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Featured Should Muslims be concerned with what is written in Gospel and Torah?

Discussion in 'Quranic Debates' started by InvestigateTruth, Jul 1, 2020.

  1. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    1. Does Quran claim that Muhammad was prophesied in Injil and Torah?

    2. Why should the Muslims (Those who follow the Messenger), be concerned with finding the Messenger (Muhammad), in Gospel and Torah, as following verse says:

    "Those who follow the Messenger, the Prophet, the Ummi whom they find mentioned in the Torah and the Gospel which are with them. He enjoins on them good and forbids them evil and makes lawful for them the good things and forbids them the bad things and remove from them their burdens and shackles that were upon them. So those who shall believe in him and honour and support him and help him and follow the light that has been sent down with him -- these shall prosper.'" 7:157

    3. As a Muslim and follower of Muhammad, do you find Muhammad mentioned in INJIL and Torah? If yes, quote a verse from Injil, and a verse from Torah that you see as Muhammad.
     
    #1 InvestigateTruth, Jul 1, 2020
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2020
  2. CriticalThinking

    CriticalThinking Quranist

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    As a "Quranist" i think we are not supposed to look if the name "Muhammad" is mentioned but rather for the values he holds
     
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  3. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    I can't find anything that supports the following of Mohammad in the bible... but please feel free to follow your religion
     
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  4. Harel13

    Harel13 Well-Known Member

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    What? :eek:
    It's right there in black on parchment off-white:
    "His mouth is most sweet; yea, he is altogether lovely. This is my beloved, and this is my friend, O daughters of Jerusalem.'" (Song of Songs 5:16) - "lovely" in Hebrew is Machmadim. This is clearly a reference to Muhammad (Muchammad in Hebrew) and his grandeur and his belovedness by God! How could you miss that, @KenS? :D
     
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  5. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    Can you quote a verse from Injil, and Torah that mentions Muhammad by values He holds?
     
  6. stvdv

    stvdv Well-Known Member

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    Should Muslims be concerned with what is written in Gospel and Torah?

    NO.
     
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  7. CriticalThinking

    CriticalThinking Quranist

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    I never read Injil, and Torah, all what i m saying is that the existence of "Mohamed" name in those books is not something that the verse could be saying rather than the teachings the verse mentions
     
  8. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    The word Injil is repeated 12 times, and Torah 18 times in Quran.
     
  9. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    Yes,

    Lo! We did reveal the At-Taurah, wherein is guidance and a light, by which the prophets who surrendered (unto Allah) judged the Jews, and the rabbis and the priests (judged) by such of Allah's Scripture as they were bidden to observe, and thereunto were they witnesses. So fear not mankind, but fear Me. And barter not My revelations for a little gain. Whoso judgeth not by that which Allah hath revealed: such are disbelievers.

    — Quran, sura 5 (Al-Ma'ida), ayat 44[2]


    What Allah hath revealed = The Torah.


    Those who follow the Messenger, the unlettered prophet, whom they find written in what they have of the Torah and the Gospel, who enjoins upon them what is right and forbids them what is wrong and makes lawful for them the good things and prohibits for them the evil and relieves them of their burden and the shackles which were upon them. So they who have believed in him, honored him, supported him and followed the light which was sent down with him - it is those who will be the successful.

    — Quran, sura 7 (Al-A'raf), ayah 157[6]
     
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  10. InvestigateTruth

    InvestigateTruth Well-Known Member

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    As much as it does not make sense to you, the verse is clearly saying the Ummi Prophet is mentioned in Torah and Injil.
     
  11. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    Muslims would not be desperately trying to find Muhammad in the Scriptures were it not for the Qur'an saying he's mentioned there.
     
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  12. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    Why would you find that in the Bible? o_O
    Muhammad walked the earth many centuries after the Bible was canonized.

    Muslims believe that the Quran was verbally revealed from God to Muhammad through the angel Gabriel gradually over a period of approximately 23 years, beginning on 22 December 609 CE, when Muhammad was 40, and concluding in 632 CE, the year of his death. The Quran | World Civilization - Lumen Learning
     
  13. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    :)

    Machmad TWOT - 673d,673e
    Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
    makh-mawd' Noun Masculine
    Definition
    1. desire, desirable thing, pleasant thing

    lovely is not a name
     
  14. CriticalThinking

    CriticalThinking Quranist

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    From what i understood The verse doesn't say that his name is mentioned but his teachings are specifically these : "He enjoins on them good and forbids them evil and makes lawful for them the good things and forbids them the bad things and remove from them their burdens and shackles that were upon them. "
     
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  15. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    because the early church preached from the Tanakh not from the NT. if the Tanakh would have supported Mohammed it would be in the new testament
     
  16. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    I do not believe Muslims should be concerned either, given I believe that the Dispensations of Moses and Jesus were unconditionally abrogated by the Dispensation of Muhammad.

    Dispensation
    1. the divine ordering of the affairs of the world.
    2. an appointment, arrangement, or favor, as by God.
    3. a divinely appointed order or age:
    e.g. the old Mosaic, or Jewish, dispensation; the new gospel, or Christian, dispensation.

    Definition of dispensation | Dictionary.com
     
  17. Trailblazer

    Trailblazer Veteran Member

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    How could it support Muhammad when He had not even been born yet?
    Do you mean support the coming of Muhammad in prophecy?
     
  18. stvdv

    stvdv Well-Known Member

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    The question was "Should Muslims be concerned...?". Allah clearly states Muslims should leave concerns to Allah
     
  19. Rival

    Rival Noahide
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    The Qur'an tells the Jews to judge by the Torah and the Christians to judge by the Gospel.

    But how do they come to you for decision while they have the Taurat (Torah), in which is the (plain) Decision of Allah; yet even after that, they turn away. For they are not (really) believers.

    — Quran, sura 5 (Al-Ma'ida), ayat 43[3]

    And We caused Jesus, son of Mary, to follow in their footsteps, confirming that which was (revealed) before him in the Torah, and We bestowed on him the Gospel [Injil] wherein is guidance and a light, confirming that which was (revealed) before it in the Torah ] - a guidance and an admonition unto those who ward off (evil). Let the People of the Gospel [Injil] judge by that which Allah hath revealed therein".

    — Quran, sura 5 (Al-Ma'ida), ayah 46, 47a[5]

    So obviously the God of Islam thinks they're relevent. He says Muhammad is mentioned in them and that they are still His word. This does not fit with the Islamic claim they are corrupted.
     
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  20. KenS

    KenS Veteran Member
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    yes
     
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