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Should we have to use pronouns?

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by K8_reid, Apr 7, 2019.

  1. Flame

    Flame ( ͡~ ͜ʖ ͡° )

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    [​IMG]
     
    #21 Flame, Apr 7, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2019
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  2. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

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    You would prefer that your religion to be treated with respect even by those who disagree with it, correct?
     
  3. Liu

    Liu Active Member

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    I'm certainly not in favour of this being enforced by law.

    It seems very rude to me, though, to intentionally use the wrong pronouns in reference to someone if you know that you are hurting that person's feelings by doing so.

    Also, out of curiosity - once someone has transitioned and looks like the opposite gender - would you still use the pronouns of their biological sex if talking about them? Especially when talking about them with a person who doesn't even know that that other person is transgender (or didn't know it before you told them)?
     
  4. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    Medical doctors are going to still have to use the actual biological sex regardless. Reality speaks far louder than pronouns for the sensitive.
     
  5. Liu

    Liu Active Member

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    None of my doctors who knows I'm transgender used "she", even before I officially changed my gender to male in my ID card.
    But I don't live in the US, so...
     
  6. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    I'm just thinking in terms of genetics rather than legalism. Most doctors are extremely astute yet I'm sure will maintain professionalism and respectability during consultations.

    I think that's a good thing.
     
  7. Sky Rivers

    Sky Rivers Active Member

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    Some do, some don’t. I only care that I have the same basic rights as anyone else and that my faith isn’t illegal.
     
    #27 Sky Rivers, Apr 7, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 7, 2019
  8. Father Heathen

    Father Heathen Veteran Member

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    I doubt @Nowhere Man has a medical license, so he's simply making presumptions regarding 'bedside manner' with transgender patients.
     
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  9. Sky Rivers

    Sky Rivers Active Member

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    If I can’t tell, I can’t tell. *Shrugs*
     
  10. Liu

    Liu Active Member

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    I meant, if you knew.
     
  11. Skwim

    Skwim Veteran Member

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    .

    Good manners should not be a matter of law.

    .
     
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  12. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    I worked in a city hospital before I went back to trucking. Been around enough doctors to know what 'bedside manor' is. :Op
     
  13. Shad

    Shad Veteran Member

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    Should? Is this a question of mannerism or duty? People use should when they mean "ought to" at times.

    Enforced by law? Absolutely not. I reject giving the government the power to dictate what words I must use and punish me if I do not. I can see many think there is a good intention behind it but as the saying goes. "The road to hell is paved with good intentions" Be careful what kind of power government is granted lest it be turned against you.
     
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  14. Dan From Smithville

    Dan From Smithville Well-Known Member
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    I do not think we need more laws telling us how to speak or think. I am all for respect, courtesy and decorum, but I am against having one model of it enforced by statute.

    I have encountered people that I could not readily identify to gender. Out of courtesy, I avoided, as much as possible, arbitrarily assigning my interpretation until I had determined the correct identification. Sometimes, I never did. That is a choice that I value having.

    I do not condone being disrespectful to anyone that lives as a gender opposite of the one they were considered to be at birth. If behaving badly is your thing, I think you have more to worry about than how others identify themselves.
     
  15. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Pyrphóros ⚡ Lux Aeterna
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    Huh? Trans people don't have the same medical needs as their cis counterparts. A female to male person who is on hormones and has surgery has different medical needs than a cis woman. If he has genital surgery and has his female organs removed, he would go to see a urologist, not a gynecologist.
     
  16. Nowhere Man

    Nowhere Man Bompu Zen Man with a little bit of Bushido.

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    I'm just using male to female because from what I understand, falls in the vast majority of gender reassignment as well as being dominant in much of the media.

    But I definitely consider you an authority givin your first hand experiences so far in regards to female to male. Your personal Insight into the matter no doubt has been valuable to a lot of people here.
     
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  17. Saint Frankenstein

    Saint Frankenstein Pyrphóros ⚡ Lux Aeterna
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    It's definitely more dominant in the media, but I'm not sure if trans women are so dominant numerically. It's about equal in my experience. It's just harder to say, because trans men just tend into cis society much easier because of the effects of testosterone therapy. Many of us go stealth after and don't consider themselves part of the trans community.

    Thanks.
     
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  18. Thief

    Thief Rogue Theologian

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    similar to other things....
    I don't think a choice I have made for myself should be forced upon someone else

    if I dress or behave in a manner that confuse the next guy
    and he insists on making a call as he sees it....too bad for me


    and the backlash helps to define the line drawn

    if you put yourself out there.....someone will point a finger
    and you might get your feelings hurt

    if the next guy can't tell WHAT you are.....that's his fault?

    and YOUR presentation of WHAT a gender should be
    is not the line drawn
     
  19. Liu

    Liu Active Member

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    From statistics on people having their gender legally changed here in Germany, the number of male-to-females is not higher than the number of female-to-males.
     
  20. Valjean

    Valjean Veteran Member
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    Is this a question about etiquette, propriety and law, or about linguistics. I took it to be about linguistics, but everyone else has run with a whole different interpretation.
     
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