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Spiritual Evidence and Proofs of God’s Existence

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
When speaking about evidences and proofs with regards to God here I am not speaking about scientific proofs but spiritual proofs. I believe that the human mind cannot grasp God so it is fruitless trying to prove God scientifically as we are told He is Spirit. Then to prove God we need to look at spiritual evidences.

What are spiritual proofs and evidences of God? Some say the virtues. Others, the transformative effect the Teachings of the Great Spiritual Teachers have had on the character of the individual and society. Still others say miracles.

Readers might like to contribute by adding how their Prophet’s teachings transformed the life of the individual and society or add their own spiritual proofs of God’s existence.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Wouldn't actual "proofs" generate universal acceptance, like the laws of mathematics? I see very little religious consensus.

There's general agreement even for well evidenced but unproven science, like the germ theory or heliocentrism.
 

loverofhumanity

We are all the leaves of one tree
Premium Member
Wouldn't actual "proofs" generate universal acceptance, like the laws of mathematics? I see very little religious consensus.

There's general agreement even for well evidenced but unproven science, like the germ theory or heliocentrism.
There are spiritual laws akin to mathematical laws but are generally not thought of as such in a materialistic society. Just like certain mathematical laws and formulas have a defined effect, so do spiritual laws and virtues. Love is a force or power that has a tremendous effect on the individual and society which requires no proof as to its potency. Yet it is a spiritual law.
 

1213

Well-Known Member
What are spiritual proofs and evidences of God?

If one prays wisdom from God and gets it, could it be seen as spiritual evidence for God?

But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach; and it will be given to him.
James 1:5
 

danieldemol

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
Virtues are largely evolved traits I believe, no proof of God there.
So called "Great Teachers" largely only popularised pre-existing man-made philosophy, their own unique contributions were not so significant as to make them greater than the men who came before them and whose shoulders they stood on in my belief. So no proof of God there either.
In my opinion.
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
Virtues are largely evolved traits I believe, no proof of God there.
So called "Great Teachers" largely only popularised pre-existing man-made philosophy, their own unique contributions were not so significant as to make them greater than the men who came before them and whose shoulders they stood on in my belief. So no proof of God there either.
In my opinion.
"There are no miracle people" - Richard Feynman
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
When speaking about evidences and proofs with regards to God here I am not speaking about scientific proofs but spiritual proofs. I believe that the human mind cannot grasp God so it is fruitless trying to prove God scientifically as we are told He is Spirit. Then to prove God we need to look at spiritual evidences.

What are spiritual proofs and evidences of God? Some say the virtues. Others, the transformative effect the Teachings of the Great Spiritual Teachers have had on the character of the individual and society. Still others say miracles.

Readers might like to contribute by adding how their Prophet’s teachings transformed the life of the individual and society or add their own spiritual proofs of God’s existence.
The proof is, there is no proof. Nothing. Na da.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
There are spiritual laws akin to mathematical laws but are generally not thought of as such in a materialistic society. Just like certain mathematical laws and formulas have a defined effect, so do spiritual laws and virtues. Love is a force or power that has a tremendous effect on the individual and society which requires no proof as to its potency. Yet it is a spiritual law.
Love is an emotion. A chemical cocktail released by the brain.
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
There are spiritual laws akin to mathematical laws but are generally not thought of as such in a materialistic society. Just like certain mathematical laws and formulas have a defined effect, so do spiritual laws and virtues. Love is a force or power that has a tremendous effect on the individual and society which requires no proof as to its potency. Yet it is a spiritual law.
If such laws exist and are detectable and testable, why is this not generally known? Why is there no consensus on their objective reality and qualities?
Love is a law? Isn't love just extreme appreciation; an individual emotion?
 

Valjean

Veteran Member
Premium Member
If one prays wisdom from God and gets it, could it be seen as spiritual evidence for God?

But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach; and it will be given to him.
James 1:5
If one prays to the Celestial Unicorn for something, and it happens, is this evidence for the Celestial Unicorn?

Things happen all the time, whether one prays for them or not. You'd need to establish a consistent, one to one, cause and effect relationship between a prayer to a particular entity and consistent realization of the prayer, beyond the probabilities of chance. You'd have to establish that prayer directed to any other entity, or no entity, had no such effect.

This would still not establish the existence of a particular, invisible personage with the name, personality, qualities or history of the prayer.
 

blü 2

Veteran Member
Premium Member
When speaking about evidences and proofs with regards to God here I am not speaking about scientific proofs but spiritual proofs. I believe that the human mind cannot grasp God so it is fruitless trying to prove God scientifically as we are told He is Spirit. Then to prove God we need to look at spiritual evidences.

What are spiritual proofs and evidences of God? Some say the virtues. Others, the transformative effect the Teachings of the Great Spiritual Teachers have had on the character of the individual and society. Still others say miracles.

Readers might like to contribute by adding how their Prophet’s teachings transformed the life of the individual and society or add their own spiritual proofs of God’s existence.
What objective test will tell us whether any claimed proof is a "spiritual" proof or not?

What objective test will tell us whether any claimed "spiritual proof" is an accurate statement about reality or not?
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
If one prays wisdom from God and gets it, could it be seen as spiritual evidence for God?

But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach; and it will be given to him.
James 1:5
One of the great accomplishments of RF has been not that of providing a platform for the theism-atheism debate but, rather, to seriously challenge the maxim that there's no such thing as a stupid question.
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
“There are two ways to live your life. As if everything is a miracle, or as if nothing is.”
- Albert Einstein

This is a disputed quote from Gilbert Fowler White. Here's a real Einstein quote for you:

"Wait a minute! I am not a mystic. Trying to find out the laws of nature has nothing to do with mysticism, though in the face of creation I feel very humble."
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
When speaking about evidences and proofs with regards to God here I am not speaking about scientific proofs but spiritual proofs. I believe that the human mind cannot grasp God so it is fruitless trying to prove God scientifically as we are told He is Spirit. Then to prove God we need to look at spiritual evidences.

What are spiritual proofs and evidences of God? Some say the virtues. Others, the transformative effect the Teachings of the Great Spiritual Teachers have had on the character of the individual and society. Still others say miracles.

Readers might like to contribute by adding how their Prophet’s teachings transformed the life of the individual and society or add their own spiritual proofs of God’s existence.
For me, the "transformative effect" and the spiritual values are the strongest proofs.
There are people who think of the Bible like it is some magic portion, where anyone who picks it up should be transformed "by its power".

However, one cannot see the transforming power of the Bible, by the mere possession of it.
Many people possess a Bible, and hardly read it. Some don't even think that it is of much value, other than to hold it in their hand for people to see... as though it's a ticket to a ride to heaven.
You probably heard that some people open it to a random page, and place it above a baby's head.

To see the transforming power of the Bible, one has to read, study, appreciate and apply it.
Only then, would one see the transforming power, because applying its values result in a superior way of life.

This is proof for me, and it can be scientifically tested.
All that is required, is to take all the people who read, study, appreciate, and apply the principles in the Bible, along with thousands of other people, and evaluate the results.

Which of those people are less angry, less sexually immoral, less tolerant of drug or alcohol abuse, less tolerant of the use of harmful substances, like smoking cigars, getting tattooed, less tolerant of dangerous activities - car, motorcycle, snowboarding, etc., racing, less tolerant of using language that is not up-building to the hearer, less tolerant of being entertained by violence, and immorality, and exposing children to these, does not return evil to those that commit evil against them, more peaceable, etc. etc.

I am confident - guaranteed - that those who are applying - living by Bible standards, would all prove to be on one side of the chart, 100%, while on the other side there would be mixed results, none consistently having their "needle" pointing one way.

The only problem science would have in this area though, is that they cannot decide on what is immoral, and people have various opinions on morals, so for example, it may be morally acceptable to some, to "pick fairs", that is pay for sexual favors. Or, one may think it is okay to "sleep with" the neighbor's wife, because "she consents", and don't love her husband, anyway.

So the world's inconsistency, on what is morally acceptable, limits science, and so, it fails to be a good tool for measuring the proofs that exist in reality.

The other thing is, science cannot read hearts, so it is impossible to verify who really is at heart applying the scriptures. Some people are good pretenders.
So, while we have the proof, and it be really proof, science cannot verify it. Nor can atheists disprove it.
 

Ella S.

Dispassionate Goth
“There are two ways to live your life. As if everything is a miracle, or as if nothing is.”
- Albert Einstein

I think I understand that you probably misunderstood the Feynman quote and are responding pointedly to something you thought was a superficial insult. In context, Feynman was talking about how people were giving excessive praise to scientists like himself and others who were fortunate enough to make groundbreaking discoveries, to the point of raising them up on pedestals as these impossible men.

The quote was about how the whole idea that progress, and scientific progress in particular, was carried forward by "great men" is a myth. It's really carried out by a large number of scientists making incremental changes. It's just that the ones that make the significant finds are the ones that are remembered in history, but they're generally not superhuman greats and there are many scientists just as if not more competent than them who never make it into the history books that paved the way of them.

It's a really important lesson, I think, for everyone to learn. All of these historical people, celebrities, politicians, they're just people. They're not really that different from the rest of us. Maybe they're intelligent and hardworking, but there are a lot of intelligent and hardworking people out there. Few things are achieved through the will of a single person. It's just not how progress is made.
 

nPeace

Veteran Member
Virtues are largely evolved traits I believe, no proof of God there.
So called "Great Teachers" largely only popularised pre-existing man-made philosophy, their own unique contributions were not so significant as to make them greater than the men who came before them and whose shoulders they stood on in my belief. So no proof of God there either.
In my opinion.
Can you prove that virtues are evolved traits? Where did they evolve from?
I say they are from God. "Hardwired" into "the nature of" man. Can you prove me wrong?
 
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