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Socialism is as American as apple pie. Yes, really

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
Socialism is as American as apple pie. Yes, really

When socialism was at its peak in the US, socialists held 1,200 offices in 340 cities, with two congressmen, dozens of state legislators and more than 130 mayors
...
Under the Socialists, Milwaukee gained a reputation as a well-managed municipality …They built community parks, including beautiful green spaces and recreation areas along the lakefront that are still widely used. They increased the citywide minimum wage (28 years before the federal government adopted the idea) and established an eight-hour day standard for municipal workers. They championed public education for the city’s children, built excellent libraries and sponsored vibrant recreation programs.
...
Daniel Hoan, the longest-serving of the three Socialist mayors, was so popular among the city’s residents that he was in office for 24 years. In 1936, Hoan was featured on the cover of Time magazine, which said that under his administration, “Milwaukee has become perhaps the best governed city in the US.” Milwaukee “won many awards for being among the safest and healthiest cities in the country,” and “regularly had among the lowest rates of infant mortality and epidemic diseases of any American city”.
...
Burlington is now widely heralded as an environmentally friendly, lively, and livable city with a thriving economy, including one of the lowest jobless rates in the country. Burlingtonians give Sanders credit for steering the city in a new direction that, despite early skepticism, proved to be broadly popular with voters.
 

ImmortalFlame

Woke gremlin
Socialism is as American as apple pie. Yes, really

When socialism was at its peak in the US, socialists held 1,200 offices in 340 cities, with two congressmen, dozens of state legislators and more than 130 mayors
...
Under the Socialists, Milwaukee gained a reputation as a well-managed municipality …They built community parks, including beautiful green spaces and recreation areas along the lakefront that are still widely used. They increased the citywide minimum wage (28 years before the federal government adopted the idea) and established an eight-hour day standard for municipal workers. They championed public education for the city’s children, built excellent libraries and sponsored vibrant recreation programs.
...
Daniel Hoan, the longest-serving of the three Socialist mayors, was so popular among the city’s residents that he was in office for 24 years. In 1936, Hoan was featured on the cover of Time magazine, which said that under his administration, “Milwaukee has become perhaps the best governed city in the US.” Milwaukee “won many awards for being among the safest and healthiest cities in the country,” and “regularly had among the lowest rates of infant mortality and epidemic diseases of any American city”.
...
Burlington is now widely heralded as an environmentally friendly, lively, and livable city with a thriving economy, including one of the lowest jobless rates in the country. Burlingtonians give Sanders credit for steering the city in a new direction that, despite early skepticism, proved to be broadly popular with voters.
Except that apple pie is English: recipe from 1381 below.......:D
Apple pie - Wikipedia
Typical bloody Americans - always taking credit for things we Brits did first. Apple pies, industrialization, outlawing slavery, oligarchy, global imperialism, de-humanization of native peoples, the slave trade, political corruption, sexual repression, unfunny studio sitcoms, James Corden...

You'll never get your hands on our stiff upper lips, though!
 

ImmortalFlame

Woke gremlin
Why are US citizens so frightened about the word 'Socialism'??
Decades of subtle (and less subtle) indoctrination by Capitalist oligarchs and corporations to instill in the American people the ideal that those who have power and money inherently deserve it, and those who don't have either need only "work harder" to achieve it, and the advancing of the myth that America is a classless society where everybody is equal and nobody is a victim of systemic oppression, therefore nobody (or, almost nobody) should need "hand outs" at the expense of their Capitalist overlords.
 

ImmortalFlame

Woke gremlin
Decades of subtle (and less subtle) indoctrination by Capitalist oligarchs and corporations to instill in the American people the ideal that those who have power and money inherently deserve it, and those who don't have either need only "work harder" to achieve it, and the advancing of the myth that America is a classless society where everybody is equal and nobody is a victim of systemic oppression, therefore nobody (or, almost nobody) should need "hand outs" at the expense of their Capitalist overlords.
"Nanny's" gonna make them share. And make them play nice with the other kids. Waaaaaaahhh!
That's a more snappy way of putting it.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
Typical bloody Americans - always taking credit for things we Brits did first. Apple pies, industrialization, outlawing slavery, oligarchy, global imperialism, de-humanization of native peoples, the slave trade, political corruption, sexual repression, unfunny studio sitcoms, James Corden...

You'll never get your hands on our stiff upper lips, though!

Jet engines, disc brakes
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
Typical bloody Americans - always taking credit for things we Brits did first. Apple pies, industrialization, outlawing slavery, oligarchy, global imperialism, de-humanization of native peoples, the slave trade, political corruption, sexual repression, unfunny studio sitcoms, James Corden...

You'll never get your hands on our stiff upper lips, though!
Yes, we put those in the bin ourselves, when the Princess of Wales died.

Harrumph! Bloody country - going to the dogs - make that another pink gin, barman.
 

Stevicus

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
Why are US citizens so frightened about the word 'Socialism'??

It wasn't always that way. Before Reagan, "socialism" was not really that much of a dirty word, not as bad as "communism" was. Back then, there was a distinction made between the two terms in that communism was revolutionary and radical, while socialism was evolutionary and moderate.

I never really heard the word "socialist" used disparagingly until the 1980s, on The Morton Downey Jr. Show. Many may not remember Mr. Downey, but he became the quintessential conservative capitalist of his time - and his example has been followed by capitalists ever since. He remains the embodiment of capitalist thought and intellectualism. (Well, he and Wally George.)
 

exchemist

Veteran Member
It wasn't always that way. Before Reagan, "socialism" was not really that much of a dirty word, not as bad as "communism" was. Back then, there was a distinction made between the two terms in that communism was revolutionary and radical, while socialism was evolutionary and moderate.

I never really heard the word "socialist" used disparagingly until the 1980s, on The Morton Downey Jr. Show. Many may not remember Mr. Downey, but he became the quintessential conservative capitalist of his time - and his example has been followed by capitalists ever since. He remains the embodiment of capitalist thought and intellectualism.
In Britain the term has also been used disparagingly, at least since I was in my teens, back in the 1970s. The Labour Party used to be called "socialist", by people on the right who wanted to frighten people about this aspect of its world view.

The party historically was rather ambiguous about this, though Clause IV of its constitution, drafted by the (definitely socialist) Webbs in the year of the Russian Revolution did in theory commit it to common ownership of the means of production, distribution and exchange i.e. the whole economy. There is, or was, also a strong strand of more pragmatic centre-left thinking, often referred to as social democrat, by analogy with similarly named parties on the continent. People used to say the party owed more to Methodism than to Marx.

No major politician in the USA is anywhere near being really socialist, as far as I can see.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
The very fact that you wish to justify and force any restrictive form of governmental control on a free people is the better argument against your position.
 

Laika

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
The very fact that you wish to justify and force any restrictive form of governmental control on a free people is the better argument against your position.

I'm more concerned that this is just another "hope and change" propaganda effort by the Democratic Party to keep the people as slaves. When you put a black man in the White House racism didn't end. So now if we put a socialist in the White House are we really supposed to believe capitalism ends? It looks like another personality cult and not much more based on the lie that a President Sanders can do as he pleases. After years of failed gun control and healthcare reforms you'd hope people take a step back...

The greater danger is that socialism is purely rhetorical and propagandistic and isn't driven by the strength of character to know right from wrong. The shallowness of the transformation makes it look like fools gold and not the real thing. There is no depth of understanding of what people are asking behind this.
 

BSM1

What? Me worry?
I'm more concerned that this is just another "hope and change" propaganda effort by the Democratic Party to keep the people as slaves. When you put a black man in the White House racism didn't end. So now if we put a socialist in the White House are we really supposed to believe capitalism ends? It looks like another personality cult and not much more based on the lie that a President Sanders can do as he pleases. After years of failed gun control and healthcare reforms you'd hope people take a step back...

The greater danger is that socialism is purely rhetorical and propagandistic and isn't driven by the strength of character to know right from wrong. The shallowness of the transformation makes it look like fools gold and not the real thing. There is no depth of understanding of what people are asking behind this.


Well said.
 
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