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Should I Keep Trying to Understand and Save Christianity?

A Vestigial Mote

Well-Known Member
the memory doesn't die, that information is associated with a form. the form collapses, the information doesn't. the information is the mind. the form is the body, a soul, that the mind took residence in for this terrestrial journey, experience. a person is a soul, a living terrestrial being. a mind is not necessarily a humanoid, or even a planetary entity.

if that consciousness becomes aware that the form is temporal, then it doesn't become attached to the form anymore than a driver is attached to a vehicle.

and yes, some drivers become attached to their vehicles. yet there are literally billions of vehicles to be occupied; if they become fixated on traveling vs a single vehicle.

the mind is eternal. the vehicle isn't. mind is the first cause.

ruwach also means mind in hebrew. nephesh means soul; which is a third density, chemical body that incorporates a consciousness.

The Naassene Psalm

Still not really an answer... at all. Just a lot of spiritual-ish mumbo-jumbo. So I'll take a different tack, and ask one question at a time...

Is your soul "you" (the same you/mind that you experience now, regardless what your body is doing)?
 

Brickjectivity

Turned to Stone. Now I stretch daily.
Staff member
Premium Member
@Brickjectivity.

Yeeehoooo, congratulations, it's a bouncing baby 6 pages,
kUO0Rzi.gif
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
Still not really an answer... at all. Just a lot of spiritual-ish mumbo-jumbo. So I'll take a different tack, and ask one question at a time...

Is your soul "you" (the same you/mind that you experience now, regardless what your body is doing)?
the no-hiding theorem is quantum mechanics and the conservation of information. that is what a mind is, a quantum of information. you can't save a soul. you can only awaken to what self obviously has ignored, that energy cannot be created or destroyed but it can be reformed, reborn, transformed.

you have formed an attachment to a form, a body and believe this is a 'you' as you identify it . the mind doesn't have a form; so no, a soul is not anywhere near the permanent self. a spirit doesn't require a chemical body. a chemical body to be viable, living, requires a spirit; and on that incarnation of a spirit into third density matter, it becomes a soul.

the mind is the important and eternal part. the form that it takes is irrelevant. so the personality is mutable and the personality, or soul, is only a snapshot in space/time and terrestrial/planetary experience, or materiality. the personality, or soul, is not eternal.

the mind, the quantum of information, is. it has no exact form because it is formless. formless things can neither be created, or destroyed. forms can become unformed, destroyed. destroy a body and it can be reformed with the quantum of information from the previous incarnation.


who am i? am i the fool at 3? 13? 23? 33? 53? 83?

i'm all of those and much more. so no that personality, soul, is not I. I AM not an exclusive to a form. the mind takes many forms. there are billions of people and they all have one thing in common, a mind. look how this mind has become billions of personalities expressing themselves in 1000s of languages, 1000s of cultures, ethnicities, sexes,


there are three parts, aspects of the All in all. even an aspect of self.

we are:

a mind
an action, or acting upon,
a form


the form is a result of the mind. the form is a result of the action from the mind. science knows and teaches that psychological eustress/distress has effect on the physical body for better or worse. that mind evolves, grows, matures, and in so doing the form follows.

easily understood in epigenetics.


I AM a sky full stars. I AM a mind full of forms. I AM a creator of created things.


The Thunder, Perfect Mind -- The Nag Hammadi Library
 
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savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
the no-hiding theorem is quantum mechanics and the conservation of information. that is what a mind is, a quantum of information. you can't save a soul. you can only awaken to what self obviously has ignored, that energy cannot be created or destroyed but it can be reformed, reborn, transformed.

you have formed an attachment to a form, a body. the mind doesn't have a form; so no, a soul is not anywhere near the permanent you. a spirit doesn't require a chemical body. a chemical body to be viable requires a spirit; and on incarnation of that spirit into third density matter it becomes a soul.

the mind is the important and eternal part. the form that it takes is irrelevant. so the personality is mutable and the personality, or soul, is only a snapshot in space/time and terrestrial/planetary experience, or materiality. the personality, or soul, is not eternal. the mind, the quantum of information is. it has no exact form because it is formless. formless things can neither be created, or destroyed. forms can become unformed, destroyed. destroy a body and it can be reformed with the quantum of information from the previous incarnation.


who am i? am i the fool at 3? 13? 23? 33? 53? 83?

i'm all of those and much more. so no that personality, soul, is not us. I AM not an exclusive form. the mind takes many forms.


there are three parts, aspects of the All in all. even an aspect of self.

we are:

a mind
an action, or acting upon,
a form


the form is a result of the mind. the form is a result of the action from the mind. science knows and teaches that psychological eustress/distress has effect on the physical body for better or worse. that mind evolves, grows, matures, and in so doing the form follows.

easily understood in epigenetics.


I AM a sky full stars. I AM a mind full of forms. I AM a creator of created things.


The Thunder, Perfect Mind -- The Nag Hammadi Library
Did you write that? It is wonderful and I do not doubt the truth of it, but I was going to rate it creative, so I am asking you if you designed that idea.
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
Did you write that? It is wonderful and I do not doubt the truth of it, but I was going to rate it creative, so I am asking you if you designed that idea.
could you be more specific on what part? all of the post was written from varying aspects of my search, studying, contemplation and strangely enough they seem to meet together in the moment that i wrote the post.

the questioner is either attempting to understand, or discredit. they will come to their conclusion based on what their motives are.

Understanding?

Discrediting?

wisdom is proved right by her children.

i have found the jewel of all jewels, the pearl of all wisdom. no one can take it from me, nor give it to me. some call it the diamond mind.


but if i can help someone awake to theirs, i have moved a mountain to it's core.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
could you be more specific on what part? all of the post was written from varying aspects of my search, studying, contemplation and strangely enough they seem to meet together in the moment that i wrote the post.

the questioner is either attempting to understand, or discredit. they will come to their conclusion based on what their motives are.

Understanding?

Discrediting?

wisdom is proved right by her children.

i have found the jewel of all jewels, the pearl of all wisdom. no one can take it from me, nor give it to me. some call it the diamond mind.


but if i can help someone awake to theirs, i have moved a mountain to it's core.
I did not know if it should be in quotes. It is OK to develop an idea from different sources. It needs no quotation marks if it is coming from your own mind. I wasn't criticizing it. I think that you are wonderful. But, might I say, don't get too far away!
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
I believe that what a person will be is what a person is, so I think that we have similar ideas about what the mind does. @Fool
 

Fool

ALL in all
Premium Member
I don't think that is possible. Sorry, really I am......off topic.


advising a person to venture inward, meditation, is only a person acting as a sign post for another . of course, the person must choose to take that movement. i've never been very good at staying on topic.

sometimes my mind is a whirlwind.
 

savagewind

Veteran Member
Premium Member
advising a person to venture inward, meditation, is only a person acting as a sign post for another . of course, the person must choose to take that movement. i've never been very good at staying on topic.

sometimes my mind is a whirlwind.
Very good! Now, I understand that to move a mountain to its core is possible.
I was imaging a Bible mountain. Mark 11:23 "Truly I tell you, if anyone says to this mountain, 'Go, throw yourself into the sea,' and does not doubt in their heart but believes that what they say will happen, it will be done for them...."
Matthew 17:20
"Because you have so little faith." He answered. "For truly I tell you, if you have faith the size of a mustard seed, you can say to this mountain, 'Move from here to there,' and it will move. Nothing will be impossible for you."

It is the difference between being physically (mentally) moved and spiritually moved.
To advocate that a person as he is like a mountain to look to his own core is something that can be done, in my opinion.
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
Much of what people cal "Christianity" is about as far what the teachings of Jesus and the Bible as one can get. I doubt that there is much you can do to convince people of this because they have been so brainwashed that they cannot see the truth.

I believe that is not so. I believe most churches follow a modicum of essential belief.
 

A Vestigial Mote

Well-Known Member
the no-hiding theorem is quantum mechanics and the conservation of information. that is what a mind is, a quantum of information. you can't save a soul. you can only awaken to what self obviously has ignored, that energy cannot be created or destroyed but it can be reformed, reborn, transformed.
Let me start by saying the question I asked could have been answered in its simplest form by one of two words: "yes" or "no"

you have formed an attachment to a form, a body and believe this is a 'you'
Why are you stating this? Have I mentioned ANYTHING about "the body?" No. I have been talking about personality, memory and other mind-related items. Who, on Earth, believes that the self is merely "the body?" This discounts so many things that are supported by the material body, but are not part of its physicality - like personality, emotion, memory, etc.)

So, to be clear, since you say it is lost in death, my "personality" is a part of my "body" then, is this what you are saying? But memories aren't according to you? How does this follow in any way, shape or form?

The mind doesn't have a form; so no, a soul is not anywhere near the permanent self. a spirit doesn't require a chemical body. a chemical body to be viable, living, requires a spirit; and on that incarnation of a spirit into third density matter, it becomes a soul.
And this can be proven by... ?

the mind, the quantum of information, is. it has no exact form because it is formless. formless things can neither be created, or destroyed.
So, when a new life comes into the world, the "mind" it has access to is not new? If it can't have been created for the new being, then it must be somehow getting re-appropriated from another, correct? And if memories are not able to be lost (again, according to you), then why does "mind" not come with all of the memories from it's previous "owner?" And please don't say "sometimes it does" - that is a complete cop out. The fact would be that there would be a great many more of us with past-life memories if memories can't be lost and "mind" is transferred or "tapped into" from one being to the next - without creation of new or destruction of old.

who am i? am i the fool at 3? 13? 23? 33? 53? 83?
Within what I believe, you are "Fool" at this moment... and this moment only, whatever moment that is/happens to be. A moment from now you are "Fool" in that moment. Each moment that passes is gone, each moment yet to be is just that... yet to be. Like the rest of us, you inhabit a 1-dimensional slice of reality with respect to time. Which is a point. you don't get a line... definitely don't get anything 3-dimensional. Even if time were somehow relative to one being vs. another, an exact state of the universe within a given subset of time is what it is, and no more.

so no that personality, soul, is not I.
Then the original unanswered question stands - why care about the fate of the soul?

I AM not an exclusive to a form. the mind takes many forms. there are billions of people and they all have one thing in common, a mind. look how this mind has become billions of personalities expressing themselves in 1000s of languages, 1000s of cultures, ethnicities, sexes,
There are plenty of things we all have in common besides having a "mind", and in much the same way, with as little variance as you propose this "mind" (I have to admit I do not agree with you on this - I believe that each person has their own "mind" that belongs exclusively to and can and will only ever be accessible to each individual themselves) has between us. For example, we share the sun and the energy it produces that fuels life on our planet. Our relative distances and effectiveness of its heat/energy that we see in our locale on Earth may vary, sure - but this is no difference than the expression of "mind" that you propose takes on 1000s of languages, cultures, ethnicities, etc. We also all have the need to expel waste of various types. Point being - why choose "mind" and give it supernatural significance over any of the other thousands of things we all share?

the form is a result of the mind. the form is a result of the action from the mind. science knows and teaches that psychological eustress/distress has effect on the physical body for better or worse. that mind evolves, grows, matures, and in so doing the form follows.
Why is it that so many people who consider themselves "spiritual" wish to distance the mind/soul/self from the body? Why is it that they point to the ability of the mind to affect the outcome of bodily processes like overcoming sickness, but completely ignore the fact that it also works the other way - that physical damage to the body can also affect the "mind?" It's a bit dishonest. I readily accept that the functions of the mind can affect things like recovery time for injury, overcoming sickness, etc. I don't ignore it, don't leave it out of conversation etc. but the moment you mention something to a spiritual person like brain damage altering a person to the point that their "self"/"mind"/etc. is also damaged, it's like you just poked them in the eye.

I AM a sky full stars..
Can you do anything as this "sky full stars" to prove it to me?

I AM a mind full of forms.
Then I should think you would be capable of listing for me all of the possible forms, no?

I AM a creator of created things.
Which created things? All of them? Neat trick. You must want for nothing.

Or does it "not work like that?" One might wonder of what good it is to be part of the ever-flowing "mind" that is somehow, somewhere out there, and what makes it all that much better than being just what we appear to be.
 
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