Should there be harmony between science and religion?

[AdamRaja]

When should science be chosen over religion? If science has one conclusion and religion has another at what point do we accept science over religion? One view is that we should always believe science, even if it contradicts our most cherished religious beliefs. Another perspective is we should never abandon the 'truth' even though science appears to have completely proven our religious belief wrong. For many of us the truth will lie in between. We may believe in a God or gods that have the power to overcome the laws of the natural world.

The Baha'i perspective tends to favour science over religion but there are always exceptions.

God has endowed man with intelligence and reason whereby he is required to determine the verity of questions and propositions. If religious beliefs and opinions are found contrary to the standards of science they are mere superstitions and imaginations; for the antithesis of knowledge is ignorance, and the child of ignorance is superstition. Unquestionably there must be agreement between true religion and science. If a question be found contrary to reason, faith and belief in it are impossible… – Abdu’l-Baha

Religion and Science are inter-twined with each other and cannot be separated. These are the two wings with which humanity must fly. One wing is not enough. Every religion which does not concern itself with science is mere tradition…. Therefore science, education and civilization are most important necessities for the full religious life. – Abdu’l-Baha

So where does the balance lie for you? What would you never give up from your religion and when would you defer to science instead? Are religion and science in harmony or are they fundamentally opposed and contradictory?

Thank you for your comments.

Absolutely!
One is nothing without the other. Two sides of the same coin in a way.
I was born believing in God and taught science was bad..
Then, I grew with my own thinking and thought science was good and God was bad.
Now, I have found peace in seeing God and Science both exist as one item that is viewed differently.

Now, I know the question was just religion and not specifically about a religion that involved God but.. I added my own opinionated answer.
My view of God is not a bearded man in the sky holding a lightening bolt.. its much deeper.

 

[Audie]

Absolutely!
One is nothing without the other. Two sides of the same coin in a way.
I was born believing in God and taught science was bad..
Then, I grew with my own thinking and thought science was good and God was bad.
Now, I have found peace in seeing God and Science both exist as one item that is viewed differently.

Now, I know the question was just religion and not specifically about a religion that involved God but.. I added my own opinionated answer.
My view of God is not a bearded man in the sky holding a lightening bolt.. its much deeper.

How deep can you go with things that cannot be detected
or in any way shown to actually exist?

 

[AdamRaja]

Well, basically the only explanation for our existence is that there is some kinda life form that creates and exists..
Whether that be an intelligent force or random chaotic force it is the only explanation.. seeing that we are here.
Some call this force just energy maybe, but I call it God.

So, my depth is seeing the meaning behind the surface.

 

[Audie]

Well, basically the only explanation for our existence is that there is some kinda life form that creates and exists..
Whether that be an intelligent force or random chaotic force it is the only explanation.. seeing that we are here.
Some call this force just energy maybe, but I call it God.

So, my depth is seeing the meaning behind the surface.

I dont see a lot of depth in making things up and
then proclaiming them to be fact.

 

[AdamRaja]

I dont see a lot of depth in making things up and
then proclaiming them to be fact.

There is nothing made up. How do we exist?.. Some form of energy, right?
I call that energy God you can call it what you want but nothing is "made up."

 

[Audie]

There is nothing made up. How do we exist?.. Some form of energy, right?
I call that energy God you can call it what you want but nothing is "made up."

Where did you get the following info?

only explanation for our existence is that there is some kinda life form

 

[AdamRaja]

We are energy.
The only thing we know for sure is there is an energetic force into which allows our experience.
Call it energy or call it God.. the answer is the same to me.

 

[Looncall]

We are energy.
The only thing we know for sure is there is an energetic force into which allows our experience.
Call it energy or call it God.. the answer is the same to me.

This makes no sense. Please explain.

 

[AdamRaja]

This makes no sense. Please explain.

Don't know how to elaborate any more beyond that... The thing that makes us all be.. I call God.

 

[Audie]

Don't know how to elaborate any more beyond that... The thing that makes us all be.. I call God.

Ok so you did just make it up.

We can all read regular size font.

 

[AdamRaja]

Ok so you did just make it up.

We can all read regular size font.

It's bold.. not larger font. However, the boldness can make it appear larger!
Thanks for chatting. Our conversation is going no where for either of us so once it becomes childish banter about fonts I'd say it's time to move on.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

And look where that got us, living in filth and enjoying less than half the lifespan enjoyed today

I am not interested in a selective interview but if i remind you of an interview, please explain your reasoning.

My reference is to the Message given by Baha'u'llah in the mid 1800's. It is the bounty of God that he gives us the wisdom to advance

The interview is a good example as to how Science has to find a balance.

Regards Tony

You made a claim that god created the universe... Can you provide proof of this claim or is it just your opinion?

Billions means 1,000,000,000s

Man began manufacturing stone tools thousands of years ago.

God gives us insights into scientific possibilities so we can expand our minds. He then allows us to choose to use that wisdom to find more. If we choose not to, it takes longer to discover what has already been offered.

Before the start of modern science there are traditions and now much more has been given that point us in the right direction.

As to the size of the Universe this is a tradition given;

"..Consider the following well-known tradition and examine its meanings indicative of the vastness of the cosmos and its awesome limitless expanse: 'God, exalted be He, fashioned one hundred thousand, thousand lamps and suspended the Throne, the earth, the heavens and whatsoever is between them, even Heaven and Hell -- all of these in a single lamp. And only God knows what is in the rest of the lamps.' The fact that philosophers and sages have posited limits and restrictions for such matters is to be explained by the limitations of people~s minds and perceptions and the blindness of the followers of allusions, whose natures and intellects have been rendered dull and inanimate by the interposition of many veils...."

Thus all we have yet discovered is still inside a single lamp. Science has a lot to find.

In this day, Baha'u'llah has given many thoughs for science to consider.

Regards Tony

 

[ChristineM]

God gives us insights into scientific possibilities so we can expand our minds. He then allows us to choose to use that wisdom to find more. If we choose not to, it takes longer to discover what has already been offered.

Before the start of modern science there are traditions and now much more has been given that point us in the right direction.

As to the size of the Universe this is a tradition given;

"..Consider the following well-known tradition and examine its meanings indicative of the vastness of the cosmos and its awesome limitless expanse: 'God, exalted be He, fashioned one hundred thousand, thousand lamps and suspended the Throne, the earth, the heavens and whatsoever is between them, even Heaven and Hell -- all of these in a single lamp. And only God knows what is in the rest of the lamps.' The fact that philosophers and sages have posited limits and restrictions for such matters is to be explained by the limitations of people~s minds and perceptions and the blindness of the followers of allusions, whose natures and intellects have been rendered dull and inanimate by the interposition of many veils...."

Thus all we have yet discovered is still inside a single lamp. Science has a lot to find.

In this day, Baha'u'llah has given many thoughs for science to consider.

Regards Tony

Wrong, science gives insights into science. Any belief that god does is just confirmation bias

Traditions are fine for cultures. And can even aid science in a particular area.

He observable universe is around 93 billion light years across, no tradition but had science has determined that.

"one hundred thousand, thousand" small potatoes
It is estimated there up to 2 trillion galaxies in the universe each with around 100 to 700 billion stars

Thats a minimum of 1 billion trillion lamps. A number of suns that renders one hundred thousand, thousand miniscule, dull and inanimate when compared to reality.

You are quite welcome to use your modern computer and cell phone while putting your faith in your prophet. It actually makes no difference to the science and technology.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

Wrong, science gives insights into science. Any belief that god does is just confirmation bias

Traditions are fine for cultures. And can even aid science in a particular area.

He observable universe is around 93 billion light years across, no tradition but had science has determined that.

"one hundred thousand, thousand" small potatoes
It is estimated there up to 2 trillion galaxies in the universe each with around 100 to 700 billion stars

Thats a minimum of 1 billion trillion lamps. A number of suns that renders one hundred thousand, thousand miniscule, dull and inanimate when compared to reality.

You are quite welcome to use your modern computer and cell phone while putting your faith in your prophet. It actually makes no difference to the science and technology.

You are still just describing a limited part of the light in but One lamp.

Free your mind

Regards Tony

 

[ChristineM]

You are still just describing a limited part of the light in but One lamp.

Free your mind

Regards Tony

I have more lamps than you, many, many more.

I think it is you limiting your mind but you are unwilling to even consider freeing it so why should i limit mine to your expectation?

Prove there is more than the universe and ill review your evidence, until then reality wins.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

I have more lamps than you, many, many more.

I think it is you limiting your mind but you are unwilling to even consider freeing it so why should i limit mine to your expectation?

Prove there is more than the universe and ill review your evidence, until then reality wins.

Reality is what we make it. Choices pave our path in this life.

I wish you always the best of choices.

Regards Tony

 

[ChristineM]

Reality is what we make it. Choices pave our path in this life.

I wish you always the best of choices.

Regards Tony

No, reality is real, imagination is what we make it

 

[nPeace]

So, no examples as I requested.
Yes, science can be wrong. BUT it is peer reviewed and other scientists discover the mistakes.
Please give me an example of experimentation in religion

So peer reviewed means it is right? No.
What do you mean by mistakes are corrected?
I don't understand how that works.
Science is an ongoing study, used in seeking knowledge and understanding of things.
If the new discovery is learned later to be inaccurate, and the previous thrown out, how was the mistake corrected?
That's not how science works, does it?
It does not reach any conclusion and say, "Hey. This is it!"
Think of it as a one of many tools used to study.
We are free to draw conclusions.

The Bible says, prove all things.
As soon as I have the time, I will look for the posts where I showed how Christian test, experiment, observe things in relation to their faith.

 

[Evangelicalhumanist]

When should science be chosen over religion? If science has one conclusion and religion has another at what point do we accept science over religion? One view is that we should always believe science, even if it contradicts our most cherished religious beliefs. Another perspective is we should never abandon the 'truth' even though science appears to have completely proven our religious belief wrong. For many of us the truth will lie in between. We may believe in a God or gods that have the power to overcome the laws of the natural world.

The Baha'i perspective tends to favour science over religion but there are always exceptions.

God has endowed man with intelligence and reason whereby he is required to determine the verity of questions and propositions. If religious beliefs and opinions are found contrary to the standards of science they are mere superstitions and imaginations; for the antithesis of knowledge is ignorance, and the child of ignorance is superstition. Unquestionably there must be agreement between true religion and science. If a question be found contrary to reason, faith and belief in it are impossible… – Abdu’l-Baha

Religion and Science are inter-twined with each other and cannot be separated. These are the two wings with which humanity must fly. One wing is not enough. Every religion which does not concern itself with science is mere tradition…. Therefore science, education and civilization are most important necessities for the full religious life. – Abdu’l-Baha

So where does the balance lie for you? What would you never give up from your religion and when would you defer to science instead? Are religion and science in harmony or are they fundamentally opposed and contradictory?

Thank you for your comments.

It has always, for my entire life, been my view that if there is something that you must believe in spite of whatever evidence denies it, or lack of evidence supports it, then you are on the wrong track.

Science only works if it accounts for all the evidence, and if it tries to ignore some, it fails.

And therefore, I think that all religion that tries to ignore what is know through science, also fails, and cannot be trusted.

 

[TransmutingSoul]

It has always, for my entire life, been my view that if there is something that you must believe in spite of whatever evidence denies it, or lack of evidence supports it, then you are on the wrong track.

Science only works if it accounts for all the evidence, and if it tries to ignore some, it fails.

And therefore, I think that all religion that tries to ignore what is know through science, also fails, and cannot be trusted.

It is also important to consider that both Science and Religion evolve as our understandings progress.

Regards Tony