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Salvation

Thief

Rogue Theologian
To 'take up your stauros' means to be willing to suffer or to even die for a righteous cause. Jesus died to set us free from the curse Adam pronounced on us.
a play on words.....and dogmatic belief
not buying it

to follow Him.....is not s suicide mission
and His mission wasn't suicide either

He knew it end as it did
times and troubles what they were then

you don't need a cause to die
you only need cause for the life you have

that your hand does anything......it's because
you thought you should
or you felt like it
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
a play on words.....and dogmatic belief
not buying it

Not buying what? It was prophesied in the scriptures that the Messiah had to die.
The prophesy in Daniel 9:26 concerning the Messiah said...."After this period of sixty-two sets of seven, the Anointed One will be killed, appearing to have accomplished nothing". (NLT)

to follow Him.....is not s suicide mission
and His mission wasn't suicide either

Of course it wasn't suicide.....it was a rescue mission....one man offering his life as "a ransom".
"even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many."
Do you understand the mechanics of a ransom? It is a price paid to release a captive....in this case "many" captives.

He knew it end as it did
times and troubles what they were then

you don't need a cause to die
you only need cause for the life you have

The Bible tells us the story....why do you want to alter it?

that your hand does anything......it's because
you thought you should
or you felt like it

The mission for which Christ was "sent" was clearly outlined to him before he willingly undertook a very difficult assignment. God's love for mankind and Jesus' love for us moved him to make that sacrifice. (John 3:16)
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
Yes, God is the uncreated Eternal Being....the only one in existence who can claim that title.....but the angelic are all created, including the firstborn son. (Colossians 1:115-17; Revelation 3:14)

Adam is only a "son of God" because he too is a creation of God.....he was not produced through a mother, just a creation of the Father.

I believe Adam was not god in the flesh but Jesus was.
 

Sand Dancer

Crazy Cat Lady
I believe I never construed Christians as being mindless robots who just accepted the teaching of men as though it came from God.

I don't either. Different denominations have the basics covered but have added other things which are not considered basic and fundamental. That's pretty standard.
 

ppp

Well-Known Member
I don't either. Different denominations have the basics covered but have added other things which are not considered basic and fundamental. That's pretty standard.
Not considered basic and fundamental....by other denominations. That pretty much true for any and all Christian denomination.
 

Thief

Rogue Theologian
Not buying what? It was prophesied in the scriptures that the Messiah had to die.
The prophesy in Daniel 9:26 concerning the Messiah said...."After this period of sixty-two sets of seven, the Anointed One will be killed, appearing to have accomplished nothing". (NLT)



Of course it wasn't suicide.....it was a rescue mission....one man offering his life as "a ransom".
"even as the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many."
Do you understand the mechanics of a ransom? It is a price paid to release a captive....in this case "many" captives.



The Bible tells us the story....why do you want to alter it?



The mission for which Christ was "sent" was clearly outlined to him before he willingly undertook a very difficult assignment. God's love for mankind and Jesus' love for us moved him to make that sacrifice. (John 3:16)
I don't believe as you do

yeah.....His ministry has the appearance of a 'mission'
and He knew it would end badly

but His death saved no one
His life and teachings ....did
 

Deeje

Avid Bible Student
Premium Member
I don't believe as you do

yeah.....His ministry has the appearance of a 'mission'
and He knew it would end badly

but His death saved no one
His life and teachings ....did

Then what was the purpose of his extraordinary birth and the manner of his death?
Why is his death called a "ransom" or a "redemption"? (Matthew 20:28)
 

MNoBody

Well-Known Member
relieved the plot line got tied together in the end of the story
it is finished...no more need to worry..fixed it....
so the book can be put away and one can go on and live life relieved that all that drama got dealt with.
saved from a bunch of needless anxiety and worry, if anything.
545.jpg
 
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Thief

Rogue Theologian
Then what was the purpose of his extraordinary birth and the manner of his death?
Why is his death called a "ransom" or a "redemption"? (Matthew 20:28)
maybe you noticed..
each interaction with the Carpenter had a different effect

it's all water....til it tastes like wine

I lean to the items of His ministry
His parables
His response to the people who come asking (anything)

I do not believe his death saved anyone
His life
His living
His ability to reach into people

so much more than walking on water

not that I would belittle such an event
had I been there......I would not let Him out of my sight
I would dread to sleep.....that He might be gone when I awake

to see as I do
look to Him as if you are right there as His life unfolds
as if you can see His Face

lectio divina
someone posted this to me
I had to look it up

Thief got caught
 

Muffled

Jesus in me
I don't either. Different denominations have the basics covered but have added other things which are not considered basic and fundamental. That's pretty standard.

I believe many Christians form their own beliefs that may be valid or not. I believe some people think their interpretation of the Bible is the same thing as the word of God. I prefer to understand scripture with help from the Holy Spirit.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
I don't believe as you do

yeah.....His ministry has the appearance of a 'mission'
and He knew it would end badly

but His death saved no one
His life and teachings ....did
Remember the Law that was inaugurated before Jesus came to the earth. He, although being the son of God and having come from heaven, was under the Law. He never sinned. He died, and as he was dying, he prayed to his father in heaven and told the criminal next to him that he would be with him in Paradise. That's in Luke chapter 23. "We are punished justly, for we are receiving what our actions deserve. But this man has done nothing wrong.” Then he said, “Jesus, remember me when You come into Your kingdom! And Jesus said to him, “Truly I tell you, today you will be with Me in Paradise.”
Now the question is, have you ever wondered why Jesus could promise the man dying next to him that he would be in Paradise with him? Also keep in mind that the temple with its sacrifices of bulls and other animals was out of commission once the Romans took over by force.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
indeed

on the mark

now......are your convictions?
dogmatic
scientific
philosophical
are just heart felt compulsions

the unbridled heart is fickle
How about the fear of dying? Most people have that.
 

YoursTrue

Faith-confidence in what we hope for (Hebrews 11)
The human obsession to be saved by concepts created by men is truly astounding.
Again, there is an inherent and rather pervasive fear of dying. Even when a person is shot dead by a criminal, people go in mourning, usually. They don't say, "Oh, well, that's how it goes..." Same with a child dying. Most people don't say, "Well, what are you going to do?" They are heartbroken. The heartbreak lasts as long as the parent lives.
 
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