Should I Read The Bible?

[columbus]

@columbus I have enjoyed Asimov in the past. I was not aware of his Guide to the Bible. I have now ordered a copy.

I think you'll find it useful.
It's not a theological work, it's straight up history. Where he speculates, and he does, he clearly distinguishes between that and established history. Asimov is brilliant.
Tom

 

[The Reverend Bob]

Thank you to all for your input.

@Sunstone I am currently reading 'The Passion of the Western Mind' by Richard Tarnas. I am looking forward to Kauffman. I have just ordered his Critique of Religion and Philosophy. Thanks for the advice.

@columbus I have enjoyed Asimov in the past. I was not aware of his Guide to the Bible. I have now ordered a copy.

@David T again thank you. I have just downloaded John Muir's 'Journeys in the Wilderness'.

Looks like I have got quite a task, but what fun.

Don't forget Thoreau's Walden, it is a must read.
Here is an excerpt:

“I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately, to front only the essential facts of life, and see if I could not learn what it had to teach, and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived. I did not wish to live what was not life, living is so dear; nor did I wish to practise resignation, unless it was quite necessary. I wanted to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life, to live so sturdily and Spartan-like as to put to rout all that was not life, to cut a broad swath and shave close, to drive life into a corner, and reduce it to its lowest terms...”

 

[usfan]

I am not a Jew or a Christian. In my time on RF I have seen this book torn to pieces and have often admired the logic of the arguments thrown against it. Of course when I say book I have become aware of the numerous versions, translations and alterations. Other issues such as John, Constantine, Gnosticism add to the stew.

Despite the above, of late I have become very curious. Is there any good reason for a non-believer to read it? What could I expect in terms of my growth and development? Are there any good companion/guide books for beginners?

I'll give you some advice from famous people in the past...

"It is impossible to mentally or socially enslave a BIBLE reading people. The principles of
The BIBLE are the groundwork of human freedom" ~Horace Greeley

"I consider an intimate knowledge of the BIBLE an indispensable quality of a well educated man" ~Dr. Robert Milikan

No man, educated or uneducated, can afford to be ignorant of the BIBLE" ~Theodore Roosevelt

The influence of the Bible is worldwide. Its mighty power has affected every department of human activity. The contents of the Scriptures have supplied themes for the greatest poets, artists and musicians which the world has yet produced, and have been the mightiest factor of all in shaping the moral progress of the race. ~Arthur Pink

"A thorough understanding of the BIBLE is better than a college education" ~Theodore Roosevelt

The foundations of our society and our government rest so much on the teachings of the Bible that it would be difficult to support them if faith in these teachings would cease to be practically universal in our country. - Calvin Coolidge

 

[SalixIncendium]

"A thorough understanding of the BIBLE is better than a college education" ~Theodore Roosevelt

Unfortunately, this is a rarity, even for those that claim it as their own holy writ.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

he just wants you to be nice.

Is that all you think he was saying? That we should just be nice?

 

[Tumah]

Is that all you think he was saying? That we should just be nice?

The rest is just trifles.

 

[Rival]

The rest is just trifles.

It is tho...

 

[pearl]

The rest is just trifles.

And who was it that said of the Torah, "What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. This is the whole Torah; all the rest is commentary. Go and learn it."

Hillel, however, was talking about the essential level of ahavas Yisrael, where the Jew stands higher than Torah. On that level, the whole purpose of the Torah is as a means to reveal the essence of the Jew. Since a Jew’s essence is revealed by the mitzvah of ahavas Yisrael, it can therefore be said that it is the entire Torah and the rest is explanation; that is, that the rest of the Torah is the vehicle through which the essence of the Jew is revealed as exemplified in the mitzvah of ahavas Yisrael.
Chapter 7: Hillel and Rabbi Akiva - (Adapted from Likkutei Sichos, Vol. 17, pp. 215-224)

 

[rocala]

“I went to the woods because I wished to live deliberately, to front only the essential facts of life, and see if I could not learn what it had to teach, and not, when I came to die, discover that I had not lived. I did not wish to live what was not life, living is so dear; nor did I wish to practise resignation, unless it was quite necessary. I wanted to live deep and suck out all the marrow of life, to live so sturdily and Spartan-like as to put to rout all that was not life, to cut a broad swath and shave close, to drive life into a corner, and reduce it to its lowest terms...”

I have returned to this and have re-read several times. It has a special quality. "to suck out all the marrow of life" , fantastic. I will read it. Thanks for the post.

 

[Jim]

I am not a Jew or a Christian. In my time on RF I have seen this book torn to pieces and have often admired the logic of the arguments thrown against it. Of course when I say book I have become aware of the numerous versions, translations and alterations. Other issues such as John, Constantine, Gnosticism add to the stew.

Despite the above, of late I have become very curious. Is there any good reason for a non-believer to read it? What could I expect in terms of my growth and development? Are there any good companion/guide books for beginners?

I see a light in the stories and scriptures of Christianity and some other religions, that I think would benefit anyone who is learning to love, trust and follow it, regardless of what they believe or don’t believe of the beliefs associated with them. I’ve never read anything by John Muir before, but from browsing through the Wikipedia article I can see that his writings could be a good way of seeing that light.

If you read the Bible itself, I would recommend picturing it as a book of fiction written in the style of a collection of letters and other documents, and immersing yourself in the story, settings aside all questions about how much of it ever actually happened, while you’re reading it.

Another possible way of seeing the light in the stories and scriptures of Christianity might be to browse in a Christian bookstore for a book that looks interesting to you, and start reading that.

 

[The Reverend Bob]

The rest is just trifles.

Trifles that built Western Civilization

 

[Tumah]

And who was it that said of the Torah, "What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. This is the whole Torah; all the rest is commentary. Go and learn it."

Hillel, however, was talking about the essential level of ahavas Yisrael, where the Jew stands higher than Torah. On that level, the whole purpose of the Torah is as a means to reveal the essence of the Jew. Since a Jew’s essence is revealed by the mitzvah of ahavas Yisrael, it can therefore be said that it is the entire Torah and the rest is explanation; that is, that the rest of the Torah is the vehicle through which the essence of the Jew is revealed as exemplified in the mitzvah of ahavas Yisrael.
Chapter 7: Hillel and Rabbi Akiva - (Adapted from Likkutei Sichos, Vol. 17, pp. 215-224)

It seems like you've performed the archetypal Christian act: cherry picking. In context of the essay it is found, the above quoted is saying something quite different from what you appear to be trying to make it say.

 

[SugarOcean]

I am not a Jew or a Christian. In my time on RF I have seen this book torn to pieces and have often admired the logic of the arguments thrown against it. Of course when I say book I have become aware of the numerous versions, translations and alterations. Other issues such as John, Constantine, Gnosticism add to the stew.

Despite the above, of late I have become very curious. Is there any good reason for a non-believer to read it? What could I expect in terms of my growth and development? Are there any good companion/guide books for beginners?

Sure, if you wish to.
The old testament was originally in Hebrew. The new testament in Greek. This is one example of a bible you might consider so as to get the full breadth of the teachings. Unless you know Hebrew or Greek, which was Koine Greek at the time the NT was written, you'd have a very difficult time understanding without the mother tongue translation to assist you.

https://www.amazon.com/Hebrew-Greek-English-Bible-Scriptures-translation-ebook/dp/B00J175648

 

[pearl]

It seems like you've performed the archetypal Christian act: cherry picking. In context of the essay it is found, the above quoted is saying something quite different from what you appear to be trying to make it say.

To avoid the concept of 'cherry picking' I referred to a Jewish source.

 

[Tumah]

To avoid the concept of 'cherry picking' I referred to a Jewish source.

Right, the thing is, you only quoted the last paragraph. The rest of the essay gives the last paragraph a different meaning than what you seem to be trying to give it.

 

[pearl]

Right, the thing is, you only quoted the last paragraph. The rest of the essay gives the last paragraph a different meaning than what you seem to be trying to give it.

In response to your post #87 and #76

 

[Tumah]

In response to your post #87 and #76

I was making a reference in post 87 to a post someone made in another thread. But you're going to have to be more explicit in what you mean.

 

[pearl]

. So you go through 25 books trying to convince you that Jesus is the messiah-god and at the end of all that, he just wants you to be nice.

I was making a reference in post 87 to a post someone made in another thread. But you're going to have to be more explicit in what you mean.

As an Orthodox Jew you have the option to ignore and belittle the Gospels. As Christians we have no such option as Hebrew Scripture to us remains Sacred Scripture.


The initial quote from Hillel I referred to was a comparison of his and Jesus' teaching on the 'Golden Rule'.

A non-Jew came to Rabi Hillel and asked the rabbi to teach him the whole Torah while standing on one foot.

Hillel replied, "What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. This is the whole Torah; all the rest is commentary. Go and learn it."

Jesus; a contemporary of Hillel, "In everything, do to others as you would have them do to you'.

Should we glean from both, 'just be nice'?

 

[Tumah]

As an Orthodox Jew you have the option to ignore and belittle the Gospels. As Christians we have no such option as Hebrew Scripture to us remains Sacred Scripture.

I'm not sure what that has to do with anything, but ok.

The initial quote from Hillel I referred to was a comparison of his and Jesus' teaching on the 'Golden Rule'.

A non-Jew came to Rabi Hillel and asked the rabbi to teach him the whole Torah while standing on one foot.

Hillel replied, "What is hateful to you, do not do to your neighbor. This is the whole Torah; all the rest is commentary. Go and learn it."

Jesus; a contemporary of Hillel, "In everything, do to others as you would have them do to you'.

Should we glean from both, 'just be nice'?

Hillel actually voices the Silver Rule, not the Golden Rule. But I don't really see the comparison. Both in the citation you quoted earlier and among other commentaries, Hillel isn't trying to establish the importance of interpersonal relations. In the NT's narrative you've quoted, Jesus is. And essentially what he's saying is, be a nice person.

 

[Sand Dancer]

I am not a Jew or a Christian. In my time on RF I have seen this book torn to pieces and have often admired the logic of the arguments thrown against it. Of course when I say book I have become aware of the numerous versions, translations and alterations. Other issues such as John, Constantine, Gnosticism add to the stew.

Despite the above, of late I have become very curious. Is there any good reason for a non-believer to read it? What could I expect in terms of my growth and development? Are there any good companion/guide books for beginners?

It's quite a slog and you have to excuse the errors, contradictions and plagiarism. Not sure of guide books to read.