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Some questions about certain hadiths

TG123456

Active Member
Salaam Alaikum. I know this is not a Quran question, but I'm not sure where to put it.
If this is the wrong section, I apologize.

Is there a website or source that states which hadiths are authentic and which ones aren't, so when I look at a hadith I can tell which one is a record of what Muhammad said, and which isn't?

Would anyone know if the following hadiths in Sunan Abu Dawud are considered sahih?



(3) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The flourishing state of Jerusalem will be when Yathrib is in ruins, the ruined state of Yathrib will be when the great war comes, the outbreak of the great war will be at the conquest of constantinople and the conquest of constantinople when the Dajjal (Antichrist) comes forth. He (the Prophet) struck his thigh or his shoulder with his hand and said: This is as true as you are here or as you are sitting (meaning Mu'adh ibn Jabal). (Book #37, Hadith #4281)
(4) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The greatest war, the conquest of constantinople and the coming forth of the Dajjal (Antichrist) will take place within a period of seven months. (Book #37, Hadith #4282)
(5) Narrated Abdullah ibn Busr: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The time between the great war and the conquest of the city (constantinople) will be six years, and the Dajjal (Antichrist) will come forth in the seventh. (Book #37, Hadith #4283)


Search the word constantinople in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

Thanks so much!
 

Ingledsva

HEATHEN ALASKAN
Salaam Alaikum. I know this is not a Quran question, but I'm not sure where to put it.
If this is the wrong section, I apologize.

Is there a website or source that states which hadiths are authentic and which ones aren't, so when I look at a hadith I can tell which one is a record of what Muhammad said, and which isn't?

Would anyone know if the following hadiths in Sunan Abu Dawud are considered sahih?



(3) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The flourishing state of Jerusalem will be when Yathrib is in ruins, the ruined state of Yathrib will be when the great war comes, the outbreak of the great war will be at the conquest of constantinople and the conquest of constantinople when the Dajjal (Antichrist) comes forth. He (the Prophet) struck his thigh or his shoulder with his hand and said: This is as true as you are here or as you are sitting (meaning Mu'adh ibn Jabal). (Book #37, Hadith #4281)
(4) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The greatest war, the conquest of constantinople and the coming forth of the Dajjal (Antichrist) will take place within a period of seven months. (Book #37, Hadith #4282)
(5) Narrated Abdullah ibn Busr: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The time between the great war and the conquest of the city (constantinople) will be six years, and the Dajjal (Antichrist) will come forth in the seventh. (Book #37, Hadith #4283)


Search the word constantinople in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

Thanks so much!

I thought they were all outside the Qur'an - making ALL of them the works of man.


*
 

Ingledsva

HEATHEN ALASKAN
Some hadiths are considered the words of Muhammad that were accurately recorded, others aren't.

But none of them are in the Qur'an - which means men decided to give their ideas about what certain verses meant. Thus no-one should be required to follow them.

*
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Peace be on you.
Ahmadiyya Muslim point of view:

Quran is supreme and preserved as Allah exclusively promised.
Then practice of Holy Prophet pbuh.
Then comes Hadith

Quran is Judge.

More The Holy Prophet MuhammadAuthenticity-of-Hadith.pptx
wwwDOTalislamDOTorg/holyprophet/Authenticity-of-Hadith.pptx
 

TG123456

Active Member
Peace be on you.
Ahmadiyya Muslim point of view:

Quran is supreme and preserved as Allah exclusively promised.
Then practice of Holy Prophet pbuh.
Then comes Hadith

Quran is Judge.

More The Holy Prophet MuhammadAuthenticity-of-Hadith.pptx
wwwDOTalislamDOTorg/holyprophet/Authenticity-of-Hadith.pptx
Thank you for sharing this, DawudTalut.

I read through the requirements, and one of them is that the hadith do not contradict historical or scientific fact. Another is that there is a reliable chain of transmitters.

What happens if you get a hadith that has been reliably attributed to Muhammad through a proper chain of transmitters, yet contradicts not the Quran, but scientific and historical evidence outside of it?
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Peace be on you.
"yet contradicts not the Quran, but scientific and historical evidence outside of it?"

1-If it is not contradicting Quran, then it is right. It also should be seen whether one is correctly understanding particular verse of Quran and a particular hadith.

2-The door of prayer to Allah the Exalted is always open, one can pray to seek correct meanings and correlations; true seeker is always granted true light.

3-Scientific and historical evidence are supportive but findings are ever going phenomenon and sometimes it is hard to find fully impartial research e.g. there is research 'Moses did not exist' , others find 'Nazareth did not exist'. (i.e. no Jesus)...Quran tells they were great Prophets of Allah and tells their true events of life.
 
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TG123456

Active Member
Peace be on you.
"yet contradicts not the Quran, but scientific and historical evidence outside of it?"

1-If it is not contradicting Quran, then it is right. It also should be seen whether one is correctly understanding particular verse of Quran and a particular hadith.

2-The door of prayer to Allah the Exalted is always open, one can pray to seek correct meanings and correlations; true seeker is always granted true light.

3-Scientific and historical evidence are supportive but findings are ever going phenomenon and sometimes it is hard to find fully impartial research e.g. there is research 'Moses did not exist' , others find 'Nazareth did not exist'. (i.e. no Jesus)...Quran tells they were great Prophets of Allah and tells their true events of life.
Thank you for the response, DawudTalut. Is it a correct understanding that as long as a hadith does not contradict the Quran it is correct, and if it contradicts scientific and historical extra-Quranic evidence that is not relevant, as long as there is a clear transmission of narration?
 

mahasn ebn sawresho

Well-Known Member
Since the beginnings of Islam we rewriting modern Mohammadi
Muslims believe it was as
It did not oppose any Muslim
But today, after problems arose in conversations in that it does not fit with the human thought
Therefore, Muslims are trying to blur the truth
The various arguments
And Koranic school
TheKoranonly
Okay-
The Koranonly
And here show the great questions
1. How can a Muslim answer any ideas
2. How will the Muslims know the marriage of Zaynab Bint jahsh
3. How will the Muslim interpretation of the verses of the fighting

The truth of Islam suffers froma big problem
Hadith so fMuslimbooks
That they later repudiated this means they deny their religion also
4. written reasons come down and is one of the most important sources of Hadith Al-muhammadi
Can Muslimcancel wrotereasons come downtoo-.
5. you never know Islam without knowing the reasons for revelation-verses.
6. even if the Muslims of revision written conversations
They will not be able to revise the written reasons come down
Closed circuit
6. explain any algharanik-.-
7. the decrees of the Hajj
8. ritual prayer-
9. follow the Quran commands the actions of Muhammad and his
It is called year reporting and anec dotal and actual
Abstract
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That Islam falls mentally
If his study with an open mind-.
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Thank you for the response, DawudTalut. Is it a correct understanding that as long as a hadith does not contradict the Quran it is correct, and if it contradicts scientific and historical extra-Quranic evidence that is not relevant, as long as there is a clear transmission of narration?
Peace be on you. Would it not be helpful if people can see which particular hadith is in your view, maybe someone will be able to say something then?
 

Servant_of_the_One1

Well-Known Member
Good question! Wished i could answer yours.
From my limited knowledge i understand that only Sahih Bukhari and Sahih Musim are 100% authentic. The other books are mixure of authentic, good(second grade) or weak hadiths.
 

TG123456

Active Member
Salaam Alaikum, DawudTalut and Servant of the One. I pasted the hadiths in my first post on this thread, I will paste them again below.

(3) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The flourishing state of Jerusalem will be when Yathrib is in ruins, the ruined state of Yathrib will be when the great war comes, the outbreak of the great war will be at the conquest of constantinople and the conquest of constantinople when the Dajjal (Antichrist) comes forth. He (the Prophet) struck his thigh or his shoulder with his hand and said: This is as true as you are here or as you are sitting (meaning Mu'adh ibn Jabal). (Book #37, Hadith #4281)
(4) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The greatest war, the conquest of constantinople and the coming forth of the Dajjal (Antichrist) will take place within a period of seven months. (Book #37, Hadith #4282)
(5) Narrated Abdullah ibn Busr: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The time between the great war and the conquest of the city (constantinople) will be six years, and the Dajjal (Antichrist) will come forth in the seventh. (Book #37, Hadith #4283)


Search the word constantinople in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

Take care and thank you.
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Peace be on you.
Lets see the issue in broader sphere and start from the base, the Holy Quran.

1= In the first chapter of Holy Quran, believers are taught to pray to Allah to be shown right path; the path of those who were blessed and not of those who were received divine displeasure and not of those who went astray. Obviously these three categories existed in previous religions, they are mentioned as example in the prayer.

2= Initial and last verses Surah Kahf chapter 18 are said (by Holy Prophet s.a.w.) to be read to be saved against Dajjal. The subject in these two sections is warning against those who make associates of Allah and who disbelief.

3= Other verses of Holy Quran tells the signs of decays and role of associate makers and disbeliever in latter days.

4= Sayings of Holy Prophet tell some properties of Dajjal; like his donkey.... Dajjal’s donkey eats fire and it has an opening from which fire and smoke emerge. It moves with a very high speed over land, oceans and skies. Its color is very white like the moon. Between one step and another is like the walking of a day and a night. On earth its length is 180 ft. etc.

Dajjal, or anti-Christ and his donkey traversing great distance in shorter space of time in comparison to transportations of the time of the Holy Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w.) traversing the same distance are clear descriptions of an airplane. Its ears are the wings and the color “aqmar”, means pearly like the moon, is the color of many aircraft today.


Thus the Dajjal or anti-Christ is aeroplane or modern transportation.

Dajjal has only left eye. That is, missing of right eye means, no understanding of spirituality. Left eye connotes earthly understanding.


5= It is important to remember that when the Muslim Community became divided into sects many people began to fabricate Ahadith / Traditions to serve their respective interests. The fabrications were made to promote sectarian beliefs. ................ To cite all example: many Traditions recorded during the Abbaside times apparently speak of the Mahdi and his time. But their net effect is the suggestion that the pro-Abbaside disturbances in Khurasan were sanctioned and supported by God. That those Traditions were fabricated is proved by subsequent history. A thousand years have passed since those Traditions were recorded, but a Mahdi answering their description has not appeared in the world. Similarly, there are Traditions in which the signs announce- ing the time of the Mahdi have been mixed up with descriptions of past events. Unless the two are disentangled from each other, unless the past events which figure as signs of the future are clearly distinguished from the true signs of the future, we cannot reach the truth.


6= How to find true prophecies? ..... We can guard against mistakes and many a mischief created deliberately by interested persons. A chain of signs has to hang together. Any interpolation not fitting into the chain as whole can be spotted at once as something foreign and false.........The Holy Prophet pointed to, signs which it was not possible for anyone to bring together.........These are signs which have to wait on cosmic changes spread over hundreds of years. These signs no human beings, or groups of human beings working together for generations, could create..........It is many sided picture, cannot be faked by people. The true picture speaks by it self and it is for all to view. Otherwise that will happen what is happening in the world; people are amassing armies and killing each other.

Good wishes.




Sources:

Breaking News for Muslims & Christians: Dajjal / Anti-Christ Has Come! | The Muslim Times

@ Ahmadiyya Muslim Community

Page 279 @ https://www.alislam.org/books/essence3/essence-3.pdf
 

TG123456

Active Member
Salaam Alaikum, DawudTalut. Before I respond to your commentary on the Dajjal, can you please tell me whether the hadiths I cited are authentic or not? Thanks.
 

DawudTalut

Peace be upon you.
Peace be on you.
Allah the Exalted says about Holy Quran:

[15:1] In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
[15:2] Alif Lam Ra. These are verses of the Book and of the illuminating Qur’an.
[15:3] Often will the disbelievers wish that they were Muslims.
[15:4] Leave them alone that they may eat and enjoy themselves and that vain hope may beguile them; but they will soon know.
[15:5] And We have never destroyed any town but there was for it a known decree.
[15:6] No people can outstrip their appointed time, nor can they remain behind.
[15:7] And they said, ‘O thou to whom this Exhortation has been sent down, thou art surely a madman.
[15:8] ‘Why dost thou not bring angels to us, if thou art of the truthful?’
[15:9] We do not send down angels but by due right, and then they are granted no respite.
[ch 15, v 10 ] Verily, We Ourself have sent down this Exhortation, and most surely We will be its Guardian.
(alislamDOTorg/quran)

1=Kindly note the perfect authenticity is for Holy Quran. Other things shall be seen in its light.

2=General principle has been told about what is at which level of certainty.

3=I would leave the matter of such Hadith and others like it, to Allah (because of human humbleness, which one likes to exercise.)
and would stay with the Quran, supportive Ahadith and explanations of this era's Promised Reformer (devotee of Holy Prophet s.a.w. ).....People in previous religions insisted on such Sayings in their creed and got involved so much that when God sent new Prophet, they rejected him. Thus it is dangerous path. Religious truth are learned from many sources.

4=The world's situation is also showing that time of such discussions is gone too....When sun shines, it is not discussed that certain statements bearing certain names say it is not shining. Easy!

Good wishes.
 
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TG123456

Active Member
Peace be on you.
Allah the Exalted says about Holy Quran:

[15:1] In the name of Allah, the Gracious, the Merciful.
[15:2] Alif Lam Ra. These are verses of the Book and of the illuminating Qur’an.
[15:3] Often will the disbelievers wish that they were Muslims.
[15:4] Leave them alone that they may eat and enjoy themselves and that vain hope may beguile them; but they will soon know.
[15:5] And We have never destroyed any town but there was for it a known decree.
[15:6] No people can outstrip their appointed time, nor can they remain behind.
[15:7] And they said, ‘O thou to whom this Exhortation has been sent down, thou art surely a madman.
[15:8] ‘Why dost thou not bring angels to us, if thou art of the truthful?’
[15:9] We do not send down angels but by due right, and then they are granted no respite.
[ch 15, v 10 ] Verily, We Ourself have sent down this Exhortation, and most surely We will be its Guardian.
(alislamDOTorg/quran)

1=Kindly note the perfect authenticity is for Holy Quran. Other things shall be seen in its light.

2=General principle has been told about what is at which level of certainty.

3=I would leave the matter of such Hadith and others like it, to Allah (because of human humbleness, which one likes to exercise.)
and would stay with the Quran, supportive Ahadith and explanations of this era's Promised Reformer (devotee of Holy Prophet s.a.w. ).....People in previous religions insisted on such Sayings in their creed and got involved so much that when God sent new Prophet, they rejected him. Thus it is dangerous path. Religious truth are learned from many sources.

4=The world's situation is also showing that time of such discussions is gone too....When sun shines, it is not discussed that certain statements bearing certain names say it is not shining. Easy!

Good wishes.
Thanks for that, though I'm not sure if you have answered my question. Are the hadiths cited above authentic teachings of Muhammad? Are they sahih or daeef?

You mention supportive ahadith. How do you know if they were actually things Muhammad said?

Who is this era's promised reformer, and why should we stay with him?

Thanks so much?
 

Harikrish

Active Member
The prophet Mohammad was not an authority on what he recited. He was an illiterate Arab and therefore not a scholar with any authority on the subject and that refers to the Quran. The Hadiths are even more dubious because they were not revealed by Gabriel to the illiterate prophet.
Someone said when the Hadiths agree with the Quran they should be accepted. Where they disagree the Quran should be considered first.
That is like rape. When the victim and rapist agree on the circumstances it is rape. When they disagree it is not rape.
Unfortunately the Sharia law is based on the Hadiths. So when the Quran and hadiths disagree , the Sharia law will side with the Hadith's. This is a fundamental flaw with Islam. Muslims follow the Hadiths because it tells them what they should do. But the Quran tells them what they should be. You can see why their actions are always in conflict with their beliefs. And it doesn't help when the majority of Muslims are illiterate.
 

TashaN

Veteran Member
Premium Member
Salaam Alaikum. I know this is not a Quran question, but I'm not sure where to put it.
If this is the wrong section, I apologize.

Is there a website or source that states which hadiths are authentic and which ones aren't, so when I look at a hadith I can tell which one is a record of what Muhammad said, and which isn't?

Would anyone know if the following hadiths in Sunan Abu Dawud are considered sahih?



(3) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The flourishing state of Jerusalem will be when Yathrib is in ruins, the ruined state of Yathrib will be when the great war comes, the outbreak of the great war will be at the conquest of constantinople and the conquest of constantinople when the Dajjal (Antichrist) comes forth. He (the Prophet) struck his thigh or his shoulder with his hand and said: This is as true as you are here or as you are sitting (meaning Mu'adh ibn Jabal). (Book #37, Hadith #4281)
(4) Narrated Mu'adh ibn Jabal: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The greatest war, the conquest of constantinople and the coming forth of the Dajjal (Antichrist) will take place within a period of seven months. (Book #37, Hadith #4282)
(5) Narrated Abdullah ibn Busr: The Prophet (peace_be_upon_him) said: The time between the great war and the conquest of the city (constantinople) will be six years, and the Dajjal (Antichrist) will come forth in the seventh. (Book #37, Hadith #4283)


Search the word constantinople in the Hadith (Hadis) Books (Sahih Al-Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abu-Dawud, and Malik's Muwatta)

Thanks so much!

I looked up the hadith. It's weak "Daeef", not "Sahih". I only found arabic source which explained why it is so in details.

تنزيه السنة الشريفة عن الأحاديث الموضوعة و الضعيفة: حديث : "عمران بيت المقدس خراب يثرب، وخراب يثرب خروج الملحمة..." .
 

TG123456

Active Member
Thanks so much, TashaN. I thought so also, but wanted to make sure.

LOL I put the Arabic into "Google Translate" and word-for-word translations in any language rarely make sense, but I'm taking your word for it. :)
 

TashaN

Veteran Member
Premium Member
You are most welcome. If you want to double check, you can send it to anyone you know who can speak arabic. :)
 
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