Should Transgender Athletes compete in sports?

[Epic Beard Man]

According to The Daily Signal which is a conservative journalist website, biological males who are transgender competing in women's sports create an unfair advantage for born females. Hormonal treatments aside, allowing transgender women who were born male, to compete in what they call "natural female" (I'm paraphrasing here) competition sets a precedent of creating an environment where there is backlash if transgender women become successful. Citing Martina Navratilova, the first openly gay female tennis player felt that any criticism of trans athletes competing would bully others into be silent. According to the article, "Navratilova bluntly called the practice of allowing biologically male athletes to compete in women’s sports “insane” and said “it’s cheating" (Source).

It would appear that the debate concerning trans athletes competing is not necessarily their identity per se rather its a question about fairness. According to Outsports.com:

"It’s easy to understand why. Sports rules and regulations exist to create a “fair” playing field for competitors. Olympic rules regulate the use of performance-enhancing drugs. NCAA rules tell teams how much they team can practice, and how often. NFL rules outline parameters to make sure a defensive back doesn’t get an “unfair” advantage over a receiver. Even mixed martial arts, which seems to the casual observer to be a clash of anarchy, has rules.

Without rules to govern fairness, we don’t have sports." -Source

The argument continues:

"In a world where we’re told that men are always more athletic, stronger and faster than women, that’s what they see. Someone perceived as being “once a man” can’t possibly be on an equal playing field with women. At least, that’s how the thinking of a lot of people goes.

Yet having an honest conversation about the fairness of trans women in sports mandates a conversation about the concept of fairness itself, and the different ways it can be applied to sports and life."

Thoughts?

 

[Augustus]

With the amount of money at play in many sports it does seem like a system that is open to abuse if all it takes is identifying as a female to compete in women's sport.

Even regarding people who being perfectly honest with their preferred gender identity, with increasing social acceptability of transgender identities will mean an increase in the number of athletes. Elite athletes are very rare, but high level sub-elite athletes are far more common. Even if one in several hundred people were transgender, this would lead to total domination of female sports.

Without doping, around 10.7s is about the level an all time elite female sprinter can reach (given the prevalence of doping perhaps even this is optimistic). An elite boy's sprinter could smash this time aged 14.

In certain sports, particularly boxing, there is also a genuine risk of serious injury with mismatches. This is why they have weight categories after all.

There doesn't seem like an easy solution, being fair to trans women likely means being unfair to those born 'biologically female' who have have no chance of becoming elite athletes. This may well have a knock-on effect on women competing in sports at all levels.

There is no way I can see of being fair to all parties, so for me I'd say no as it is unfair to fewer people.

 

[Twilight Hue]

There should be a separate league for transgenders. Just like a men's league just like a woman's League there should be a transgender League.

Either that, or natural-born women in general are just going to give up contact sports in frustration.

 

[wellwisher]

There should be a separate league for transgenders. Just like a men's league just like a woman's League there should be a transgender League.

Either that, or natural-born women in general are just going to give up contact sports in frustration.

Sports, both amateur and professional have a policy that athletes cannot use performance enhancing drugs. The transgenders are on various drugs and therefore violate the drug policy. The policy is very strict to where even over the counter meds can cause a violation.

If an exception is made of transgender, then why can't athletes, who have a different body image, than what natural at birth; more muscle mass, use steroids? Sports require that you use what nature gave you at birth, without any chemical or physical alterations, beyond diet, exercise and training. Transgenders should not be allowed to play by a different standard that includes surgery and drugs, since the rest of the athletes cannot also cheat this way using a body image argument.

For example, instead of transgender, say I decided I am a cheetah in a human body. Could I have science and medicine give me longer and stronger legs and drug supplements to maintain the transplant? The answer is no, this would be considered a violation.

 

[Erebus]

Yes.

Do away with gender divisions entirely and divide sports into categories based on weight, height or muscle mass as required. That's already the case in some sports as has already been pointed out.
Is that a perfect solution? No, of course not. There's no way I can think of to make any sport 100% fair for everybody involved. Somebody naturally muscular is going to have an advantage in certain sports than somebody who has to train twice as much just to reach that level. That's always been the case and isn't going to change.

It still makes a lot more sense than a simple gender division in my opinion though and would probably reduce unfairness overall. Gender division is after all based on averages rather than individual body types. Furthermore with the amount of physical checkups athletes go through anyway it shouldn't be that hard to set up.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

There should be a separate league for transgenders. Just like a men's league just like a woman's League there should be a transgender League.

Either that, or natural-born women in general are just going to give up contact sports in frustration.

Would say the same about someone like Michael Phelps?

Michael Phelps: The man who was built to be a swimmer

It's not clear at all that trans athletes have innate advantages; it is clear that Phelps does.

 

[Augustus]

It's not clear at all that trans athletes have innate advantages

Do you believe that biologically male athletes have innate advantages over biologically female athletes due to their physiology?

 

[Ponder This]

I think maybe it does relate to the question of identity, but people don't want to admit that. They want to say it's unfair, because they want to avoid saying that a person who claims to be a woman when he was born a man is really a man and not really a woman.

A man who dresses up as a woman is still a man dressed up as a woman. Everybody knows it, but like the Emperor's New Clothes, no one wants to say it. It's a social charade.

 

[SalixIncendium]

First, to address the poll question, I don't think anyone should be precluded from competing in sports.

That said, we already have clearly defined gender divisions in sports. We also have divisions based on physical abilities. So why would we not further divide to include a division for transgender athletes?

In my opinion, either eliminate all division and have everyone compete at the same level, or create a new one.

 

[Augustus]

It still makes a lot more sense than a simple gender division in my opinion though and would probably reduce unfairness overall.

It would mean the end of elite female athletes.

Someone like Serena Williams, who is one of the greatest athletes of all time, has said she would struggle to win even a single game in a match versus a top male player.

At any division, male athletes would dominate to the extent women were not represented at all.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Can you just imagine men who want to pretend to be women running around the women's dressing rooms or women who want to pretend to be men running around the men's dressing rooms? Sexes should be separated based on the physical body they were born with. A 5 foot 2 inch man who wants to pretend to be a 6 foot 6 inch basketball player does not make it true and a man who wants to pretend to be a woman and play women's sports does not make it true.

 

[Augustus]

Sports, both amateur and professional have a policy that athletes cannot use performance enhancing drugs. The transgenders are on various drugs and therefore violate the drug policy. The policy is very strict to where even over the counter meds can cause a violation.

Trans-women generally take performance limiting drugs, not performance enhancing ones.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Do you believe that biologically male athletes have innate advantages over biologically female athletes due to their physiology?

Are you assuming "biologically male" a "trans woman" are equivalent?

Under current rules, in order to compete, trans women have to bring their testosterone levels into the typical female range. Once that's done, it's unclear whether there's any advantage at all; some studies suggest that trans athletes are at a decided disadvantage in some sports:

On Transgender athletes and performance advantages | The Science of Sport

 

[firedragon]

According to The Daily Signal which is a conservative journalist website, biological males who are transgender competing in women's sports create an unfair advantage for born females. Hormonal treatments aside, allowing transgender women who were born male, to compete in what they call "natural female" (I'm paraphrasing here) competition sets a precedent of creating an environment where there is backlash if transgender women become successful. Citing Martina Navratilova, the first openly gay female tennis player felt that any criticism of trans athletes competing would bully others into be silent. According to the article, "Navratilova bluntly called the practice of allowing biologically male athletes to compete in women’s sports “insane” and said “it’s cheating" (Source).

It would appear that the debate concerning trans athletes competing is not necessarily their identity per se rather its a question about fairness. According to Outsports.com:

"It’s easy to understand why. Sports rules and regulations exist to create a “fair” playing field for competitors. Olympic rules regulate the use of performance-enhancing drugs. NCAA rules tell teams how much they team can practice, and how often. NFL rules outline parameters to make sure a defensive back doesn’t get an “unfair” advantage over a receiver. Even mixed martial arts, which seems to the casual observer to be a clash of anarchy, has rules.

Without rules to govern fairness, we don’t have sports." -Source

The argument continues:

"In a world where we’re told that men are always more athletic, stronger and faster than women, that’s what they see. Someone perceived as being “once a man” can’t possibly be on an equal playing field with women. At least, that’s how the thinking of a lot of people goes.

Yet having an honest conversation about the fairness of trans women in sports mandates a conversation about the concept of fairness itself, and the different ways it can be applied to sports and life."

Thoughts?

Transgenders should compete in the gender category they were born into.

 

[Erebus]

It would mean the end of elite female athletes.

Someone like Serena Williams, who is one of the greatest athletes of all time, has said she would struggle to win even a single game in a match versus a top male player.

At any division, male athletes would dominate to the extent women were not represented at all.

There is a gap in performance between men and women, there's no denying that. However, the factors I listed for categories are also the factors that are regularly brought up as the major reasons for this performance difference, i.e. weight, height and muscle mass. So yes, you would certainly see a lot more men in the highest weight range but that doesn't necessarily imply male domination among all categories.

 

[Mock Turtle]

Although it is a complex issue, if trans individuals were likely to clean up in many categories, I would think it better that they never competed or at least competed against those of the same ability. This is what many female athletes have complained about - for example, the Caster Semenya case - and where I believe she refused to take certain drugs so as to make her more equal. Very difficult subject.

Caster Semenya Loses Case to Compete as a Woman in All Races

 

[David1967]

Do you believe that biologically male athletes have innate advantages over biologically female athletes due to their physiology?

In some instances, I would say yes. Example; Wrestling, Boxing, that sort of thing. Things like tennis, probably not.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Although it is a complex issue, if trans individuals were likely to clean up in many categories, I would think it better that they never competed or at least competed against those of the same ability. This is what many female athletes have complained about - for example, the Caster Semenya case - and where I believe she refused to take certain drugs so as to make her more equal. Very difficult subject.

Caster Semenya Loses Case to Compete as a Woman in All Races

But Caster Semenya isn't trans; she just has naturally higher-than-typical levels of testosterone. I really don't see what's different between her case and Michael Phelps, whose body naturally produces lower-than-typical levels of lactic acid.

... or rather, I know exactly how they're different, but it has nothing to do with fairness or athletic performance: a woman with elevated levels of testosterone goes against traditional gender norms, but a man with reduced levels of lactic acid doesn't.

 

[Salvador]

There'd be no harm with allowing transgender people to compete in sports with each other. Perhaps, there could be a transgender wrestling federation or a transgender football league.

 

[Saint Frankenstein]

Oh, boy. I'm sure this will be a fruitful thread. I do wish it was started by quoting medical professionals instead of far-right transphobic morons, though. We should do our best to minimize those voices.

Anyway, of course trans people should be allowed to compete in sports. They should compete in the sport of the gender they live as, as long as they are on hormone replacement therapy and it is in the normal range of their identified sex.