Should pastors get paid?

[Revoltingest]

Spiritual teaching should be free from payment. Buddhist monks is a good example. They are not allowed to earn money, or use Money

That would explain why I've never leased anything to them.

 

[9-10ths_Penguin]

Pastors in the past did not always get paid and they're maybe a few today who don't either.
My newphew Jose was raised up as baptist and then community churches by my sister, the other still go to church.

I asked him why he quit. He says Aunt Elizabeth most the Communirty church i was going to paid their Pastor makes about 350 thousand a year and most of the pastors in Mesquite Tx make about 2 to 300 thousand a year. i don't believe Pastor should get rich on from teaching the word of God.

I'm just wondering could this be one reason why some of the membership at the Christian church has gone down because some people are tired of Pastors getting rich off the church?

I personally don't have any skin in the game, but I do note that if you only have unpaid pastors, then all your pastors will either be:

- only pastoring when they can squeeze it into their work schedule, or
- independently wealthy enough that they don't need paid work to live.

The first option means that the congregation will be limited in the services it can receive. The second option means that the pastor will likely be chosen more on the basis of wealth than on the basis of merit.

I'm not sure that either of these options is desirable. I think this is why the only denominations that don't have paid pastors are ones with doctrinal objections to paying them.

 

[Spirit of Light]

Apparently not universally, since my ex-brother-in-law was both a Buddhist monk and a stockbroker.

Zen buddhist ? They have some other rules ås monastic. Theravada monks can not have money

 

[Vinayaka]

Zen buddhist ? They have some other rules ås monastic. Theravada monks can not have money

Not sure about Theravada, but in some monasteries, it's the individuals that can't own, whereas the collective group can. Sometimes that is a society collectively owned by non-monastics, and they just let monastics stay there. In other cases it's the collective.

If they are wandering mendicants, that's a different story. But within a monastery, somebody has to own it. There is a land title somewhere.

 

[BilliardsBall]

Pastors in the past did not always get paid and they're maybe a few today who don't either.
My newphew Jose was raised up as baptist and then community churches by my sister, the other still go to church.

I asked him why he quit. He says Aunt Elizabeth most the Communirty church i was going to paid their Pastor makes about 350 thousand a year and most of the pastors in Mesquite Tx make about 2 to 300 thousand a year. i don't believe Pastor should get rich on from teaching the word of God.

I'm just wondering could this be one reason why some of the membership at the Christian church has gone down because some people are tired of Pastors getting rich off the church?

1) The Bible allows for paid elders and working elders who are unpaid--I know churches with both

2) It is not a sin for a hardworking elder to be compensated

3) When you say "they make too much" you are speaking of some kind of wealth redistribution--but don't worry, churches and elders will answer to God for their salaries, deserved or undeserved

 

[1213]

Pastors in the past did not always get paid and they're maybe a few today who don't either...

It is said:

...worthy is the workman of his hire; ...
Luke 10:7

Unfortunately, there seem to be many of those who would not deserve wage, because they are not doing the job as they should. Those who speak in the name of God, should not be greedy.

 

[Shiranui117]

I think monistic settings are somewhat okay where one receives get room and board.

My view in general is why should a person get paid for something that essentially wasn't theirs to sell to begin with?

There's absolutely no doubt that Christianity is a full blown cottage industry and for a number of 'clergy' a quite lucrative one at that.

When you look at the average base Pastor salary ranging from 78,000 yr/ $1500.00 wk to 100,000 yr / $1923.00 wk . Not a bad haul if you ask me.

Salary for Pastor | Salary.com

Of course then you start getting into the evangelist realm.......

Dude, that's literally double what Catholic and Orthodox priests get paid. Of the 3 Orthodox priests whose churches I regularly go to, one of them works a 9-5 job in addition to being a priest, another one just retired from his day job because he's in his late 60's, and the third priest has a wife who works as a nurse (and is therefore probably making waaaaayyyy more money than he is).

 

[Spirit of Light]

Not sure about Theravada, but in some monasteries, it's the individuals that can't own, whereas the collective group can. Sometimes that is a society collectively owned by non-monastics, and they just let monastics stay there. In other cases it's the collective.

If they are wandering mendicants, that's a different story. But within a monastery, somebody has to own it. There is a land title somewhere.

I do not know to much about how monatics gain the land and temple except for that it i lay buddhists who collect money and send it to the person in charge, and often this is a person who are between lay buddhist and monk, called Anagarika, those persons can handle the money since they are not ordained

 

[Fool]

Pastors in the past did not always get paid and they're maybe a few today who don't either.
My newphew Jose was raised up as baptist and then community churches by my sister, the other still go to church.

I asked him why he quit. He says Aunt Elizabeth most the Communirty church i was going to paid their Pastor makes about 350 thousand a year and most of the pastors in Mesquite Tx make about 2 to 300 thousand a year. i don't believe Pastor should get rich on from teaching the word of God.

I'm just wondering could this be one reason why some of the membership at the Christian church has gone down because some people are tired of Pastors getting rich off the church?

i believe it should be like the begging bowl and buddhist monks. enough to feed and shelter them but nothing exorbitant. anything above and beyond that should be used to fund outreach to help the poor and needy to be self-sustaining.

 

[Quintessence]

As I see it, these things are determined by the social norms of the culture more broadly, rather than that of the religions per se. The typical model of Western nations is that people are paid for their services. Serving as clergy in a professional capacity is of course a service, and as such, should be monetarily compensated.

 

[dianaiad]

I'm more cynical about this than you can even imagine. Just let it go.

Cynicism is fine.

but the stipends/income that the General Authorities get are matters of public record. Don't let your cynicism blind you to researchable facts, Ellen.

 

[dianaiad]

Having read many of the posts in here, and belonging to a belief system that does NOT have a 'paid clergy' at the local level, I'm gonna stick my oar in here again.

Yeah, the system of unpaid clergy works for us. Why? Because the Bishop (unpaid) has two counselors and delegates a LOT of responsibility to others. He has to spend a lot of time 'fullfilling' his church 'calling,' but on most weeks he can get it done with an hour or so a day and a goodly proportion of the weekend. He can take vacations. He can 'call in sick' and his counselors will take over for him. If his 'day job' calls him away, he CAN go. Almost every member of the ward (congregation) has a job ('calling') to do in the church; teacher, clerk, leader, librarian, administrative head or counselor to some part of the church organization. We are all involved, no nobody is full time.

So for us, it works.

However, for many congregations that's just not so. The pastor is a full-time minister. S/he may not have the support system we have, or anything close to it. That job may take up 60 to 80 hours a week. I know some who work that hard, absolutely. When they get inundated, there's nobody around to spell them. They have to do the Sunday church meetings themselves, the weekly study sessions themselves, the ministering to the individuals in the congregation themselves; they literally do not have time to work elsewhere. They have to choose; either an outside job OR being a pastor.

We don't have to deal with that choice.

Those who do, and who choose to serve their congregations, ALSO have to eat, clothe themselves and their kids, pay for a roof over their heads, etc., It us up to those they serve to see to it that they have enough to do that.

Now there are many reasons I prefer the way we do it, not the least of which is that our bishops, etc., don't have to pander to the members of their wards to a; keep their jobs, b; get enough to live on. They remain independent and answerable only to God and the general authorities. Yes, they have to support themselves, but they ALSO don't have to worry about whether the good sisters of the congregation think that their house is too 'showy,' or that their spouses don't dress properly humbly (or fashionably, whichever) to please them. It's none of the congregation's business how big the Bishop's house is. They aren't paying for it.

However, if a group chooses to have a pastor who has to do all the work, then they need to support him/her. Pick a path and don't criticize.

 

[Vinayaka]

I do not know to much about how monatics gain the land and temple except for that it i lay buddhists who collect money and send it to the person in charge, and often this is a person who are between lay buddhist and monk, called Anagarika, those persons can handle the money since they are not ordained

That makes sense.

 

[sealchan]

Pastors in the past did not always get paid and they're maybe a few today who don't either.
My newphew Jose was raised up as baptist and then community churches by my sister, the other still go to church.

I asked him why he quit. He says Aunt Elizabeth most the Communirty church i was going to paid their Pastor makes about 350 thousand a year and most of the pastors in Mesquite Tx make about 2 to 300 thousand a year. i don't believe Pastor should get rich on from teaching the word of God.

I'm just wondering could this be one reason why some of the membership at the Christian church has gone down because some people are tired of Pastors getting rich off the church?

It is why my wife at the time and I left a small church. The pastor dogged us to round up our donations (I gave the tenth of my income calculated to the penny 'cause I'm a geek). Then he missed church band practice because he had members of the congregation helping him with his boat.

 

[Jumi]

If they don't earn a lot of money in a country where money equals human worth, they won't be respected by society at large. Most religions want respect and money is certainly the way to go if they want power. The off side of that is the same as to why some priest in medieval times died of overindulging in fine foods and wines while people were dying of hunger... money and power tends to draw people not really interested in "Jesus" or "Buddha" or "Allah" but the position they could have by an alternate route.

 

[Enoch07]

Pastors /Preachers whatever you want to call them, shouldn't get paid by the church. They should have day jobs/careers that support them. And that career should be completely separate from the church. Then Preach/Teach on a voluntary status. This is the way it should be.

 

[blü 2]

Pastors in the past did not always get paid and they're maybe a few today who don't either.
My newphew Jose was raised up as baptist and then community churches by my sister, the other still go to church.

I asked him why he quit. He says Aunt Elizabeth most the Communirty church i was going to paid their Pastor makes about 350 thousand a year and most of the pastors in Mesquite Tx make about 2 to 300 thousand a year. i don't believe Pastor should get rich on from teaching the word of God.

I'm just wondering could this be one reason why some of the membership at the Christian church has gone down because some people are tired of Pastors getting rich off the church?

Those who pay are volunteers.

Religion at this level is an industry, naked and unashamed, and some of its entrepreneurs win and some of them do okay and some of them lose (like Schuller's Crystal Cathedral which had its heyday but then was mismanaged and went belly up).

There's a certain irony in those who believe in riches parting with their riches in order to be told God loves those who believe in riches. And who more credible to reassure you of Jesus your friend and fellow fat cat than a fat cat pastor, one of your own tribe?

 

[Shadow Wolf]

New It's pretty weird that people get paid for their belief. Makes you wonder why lay people don't get a stipend then.

They aren't being paid just for their beliefs though, and they do far more than just preach from the pulpit for an hour or two on Sundays. It's not unusual to find one who is also licensed to practice mental health counseling. They plan events, write sermons, counsel people, act as a rock to those with no one else, and a list of other things they do. I've found people are consistently stunned when they learn all the things a priest/pastor actually does beyond giving a Sunday sermon.

Apparently not universally, since my ex-brother-in-law was both a Buddhist monk and a stockbroker.

Yup. Even some Buddhist temples were basically centers of lucrative commerce.

 

[Ellen Brown]

Pastors /Preachers whatever you want to call them, shouldn't get paid by the church. They should have day jobs/careers that support them. And that career should be completely separate from the church. Then Preach/Teach on a voluntary status. This is the way it should be.

Deut 25:4 Thou shalt not muzzle the Ox as it treads the grain.

It includes a decent salary, but not private planes. Only the lazy have paid Pastors. One should study and know scripture themselves.

 

[Enoch07]

Deut 25:4 Thou shalt not muzzle the Ox as it treads the grain.

It includes a decent salary, but not private planes. Only the lazy have paid Pastors. One should study and know scripture themselves.

I agree, folk should study and know scripture themselves. I wouldn't call someone that wants a Pastor lazy though.