1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Should Western governments end no fault divorce?

Discussion in 'International Politics' started by danieldemol, Jun 3, 2022.

  1. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein I'm not deaf, I'm just a real bad listener
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    36,572
    Ratings:
    +22,256
    Religion:
    Catholic Christian
    I just think that divorce should be the last resort because of the suffering and hardship it causes children, regardless of how I feel about it spiritually.
     
  2. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Everyone believes their marriage is a good one.
    But many find out later that it isn't.
    You'd force them to stay together, Taliban style, eh.
    Every promise is a lifelong bond to be enforced
    by government, even if the parties involved want
    to renegotiate, eh?
    That sounds very fascist to me.
     
  3. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    You & your spouse are free to see it that way.
    But to have government impose it upon the
    unwilling is heinous.
     
  4. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein I'm not deaf, I'm just a real bad listener
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 14, 2012
    Messages:
    36,572
    Ratings:
    +22,256
    Religion:
    Catholic Christian
    Now we're just going in circles.
     
  5. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Just following you.
     
  6. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Messages:
    30,483
    Ratings:
    +21,088
    Religion:
    Agnostic
    Not at all. No one is being forced to get married.
     
  7. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    I think you know that's not being argued.
    But you need to argue something
    you can win, eh.
     
    #67 Revoltingest, Jun 8, 2022
    Last edited: Jun 8, 2022
    • Like Like x 1
  8. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Veteran Member
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2015
    Messages:
    10,387
    Ratings:
    +16,878
    Religion:
    Irreligious Agnostic Atheistic Apatheist
    My marriage contract nor verbal oath said any such thing. And I reject adding Christian values to my marriage which deliberately did not have any bibles in sight.
    Marriage is a way that my husband and I merged our material assets and decision making power in medical and legal matters. Our commitment isn't tied up in our marriage contract and I would never find reason to force my partner to stay if they were unhappy.
     
  9. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Messages:
    30,483
    Ratings:
    +21,088
    Religion:
    Agnostic
    Well, if you're going to throw terms like "Taliban" and "fascist" at me, it seems that you're the one who is confused about what is or what isn't being argued.
     
  10. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    If the shoe fits.
     
  11. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Messages:
    30,483
    Ratings:
    +21,088
    Religion:
    Agnostic
    And if it works for you and you're happy, then more power to you. I have no quarrel with that. I wasn't actually advocating that anyone be forced to remain married, but just pointing out a relevant fact. My observation is that there are many people who enter into such arrangements frivolously and recklessly, and can oftentimes cause a great deal of damage to other involved parties when things explode. Very often, society has to clean up the damage.
     
  12. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Messages:
    30,483
    Ratings:
    +21,088
    Religion:
    Agnostic
    It doesn't, even as much as you want it to. That's your illusion, not mine.
     
  13. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    It's fascinating how liberals will support
    needlessly intrusive & restrictive laws,
    but only see "fascism" on the other side.
     
  14. Stevicus

    Stevicus Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2011
    Messages:
    30,483
    Ratings:
    +21,088
    Religion:
    Agnostic
    Yes, fascinating, isn't it?
     
  15. ADigitalArtist

    ADigitalArtist Veteran Member
    Staff Member Premium Member

    Joined:
    Feb 1, 2015
    Messages:
    10,387
    Ratings:
    +16,878
    Religion:
    Irreligious Agnostic Atheistic Apatheist
    Imo if we stopped pretending that getting married is the real way to show commitment and focused on better communication and emotional availability in relationships, that would do a lot more for curtailing reckless contract signing than at-fault divorce.

    Part of the reason I deliberately kept everything about my wedding secular was because I think traditional ceremonies promote unhealthy attachment styles. But I would never try to mandate how much other people should try to save their marriage, which there is a lot of in this debate.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  16. Truth in love

    Truth in love Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2022
    Messages:
    2,467
    Ratings:
    +550
    Religion:
    Restored Church of Jesus Christ
    Yes and we are stuck paying the bill for the breach of contract. Maybe stronger marge laws are the lesser of the evils?
     
  17. Heyo

    Heyo Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Aug 1, 2019
    Messages:
    12,651
    Ratings:
    +12,070
    Religion:
    none
    Yes, but it is sooo easy to get married (and have children).
    If you let people marry who may not be able to see the consequences, you are complicit in the failure of the marriage.
    So, before you make divorce more difficult, you should make marriage more difficult. The difficulty to exit a contract should be reflected in the difficulty to enter it.
    Otherwise I call it entrapment.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  18. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    7,077
    Ratings:
    +7,072
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    Because at fault divorce is still divorce, so you are still getting the harm to the children of divorce.

    The only difference between at fault divorce and no fault divorce is that at fault divorce incentivise people who no longer want their marriage to throw false accusations of fault at each other.

    This does two things.

    1. It fosters conflict which is harmful for the children.
    2. It creates an obstacle to reconciliation of the marriage.

    So since the outcome is the same (divorce), it makes sense to get there in the manner that is the least harmful to children and future reconciliation opportunities.

    In my opinion.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. Revoltingest

    Revoltingest Abnormal before it was fashionable
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 25, 2010
    Messages:
    219,629
    Ratings:
    +85,282
    Religion:
    Atheist
    Marriage micro-management by government
    has appeal to fans of big government & big
    religion. They seek security & social good by
    telling us all what to do.
    Unlike liberals, conservatives, & fundies, we
    libertarians prefer to minimize governmental
    control. Allow it only where really necessary.
    Parents & kids survive divorce...quite well in
    my observations.
     
  20. Truth in love

    Truth in love Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 29, 2022
    Messages:
    2,467
    Ratings:
    +550
    Religion:
    Restored Church of Jesus Christ
    very damaged according to research and I get the core Argument for minimal control I’m a fan of the concept. However given the high rates of dad not meeting obligations, the abuse the kids likely suffer and hand me down crimes etc that happen I think as a society we need to make a change. It could be done without government, but a zero pressure to care for kids mentality I don’t think can end well.
     
Loading...