pressure, old age insurance too wherever it is applicable.

A wife is a plaything? A husband is "responsible for it?"
Perhaps the social pressure is wrong, or even immoral.

Old age insurance? When was this responsibility contracted for? No contractual obligation can exist unless both parties are adult and informed. A child, therefore, owes nothing to his parents.Creating a child as an old-age caretaker is exploitation and immoral.
Even if there is no expectation of future care, as in many western societies, parents create children for selfish reasons, as a hobby, to "enrich" their lives, or from social pressure. I still see no moral, contractual obligation.

 

[Riverwolf]

Hello guys.

Do your beliefs teach special status, value or treatment for parents? Please share them with us, if they exist.

Heathenry places MASSIVE emphasis on family, sometimes to the point where family is seen by some to be more important than the Gods. Contrary to pop culture's depictions, the preferred "afterlife" is to be with one's ancestors, not go to that consolation prize that is Valhalla.

By extension, respect for parents is considered very important. Mind, this does not necessarily mean obediance, and I personally believe that parents who are abusive to their children are not owed any respect, being Frith-breakers.

 

[Valjean]

Heathenry places MASSIVE emphasis on family, sometimes to the point where family is seen by some to be more important than the Gods. Contrary to pop culture's depictions, the preferred "afterlife" is to be with one's ancestors, not go to that consolation prize that is Valhalla.

By extension, respect for parents is considered very important. Mind, this does not necessarily mean obediance, and I personally believe that parents who are abusive to their children are not owed any respect, being Frith-breakers.

But what if your parents are disrespectable? Are you still required to respect them if they're thieves, scoundrels and reprobates?
I don't understand why parenthood confers a special status or get-out-of-disrespect free card. Respectable people should be respected, disrespectable people should be disrespected. Why should a biological relationship change this?