Sacred texts... their revelation and challenge!

[PilgrimOfLight]

Wurt?

I shall simply ask what you believe the following passages are talking about.

Proverbs 3: 13-20

13 Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding.

14 For the merchandise of it is better than the merchandise of silver, and the gain thereof than fine gold.

15 She is more precious than rubies: and all the things thou canst desire are not to be compared unto her.

16 Length of days is in her right hand; and in her left hand riches and honour.

17 Her ways are ways of pleasantness, and all her paths are peace.

18 She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.

19 The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

20 By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew.

 

[Tumah]

I shall simply ask what you believe the following passages are talking about.

Proverbs 3: 13-20

13 Happy is the man that findeth wisdom, and the man that getteth understanding.

14 For the merchandise of it is better than the merchandise of silver, and the gain thereof than fine gold.

15 She is more precious than rubies: and all the things thou canst desire are not to be compared unto her.

16 Length of days is in her right hand; and in her left hand riches and honour.

17 Her ways are ways of pleasantness, and all her paths are peace.

18 She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her.

19 The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.

20 By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew.

Wisdom. That's why it says "wisdom".

Its tricky, I know. But still.

 

[Rival]

Wisdom. That's why it says "wisdom".

Its tricky, I know. But still.

Be careful, Tumah, this guy clearly knows his stuff.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

Wisdom. That's why it says "wisdom".

Its tricky, I know. But still.

I am saddened by that reply. Either because, with all your undoubted knowledge and studious effort you have never been told the truth of those verses, or because you do know what they actually refer to and like so many others, deliberately choose not to be open and honest about it. I have to presume it's the latter.

 

[Tumah]

I am saddened by that reply. Either because, with all your undoubted knowledge and studious effort you have never been told the truth of those verses, or because you do know what they actually refer to and like so many others, deliberately choose not to be open and honest about it. I have to presume it's the latter.

Don't presume its the latter. Presume I think very badly of people who fabricate some "real" novel truth that no one ever thought of.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

Don't presume its the latter. Presume I think very badly of people who fabricate some "real" novel truth that no one ever thought of.

I don't fabricate anything (if you were referring to me). By the grace of others my eyes have been opened to the truth of certain things in the Bible and elsewhere. Without such help I would still be in ignorance and taking such passages literally, thinking as you stated that they were about wisdom. I now realise they refer to something else and the latter 2 verses that talk about earth, heavens, rain/dew etc are vital elements.

It is my hope (perhaps a vain one) that I might find others on this forum who also know the true meaning of such verses.

 

[Tumah]

I don't fabricate anything (if you were referring to me). By the grace of others my eyes have been opened to the truth of certain things in the Bible and elsewhere. Without such help I would still be in ignorance and taking such passages literally, thinking as you stated that they were about wisdom. I now realise they refer to something else and the latter 2 verses that talk about earth, heavens, rain/dew etc are vital elements.

That's...nice...

It is my hope (perhaps a vain one) that I might find others on this forum who also know the true meaning of such verses.

Oh sure. There's plenty of crackers people who think they know "secret" stuff here.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

I appear to have incurred your disparagement for some reason. It was not my intention to offend or appear flippant. The truth of the verses I highlighted is mentioned numerous times in other books of the Bible. Jesus himself specifically mentions it. It all makes sense collectively.

 

[arthra]

18 She is a tree of life to them that lay hold upon her: and happy is every one that retaineth her. 19 The Lord by wisdom hath founded the earth; by understanding hath he established the heavens.
20 By his knowledge the depths are broken up, and the clouds drop down the dew.

Inspiration comes through this selection from Proverbs by PIlgrim and is evidence of the way many verses of the Bible are inspired and inspiring.

 

[Vinayaka]

For me as a Baha'i any text that was written by a Messenger of God or as we Baha'is call Them.. Manifestation of God would be a sacred text.

Since the Vedas weren't written by a 'manifestation', I guess we Hindus are out, as to sacredness. I don't know whether to cheer' laugh, or cry, lol.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

Inspiration comes through this selection from Proverbs by PIlgrim and is evidence of the way many verses of the Bible are inspired and inspiring.

Are you humouring me here or simply suggesting that any verses can have numerous interpretations?
In this instance the verses have a specific and imo undeniable meaning which relates to an alchemical process. Once the process is understood, the verses make total and very obvious sense. There must be others here who know the truth of this.

 

[arthra]

Since the Vedas weren't written by a 'manifestation', I guess we Hindus are out, as to sacredness. I don't know whether to cheer' laugh, or cry, lol.

I wouldn't say that.. The Vedas have inspiration as well:

HYMN XIII Havirdhanas.

1. I YOKE with prayer your ancient inspiration: may the laud rise as on the prince's pathway.
All Sons of Immortality shall hear it, all the possessors of celestial natures.

(Vedas, Rig Veda - Book 10)

and

Come breath to us from afar,
From the atmosphere, from the sky,
Life from the earth;
Thou art ambrosia; for breath thee!

(Vedas, Yajur Veda - Kanda III)

We may not know the Source .. The names of the Ancient Sages but still we are left with Their treasures.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

and others

YMN XXVII. Agni

2 May the far-striding Son of Strength, bringer of great felicity,
Who pours his gifts like rain, be ours

HYMN XXVIII. Indra, Etc

1 THERE where the broad-based stone raised on high to press the juices out,

O Indra, drink with eager thirst the droppings which the mortar sheds

 

[Vinayaka]

The scriptures, as my friend Aup pointed out, are all quite different, from different paradigms, and although would contain some similarities, are really incredibly different in style, content, etc. I see it as a massive body of work, some suitable to some folks, but not at all suitable to others. It's incredibly diverse, often congtradictory.

Then, also, some faiths really don't focus nearly as much on scripture as others do. Some folks can't go anywhere or do anything without referring to their 'book', whilst others don't refer to one at all, and still other faiths don't even have books.

 

[Jedster]

The scriptures, as my friend Aup pointed out, are all quite different, from different paradigms, and although would contain some similarities, are really incredibly different in style, content, etc. I see it as a massive body of work, some suitable to some folks, but not at all suitable to others. It's incredibly diverse, often congtradictory.

Then, also, some faiths really don't focus nearly as much on scripture as others do. Some folks can't go anywhere or do anything without referring to their 'book', whilst others don't refer to one at all, and still other faiths don't even have books.

Indeed so.
Many people of religion take the words of their book(s) as Truth; others have looked and found truth within themselves and can enjoy their book(s) as an expression of that which they recognise, just as 'secular' people enjoy poetry.

 

[Vinayaka]

Indeed so.
Many people of religion take the words of their book(s) as Truth; others have looked and found truth within themselves and can enjoy their book(s) as an expression of that which they recognise, just as 'secular' people enjoy poetry.

And this is why debate about scripture makes no sense to a lot of us. It's like being really interested in who to vote for in a country other than your own.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I wouldn't say that.. The Vedas have inspiration as well:

HYMN XIII Havirdhanas.

1. I YOKE with prayer your ancient inspiration: may the laud rise as on the prince's pathway.
All Sons of Immortality shall hear it, all the possessors of celestial natures.
(Vedas, Rig Veda - Book 10)

and

Come breath to us from afar,
From the atmosphere, from the sky,
Life from the earth;
Thou art ambrosia; for breath thee!
(Vedas, Yajur Veda - Kanda III)

We may not know the Source .. The names of the Ancient Sages but still we are left with Their treasures.

HYMN XXVII. Agni

2 May the far-striding Son of Strength, bringer of great felicity,
Who pours his gifts like rain, be ours

HYMN XXVIII. Indra, Etc

1 THERE where the broad-based stone raised on high to press the juices out,
O Indra, drink with eager thirst the droppings which the mortar sheds

Oh,my forebears were herders in Eurasian and Central Asian steppes. Their immediate concern was the welfare of their family and herd, and protection from elements, thieves and robbers. They thought worshiping their Gods with 'Soma' strengthens and pleases them. But there are other hymns which reject that Gods created the universe.

For example, even in this 21st Century I cannot add anything to the 'Nasadiya Sukta' in RigVeda. Rig Veda: Rig-Veda, Book 10: HYMN CXXIX. Creation.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

For example, even in this 21st Century I cannot add anything to the 'Nasadiya Sukta' in RigVeda. Rig Veda: Rig-Veda, Book 10: HYMN CXXIX. Creation.

Aupmanyav, thank you for this insight.

It seems that everywhere I look, I see this same message. The message of the Stone, Soma, Manna, whatever we choose to name it. I believe it exists, I have studied many many texts (100's ?) and treatises about it and by the grace of others who were prepared to impart some knowledge, I have a basic understanding of the processes involved, or at least I think I do. Yet I have not the necessary equipment to undertake the work, nor do I know where to find it and even then I would not wish to undertake the GW unless I fully knew the entire process lest I go astray and waste a great deal of time. I wish I could find others who have trod this road before me to gain more wisdom.

 

[Aupmanyav]

I have a basic understanding of the processes involved, or at least I think I do.

What processes are you talking about? Is it about 'Soma'? 'Soma' was probably akin to Ephidrene. Since we do not know about it anymore, Marijuana drink (Bhang) is popular and substitutes for it in India. Great drink, that is what people say.

 

[PilgrimOfLight]

What processes are you talking about? Is it about 'Soma'?

The processes for creating the Philospoher's Stone, the 7 processes of alchemy, the processes which are in 2 main parts, the first part dealing with the distillation and separation of the volatile and non volatile aspects, the second (longer) part dealing with the stages of putrifying, fermentation and rejoining of the male/female aspects.

There must be some on here who know these processes.