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Should smoking around children be considered child abuse or child endangerment?

MoonWater

Warrior Bard
Premium Member
Considering the effects of second hand smoke (and some have even claimed third-hand smoke on a smoker's clothes), should it be considered child abuse if a parent or caretaker regularly smokes around their child? Should it be considered child endangerment if someone lights up around children? At what point, if ever, should a child's right to health overrule a person's right to smoke?(Please note, whether or not smoking is or should be a protected right is not the subject of this thread)

And we are talking specifically about cigarrettes, not weed or any other kind of smoked drug.
 

beenie

Veteran Member
Staff member
Premium Member
I'd say yes because the child has no choice but to be around that parent. There is clear evidence regarding second-hand smoke and asthma in children, so therefore, they are endangering that child every time they smoke in an enclosed space, especially.

Source
Source

Third hand smoke is a bit more debatable, but if it's proven to be harmful, then I'd include that as well when it comes to minors.
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
Yes, but for legal purposes no; that's far too much arbitrary government intrusion into people's family lives.
 

Me Myself

Back to my username
I´d say it should even for legal purposes. They are flat out ***** their kids lungs because they are nicotine addicts.
 

Me Myself

Back to my username
In that case the kids should sue the parents.

1- That would be awesome

2- It shouldn´t be required that THEY sue their parents. Aren´t there agencies in US for preventing child endangerment or something?
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
No, not exactly. Yes, their health is damaged, they lose years of life expectancy and are at increased risk for early onset of diseases.

Not good. But consider, for example, that dense urban environments subject people to the same thing. Are they banned? Do we take cities and industry away? Heck, we built industry on broken backs and blackened lungs - not least of all children's.

Yep, we're better now, but honestly not by much. So, let's get back down to human terms.

A child is growing up in a reasonably loving home; one or both parents happens to be a smoker who's lax on doors and rooms and such seeming trivialities.

They have a good environment; ethical parents who teach ethics, support their education, etc., and they have, for all purposes, a positive life trajectory ahead of them - which, aside from the emotional and intellectual environent created by their family, is also greatly reinforced by say, lower-middle class or even working class economic basis; the family owns some assets, earn a decent living, and can afford to shape society's advantages around their child to a degree.

This is an immeasurably better point from which to live one's life than getting hauled out of your home and the only family you know because your parents are inconsiderate smokers, and packed off to a foster home where, if you're lucky enough to avoid outright physical, sexual and emotional abuse, is still going to be, in almost all cases, emotionally sterile, and unloving, with minimal "parental investment" in your life and future, and almost nothing in terms of economic support.

If it's in legal terms, the limits of enforcement need to be very clearly defined. I would support, for example, it being illegal to smoke in the same room as your child, with violation of this law translating to mandatory counseling, with rehab at most upon repeat offense, stay-at-home rehab for single parents.
 
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Me Myself

Back to my username
No, not exactly. Yes, their health is damaged, they lose years of life expectancy and are at increased risk for early onset of diseases.

Not good. But consider, for example, that dense urban environments subject people to the same thing. Are they banned? Do we take cities and industry away? Heck, we built industry on broken backs and blackened lungs - not least of all of children's.

Yep, we're better now, but honestly not by much. So, let's get back down to human terms.

A child is growing up in a reasonably loving home; one or both parents happens to be a smoker who's lax on doors and rooms and such seeming trivialities.

They have a good environment; ethical parents who teach ethics, support their education, etc., and they have, for all purposes, a positive life trajectory ahead of them - which, aside from the emotional and intellectual environent created by their family, is also greatly reinforced by say, lower-middle class or even working class economic basis; the family owns some assets, earn a decent living, and can afford to shape society's advantages around their child to a degree.

This is an immeasurably better point from which to live one's life than getting hauled out of your home and the only family you know because your parents are inconsiderate smokers, and packed off to a foster home where, if you're lucky enough to avoid outright physical, sexual and emotional abuse, is still going to be, in almost all cases, emotionally sterile, and unloving, with minimal "parental investment" in your life and future, and almost nothing in terms of economic support.

If it's in legal terms, the limits of enforcement need to be very clearly defined. I would support, for example, it being illegal to smoke in the same room as your child, with violation of this law translating to mandatory counseling, with rehab at most upon repeat offense, stay-at-home rehab for single parents.

That makes sense to me.
 

McBell

Resident Sourpuss
I'd say yes because the child has no choice but to be around that parent.
I disagree.
I did not smoke around my children until they started climbing up in my lap while I was smoking.

Currently there are specific areas of my house where I smoke.
Period.
If the kids do not want to be around the smoke, they stay out of the two areas (my "office" and patio) where my wife and I smoke.

None of my children have asthma, or any other "smoking related" issue.
 

Me Myself

Back to my username
Yes! your children should know better about the health risks of cigarrettes! If they don´t or if they do and they choose the least healthy scenario, that is their business! It´s not like you are his father or anyth... wait... hummm
 

McBell

Resident Sourpuss
Yes! your children should know better about the health risks of cigarrettes! If they don´t or if they do and they choose the least healthy scenario, that is their business! It´s not like you are his father or anyth... wait... hummm
**yawn**
If you are going to continue to make a complete **** of yourself, could you at the very least make it entertaining?
 

somethingNiftyhere

Squadoosh 1@ATime
Yes, but for legal purposes no; that's far too much arbitrary government intrusion into people's family lives.

Well, when the parent doesn't respect their child enough not to not intrude on the minor's lungs by smoking around them so that that child is then at risk for all diseases related to 2nd hand smoke, someone has to save the child from the parent that has no respect for their offspring.

Asthma, bronchitis, lung disease, allergies, are all at risk side effects that child would be subject to in the presence of an inconsiderate parent.

If the parent wants to die of lung cancer and all related disease associated with inhaling burning leaves, tar, freebased nicotine, etc... into their own lung tissue, at a premium cost per pack and/or carton of cancer sticks, they're free to suffocate to death when they're dying in hospital later.

But they have no right to take their child with them.

That's what child protective services is for. To save the child from unfit parents.
 

Shuddhasattva

Well-Known Member
Well, when the parent doesn't respect their child enough not to not intrude on the minor's lungs by smoking around them so that that child is then at risk for all diseases related to 2nd hand smoke, someone has to save the child from the parent that has no respect for their offspring.

Asthma, bronchitis, lung disease, allergies, are all at risk side effects that child would be subject to in the presence of an inconsiderate parent.

If the parent wants to die of lung cancer and all related disease associated with inhaling burning leaves, tar, freebased nicotine, etc... into their own lung tissue, at a premium cost per pack and/or carton of cancer sticks, they're free to suffocate to death when they're dying in hospital later.

But they have no right to take their child with them.

That's what child protective services is for. To save the child from unfit parents.


I find this totally realistic and emblematic of someone who has no idea of the harsh realities of life; let alone life in a foster home.

Many parents are just absent-minded. Smoking is a family tradition by now, and s forth - they picke dit ufrom their parents, it's completely normalized to them.



They might be loving, well-functioning individuals and in general considerate and solicitous of their children's health and general wellbeing, with this one (and other) blindspot(s). In fact, virtually every parent is going to have such blindspots in their consideration - parents are only human.

I will grant that there will be a correlation between parents who smoke around their kids and those who do not adequately care for them to begin with, but in no way can we assume there is even a major correlation, let alone causation.


You're dragging in all kinds of subjectified, arbitrary conjecture, without real heed for how it could be applied to make life hell for families - parents and children.

That's what child protective services is for. To save the child from unfit parents.

Yes, that's what they're for - which hardly means they achieve their mission; often the claimed deliverance is worst than the original situation, and represents yet another government intrusion into our lives.
 

idav

Being
Premium Member
I disagree.
I did not smoke around my children until they started climbing up in my lap while I was smoking.

Currently there are specific areas of my house where I smoke.
Period.
If the kids do not want to be around the smoke, they stay out of the two areas (my "office" and patio) where my wife and I smoke.

None of my children have asthma, or any other "smoking related" issue.

The kids don't even listen. I wanna go have smoke and all of a sudden they need something or wanna say something. My kids don't have any asthma issues either but I tell you, I could tell them not to touch the hot stove and ther'd be a debate about it lol.
 

Me Myself

Back to my username
o my.
I am, like, so totally, burned...
whatever can I do..?
:facepalm:

not really trying to "burn" you, though I do notice you tend to try this with almost everyone, so it doesn´t really surprise me you thought I was trying to do that with you, it is natural psychological projection.

I just saw a perfectly fitting place to tell you something that´s been on my mind about your posts for long, which is precisely that: you overplay sarcastic so much you don´t pass for either witty or funny. Least to me.

If you don´t care, don´t. Most of your "burning" remarks are similarly without importance to me :shrug:

It´s just that most people that you reply those to are at least attempting to discuss the subject.
 

Skwim

Veteran Member
I don't know. Seems like some kids don't mind at all.



















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