kjw47
Well-Known Member
It did. Jesus death opened the door to those living now to do his Fathers will( Matt 7:21) to gain entrance into his kingdom. Jesus teaches it will be Few.
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spirit of antichrist is in the world today
- Thread starter kjw47
- Start date
It did. Jesus death opened the door to those living now to do his Fathers will( Matt 7:21) to gain entrance into his kingdom. Jesus teaches it will be Few.
What are you saying?????????????? Jesus dying did not "open the way to do his Father's will". Did Moses not do God's will? How about David? No? Daniel? Isaiah? MARY, for heaven's sake!
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kjw47
Well-Known Member
Yes that spirit has been here from the beginning. Its found in mortal hearts.
The spirit of Jesus in the mortal heart = Love, Peace, Unity-- turn the other cheek, return evil for evil to no one, if your enemy is hungry-FEED HIM, If thirsty-Give him a drink. Love your enemy--VENGEANCE is mine said the Lord.
Spirit of antichrist-- Hate, calamity, division. Fear turns to anger, then to hate, return evil for evil, even as far as to kill your enemy. Steal vengeance for pride and self.
8 One day the trees went out to anoint a king for themselves. They said to the olive tree, 'Be our king.'
9 "But the olive tree answered, 'Should I give up my oil, by which both gods and humans are honored, to hold sway over the trees?'
10 "Next, the trees said to the fig tree, 'Come and be our king.'
11 "But the fig tree replied, 'Should I give up my fruit, so good and sweet, to hold sway over the trees?'
12 "Then the trees said to the vine, 'Come and be our king.'
13 "But the vine answered, 'Should I give up my wine, which cheers both gods and humans, to hold sway over the trees?'
14 "Finally all the trees said to the thornbush, 'Come and be our king.'
15 "The thornbush said to the trees, 'If you really want to anoint me king over you, come and take refuge in my shade; but if not, then let fire come out of the thornbush and consume the cedars of Lebanon!'
Amen.
9 "But the olive tree answered, 'Should I give up my oil, by which both gods and humans are honored, to hold sway over the trees?'
10 "Next, the trees said to the fig tree, 'Come and be our king.'
11 "But the fig tree replied, 'Should I give up my fruit, so good and sweet, to hold sway over the trees?'
12 "Then the trees said to the vine, 'Come and be our king.'
13 "But the vine answered, 'Should I give up my wine, which cheers both gods and humans, to hold sway over the trees?'
14 "Finally all the trees said to the thornbush, 'Come and be our king.'
15 "The thornbush said to the trees, 'If you really want to anoint me king over you, come and take refuge in my shade; but if not, then let fire come out of the thornbush and consume the cedars of Lebanon!'
Amen.
What does it mean? Christ means success. Antichrist means failure.
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
You are way off there!
1 John 4:2-3 (ESV Strong's) 2 By this you know the Spirit of God: every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, 3 and every spirit that does not confess Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you heard was coming and now is in the world already.
2 John 1:7 (ESV Strong's) For many deceivers have gone out into the world, those who do not confess the coming of Jesus Christ in the flesh. Such a one is the deceiver and the antichrist.
The spirit of antichrist is not "hate, calamity, division", your teachers just tell you that to put you farther at odds with other religions. Get away from them false teachers and learn, "What the Bible Really Teaches"!
Very good point!
Thinking......if the antichrist is identified by hate, calamity, and division then all those who are against those (which I believe are really most people) are for Christ and the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses are speaking condemnation against them.
Rick B said: ↑
How about responding to post 436 on page 22[/QUOTE
@kjw47 "I cannot respond to every post. I had 20 today it would take hours."
In this case it is taking months. I first presented Ps.102:25-28 NWT on July 17 on the thread "The Bible Declares that Jesus is God" post 749 page 38.
Long ago you laid the foundations of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of your hands.+
26 They will perish, but you will remain;
Just like a garment they will all wear out.
Just like clothing you will replace them, and they will pass away.
27 But you are the same, and your years will never end.+
28 The children of your servants will dwell securely,
And their offspring will be firmly established before you.”+
...with 2 questions: Who is the subject being described here? And what does this tell us about him?
You answered: God is being spoken of. God did it all--He created- Michael-Jesus) direct, first and last( Prov 8)--- then created all other things through Jesus. He always was and always will be.
Except for the eisegetical insertion about Michael you answered correctly. My Response: Yes, this is depicting YHWH/Jehovah describing Him as eternal, unchangeable, Creator of all things, although Jesus is not mentioned specifically. And these attributes are only true of God. As far as these verses applying to Almighty God alone we agree. In the margin of my copy of the NWT this section of Psalm 102 has a reference going to Hebrews 1:10-12.
Hebrews 1:8-12 NWT
8 But about the Son, he says: “God is your throne+ forever and ever, and the scepter of your Kingdom is the scepter of uprightness.* 9 You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you+ with the oil of exultation more than your companions.”+ 10 And: “At the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the works of your hands. 11 They will perish, but you will remain; and just like a garment, they will all wear out, 12 and you will wrap them up just as a cloak, as a garment, and they will be changed. But you are the same, and your years will never come to an end.”+
You reply: It is not calling Jesus God at Heb 1:8-12--- it clearly shows Jesus has a God, Companions mentioned are angels--Michael is Jesus.
I reply:
The issue of the grammar Hebrews 1:8-12 must first be addressed.
In verse 8 the "he" who is speaking is God the Father. Between the quotation marks are His statements. From the beginning of the quotation mark in verse 8 to the end of verse 9, where the first statement of God the Father ends with the closed quote it is spoken to the Son. Verse 10 begins with the conjunction "and" connecting the next quotation. There is no change of the subject speaking - the Father or the object spoken to - the Son. God the Father is still addressing the Son to the end of verse 12. You are correct stating that Psalm 102:25-27 is attributed to YHWH, Jehovah God and to Him alone. Your own Bible translation properly uses the English grammatical construction and yet, because of the bias of one's tradition, one does not see the clear and plain English language right before their eyes. I only ask that you would reread this section and reconsider your assumption according to what is written.
As you can see the personal pronouns are referring to verse 8 - the Son and without controversy the Son is Jesus Christ.
Your response: Facts of reality prove Jesus is not God. Jesus proves it when he calls the Father( one who sent him-John 5:30)John 17:3) The only true God. Either Jesus is lying or trinity teachers are lying. We all must choose who we believe. Paul believed Jesus-1Cor 8:6
You evaded any attempt to directly address the texts written in your own NWT. Even though you recognize that Ps.102 is speaking about YHWH and see that Heb.1 assigns the same attributes to Jesus you cannot reconcile God's Word and your Unitarian dogma. So instead of exegeting the text, as is normal in a debate, you must run down rabbit-trails with, what is seen by all as, absurd, irrelevant word-salad demonstrating that your bias controls your mind to the extent that you blind yourself to what you believe to be God's written revelation about Himself in your own version.
So here, now after 2 months and several entreaties, you can recover some dignity and compare and examine these text in an exegetical manner then give us your assessment.
How about responding to post 436 on page 22[/QUOTE
@kjw47 "I cannot respond to every post. I had 20 today it would take hours."
In this case it is taking months. I first presented Ps.102:25-28 NWT on July 17 on the thread "The Bible Declares that Jesus is God" post 749 page 38.
Long ago you laid the foundations of the earth,
And the heavens are the work of your hands.+
26 They will perish, but you will remain;
Just like a garment they will all wear out.
Just like clothing you will replace them, and they will pass away.
27 But you are the same, and your years will never end.+
28 The children of your servants will dwell securely,
And their offspring will be firmly established before you.”+
...with 2 questions: Who is the subject being described here? And what does this tell us about him?
You answered: God is being spoken of. God did it all--He created- Michael-Jesus) direct, first and last( Prov 8)--- then created all other things through Jesus. He always was and always will be.
Except for the eisegetical insertion about Michael you answered correctly. My Response: Yes, this is depicting YHWH/Jehovah describing Him as eternal, unchangeable, Creator of all things, although Jesus is not mentioned specifically. And these attributes are only true of God. As far as these verses applying to Almighty God alone we agree. In the margin of my copy of the NWT this section of Psalm 102 has a reference going to Hebrews 1:10-12.
Hebrews 1:8-12 NWT
8 But about the Son, he says: “God is your throne+ forever and ever, and the scepter of your Kingdom is the scepter of uprightness.* 9 You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you+ with the oil of exultation more than your companions.”+ 10 And: “At the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth, and the heavens are the works of your hands. 11 They will perish, but you will remain; and just like a garment, they will all wear out, 12 and you will wrap them up just as a cloak, as a garment, and they will be changed. But you are the same, and your years will never come to an end.”+
You reply: It is not calling Jesus God at Heb 1:8-12--- it clearly shows Jesus has a God, Companions mentioned are angels--Michael is Jesus.
I reply:
The issue of the grammar Hebrews 1:8-12 must first be addressed.
In verse 8 the "he" who is speaking is God the Father. Between the quotation marks are His statements. From the beginning of the quotation mark in verse 8 to the end of verse 9, where the first statement of God the Father ends with the closed quote it is spoken to the Son. Verse 10 begins with the conjunction "and" connecting the next quotation. There is no change of the subject speaking - the Father or the object spoken to - the Son. God the Father is still addressing the Son to the end of verse 12. You are correct stating that Psalm 102:25-27 is attributed to YHWH, Jehovah God and to Him alone. Your own Bible translation properly uses the English grammatical construction and yet, because of the bias of one's tradition, one does not see the clear and plain English language right before their eyes. I only ask that you would reread this section and reconsider your assumption according to what is written.
As you can see the personal pronouns are referring to verse 8 - the Son and without controversy the Son is Jesus Christ.
Your response: Facts of reality prove Jesus is not God. Jesus proves it when he calls the Father( one who sent him-John 5:30)John 17:3) The only true God. Either Jesus is lying or trinity teachers are lying. We all must choose who we believe. Paul believed Jesus-1Cor 8:6
You evaded any attempt to directly address the texts written in your own NWT. Even though you recognize that Ps.102 is speaking about YHWH and see that Heb.1 assigns the same attributes to Jesus you cannot reconcile God's Word and your Unitarian dogma. So instead of exegeting the text, as is normal in a debate, you must run down rabbit-trails with, what is seen by all as, absurd, irrelevant word-salad demonstrating that your bias controls your mind to the extent that you blind yourself to what you believe to be God's written revelation about Himself in your own version.
So here, now after 2 months and several entreaties, you can recover some dignity and compare and examine these text in an exegetical manner then give us your assessment.
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The Jehovah's Witnesses are being taught not to make assessments. It is a sin for them to do so.
So if they're not allowed to evaluate, estimate, analyze, consider, or interpret they cannot, therefore, logically engage in a rational debate. So they should be disallowed from entering into debate forums and have a "this is my opinion forum". But, of course, that would also entail assessments. However, more importantly, they have deeply sinned by translating a version of their own Bible for that also requires assessing. That is, in my estimation.
According to them, it is a fine thing for their "organizers" to do it. They do not call the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses leaders because they have to acknowledge Jehovah as their leader. There can be only one.
They believe the governing body of Jehovah's Witnesses has been given the authority to assess the scriptures.
They believe only they have been approved to do so.
He isn't. He is a parrot.
How can someone be so mindless and willingly blind?
Oeste
Well-Known Member
That would certainly explain why they can't seem to answer intelligently on this forum. Unless they can find the question at the bottom of a Watchtower publication they're at a total loss for answers.
It comes with a promise of everlasting life on a paradise Earth.
And, not only for his or her self. It is also the promise for the ones believing and doing like they say.
Watch your life and doctrine closely. Persevere in them, because if you do, you will save both yourself and your hearers. 1 Timothy 4:16
On top of that, they are taught that to listen to them is as to listen to Jehovah.
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Would you consider blinding yourself to accomplish God's will for a paradise Earth for yourself and perhaps for many more?
Proverbs 13:20
Proverbs 15:31
Isaiah 55:3
Proverbs 13:20
Proverbs 15:31
Isaiah 55:3
djhwoodwerks
Well-Known Member
Acts 17:10-11 (ASV) 10 And the brethren immediately sent away Paul and Silas by night unto Beroea: who when they were come thither went into the synagogue of the Jews. 11 Now these were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of the mind, examining the Scriptures daily, whether these things were so.
Nice try, but, these aren't the "teachers" who "keep making sure", it's the people who the teachers are teaching. Paul and Silas were doing the teaching, the Bereans were doing the "making sure all things". Which means, the Bereans did not just blindly accept what the Apostles taught, they "kept making sure".
kjw47
Well-Known Member
YHVH(Jehovah--always was and always will be.
The bible predicted the end--all the signs point to its closeness.