Rise of the dead

[Kenny]

Are you sure about that? If so then why was it holey?

Yes I am sure... but not sure about the second question.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Yes I am sure... but not sure about the second question.

Then you should not be sure about the first. Did you forget that the risen Jesus was both holy and holey?

 

[Kenny]

Then you should not be sure about the first. Did you forget that the risen Jesus was both holy and holey?

I am sure about the first. The eternal body was eternal before and after and still holds the mark for your salvation and mine (in context of my signature).

Jesus didn't sin so death had no authority over him. Since his body was created through the Word (as was all that we see) - He was created like unto Adam before Adam sinned.

 

[Subduction Zone]

I am sure about the first. The eternal body was eternal before and after and still holds the mark for your salvation and mine (in context of my signature).

Jesus didn't sin so death had no authority over him. Since his body was created through the Word (as was all that we see) - He was created like unto Adam before Adam sinned.

Your Bible disagrees with you. You forgot your own resurrection myth.

 

[Kenny]

Your Bible disagrees with you. You forgot your own resurrection myth.

You saying something without scriptural support remains a shot in the dark.

Come to the light of "source"

 

[Clara Tea]

RISE OF THE DEAD:

How compatible is the idea of literally return of dead people back to life, with science and philosophy?

Consider these scenarios:

1. If one has been eaten by a shark, then in turn, part of the flash had turned to energy, partly became the flash of the shark, and partly waste. Later that shark, dies, and its body was eaten by other fish.
A. Then on the Judgement Day, where and which location the physical body is generated, or the particles come back togther considering there is no grave.
Discuss scientifically and philosophically.

2. A baby who passed away, immediately after birth, or just before birth, and now is kept in an Alcohol container.

3. Albert Einstein, whose brain is kept in Alcohol container. How would His brain, as body part comes back and reassembled with the rest of the Body?

4. The idea of belief in resurrection of a dead in some ways, existed in non- Abrahamic ancient beliefs or myths, such as Osiris who was a resurrected king.
Did Abrahamic religions get their idea of resurrection from the myths, or it was the other way around? Discuss from historical point of view.
5. In Zoroasterism, we can see belief in the Judgement Day, and general resurrection. Did Abrahamic religions get their idea about Judgement Day from Zoroasterism or it was the other way around? Discuss from historical point of view.

Mass is trapped energy (E = mc^2).

So, mass and energy should be discussed together. Conservation of energy is really conservation of mass and energy together.

When someone dies, it isn't just a matter of energy never being destroyed. It is a matter of the form of that energy, and a matter of the storage of the knowledge.

If thinking is just a matter of energy, we should be able to think better if we plug our tongues into light sockets. Thinking doesn't work that way.

Memory, in a human, is similar to memory in a computer. There is a specific place where memories are stored. The brain is like a biological computer. Its wiring is different. Instead of binary (zeros and ones), the brain uses fuzzy logic (luke warm, warm, tepid, hot, scalding)....various degrees. There are about six levels. The same is with taste and smell.

In addition to using fuzzy logic, the brain forms complicated interconnections (they call it a neural net). Computers can be constructed on this principle, as well, but they are called neural networks.

The brain can actually grow new neurons to interconnect thoughts so that we could retrieve them. For example, if we remember a green ball, we could think of green things, and things that are balls.

To retain memory, when someone dies, their memory has to be stored in somewhat the same order, and the brain has to be wired somewhat the same way with complicated interconnections. It is rather unlikely. Furthermore, this process has never been observed.

However, psyhics seem to draw knowledge out of nowhere (the air?) Surely that knowledge is organized somehow.

If it is possible that energy of thoughts could be stored in space (or air), maybe there is some entity that uses the same storage media for thinking. That entity might be God. However, this is all highly speculative.

Many of our politicians have had their brains pickled in alcohol for years (but they were still alive at the time). Ulysses S Grant, for example.

 

[Clara Tea]

why do you assume it is made of the same material?

Or why assume that it is the same energy?

 

[Clara Tea]

You saying something without scriptural support remains a shot in the dark.

Come to the light of "source"

Many question the validity of scriptures. So, even with scriptural support, some might not believe.

 

[Kenny]

Mass is trapped energy (E = mc^2).

So, mass and energy should be discussed together. Conservation of energy is really conservation of mass and energy together.

When someone dies, it isn't just a matter of energy never being destroyed. It is a matter of the form of that energy, and a matter of the storage of the knowledge.

If thinking is just a matter of energy, we should be able to think better if we plug our tongues into light sockets. Thinking doesn't work that way.

Memory, in a human, is similar to memory in a computer. There is a specific place where memories are stored. The brain is like a biological computer. Its wiring is different. Instead of binary (zeros and ones), the brain uses fuzzy logic (luke warm, warm, tepid, hot, scalding)....various degrees. There are about six levels. The same is with taste and smell.

In addition to using fuzzy logic, the brain forms complicated interconnections (they call it a neural net). Computers can be constructed on this principle, as well, but they are called neural networks.

The brain can actually grow new neurons to interconnect thoughts so that we could retrieve them. For example, if we remember a green ball, we could think of green things, and things that are balls.

To retain memory, when someone dies, their memory has to be stored in somewhat the same order, and the brain has to be wired somewhat the same way with complicated interconnections. It is rather unlikely. Furthermore, this process has never been observed.

However, psyhics seem to draw knowledge out of nowhere (the air?) Surely that knowledge is organized somehow.

If it is possible that energy of thoughts could be stored in space (or air), maybe there is some entity that uses the same storage media for thinking. That entity might be God. However, this is all highly speculative.

Many of our politicians have had their brains pickled in alcohol for years (but they were still alive at the time). Ulysses S Grant, for example.

what if is is simple transferred to a thumb-drive called "your spirit"?

 

[Kenny]

Or why assume that it is the same energy?

Because spirit is eternal.

 

[Clara Tea]

Then you should not be sure about the first. Did you forget that the risen Jesus was both holy and holey?

And souly. But presumably his souly presence wasn't holey (the nail holes were not in his soul).

When we die, I presume that our bodies don't remain the same. For example, if someone is in a horrible accident, I don't suppose that they go for all eternity with a horribly misfigured and injured body.

If so, holy, holey, Jesus was made whole again. Then he would be holy, holey, and wholey.

 

[Kenny]

Many question the validity of scriptures. So, even with scriptural support, some might not believe.

True, and that is why I have the signature below.

But surely he shouldn't make a statement without siting where he is speaking from.

 

[Clara Tea]

what if is is simple transferred to a thumb-drive called "your spirit"?

Of course, that is the idea of a soul. But the question is, how is the knowledge of the brain stored in the soul?

Psychics can astral project their souls to other locations and see distant places. They can even transcend time. Thus, they are able to predict future events and see past events.

If so, their souls must somehow retain their knowledge. But how?

If psychics can move their souls to other galaxies in hardly any time, how can they move faster than the speed of light (in a vacuum) across the metric of space? Presumably, this is impossible by current science. But, if psychic energy is unlike any yet discovered, it might have different properties.

Certainly Christians believe in prophecies (like Revelation in the bible predicting the current war in Iraq). So they should have no trouble in believing in psychics.

 

[Clara Tea]

True, and that is why I have the signature below.

But surely he shouldn't make a statement without siting where he is speaking from.

Actually, many in the Christian faith also have different beliefs. This is because they don't believe everything that they read in the bible, and they pick out what they want to believe. Thus, they cherry pick what they want out of the bible. This leads to a lot of problems. For example, they are supposed to not kill (God's commandment), yet they come up with very good reasons to defend themselves, and sometimes make mistakes and attack those who are not even guilty....for example, Iraq was not linked with terrorism.

I would find it difficult to believe that people, who calls themselves Christian, would not believe in an afterlife. That is, after all, the goal (eternal life in the bliss of heaven). So this seems to be invariant in all Christians. Some might go to war, but they still believe in heaven and a soul.

 

[Native]

4. The idea of belief in resurrection of a dead in some ways, existed in non- Abrahamic ancient beliefs or myths, such as Osiris who was a resurrected king.
Did Abrahamic religions get their idea of resurrection from the myths, or it was the other way around? Discuss from historical point of view.
5. In Zoroasterism, we can see belief in the Judgement Day, and general resurrection. Did Abrahamic religions get their idea about Judgement Day from Zoroasterism or it was the other way around? Discuss from historical point of view.

The very idea of "dying and rising" is a mix of human conditions in a life time and of watching humanlike star constellations turning around on the night Sky, thus making four mytho-astronomic cardinal positions from the point of view of:

1) Star constellation figure diving to the ground (even to the underground if the constellation goes below the observation location horizon).
2: Star constellation figure laying horizontally Dying.
3) Star constellation figure rising = Beginning to be visible again.
4) Star constellation figure ascension to be full visible on the night Sky.

These four celestial figure positions constitute the globally wide spread myth of The Dying and Rising God (or Goddess).

Conclusion: Different cultures COULD HAVE this knowledge from other cultures, but the logics of the common story derives naturally from the same observations of the same celestial imagery of star constellations which have being imagined in humanlike (or animal-like) figures.

Unfortunately this ancient knowledge got lost in the Abrahamic religious traditions where "images were forbidden" which led to a loss of mythical and astronomical/cosmological descriptions of the world picture - which again led to pure dogmas based on religious persons and to a religious alienation in general.

 

[Brian2]

Probably from the Jesus story where he still had the same body. Nail holes and all.

Even in that story the same body would have been transformed into an immortal body.

 

[Kenny]

Of course, that is the idea of a soul. But the question is, how is the knowledge of the brain stored in the soul?

.

That is a good question. Obviously man still knows about a pin-head of knowledge as compared to what still needs to be discovered.

Perhaps that is why God is God and we are not.

 

[firedragon]

What does the scriptures say? Does it say, it is the same fingers assembled? Or it says, different material?
What does Quran say? What does the Christian Bible say, such as story of Lazarus? What does Hebrew Bible say?

Lazarus was supposedly resurrected on earth, but your OP seems to speak of "day of judgement" which is a completely different ballgame.

Don't take me wrong, your topic is fantastic and though some might think its all over the place, that's possibly because you cant put all you are thinking into one post.

Just a clarification.

 

[Kenny]

Actually, many in the Christian faith also have different beliefs. This is because they don't believe everything that they read in the bible, and they pick out what they want to believe. Thus, they cherry pick what they want out of the bible. This leads to a lot of problems. For example, they are supposed to not kill (God's commandment), yet they come up with very good reasons to defend themselves, and sometimes make mistakes and attack those who are not even guilty....for example, Iraq was not linked with terrorism.

I'm not sure how that is applicable to my statement of "support your statement with a scripture". Perhaps open a different thread?

I would find it difficult to believe that people, who calls themselves Christian, would not believe in an afterlife. That is, after all, the goal (eternal life in the bliss of heaven). So this seems to be invariant in all Christians. Some might go to war, but they still believe in heaven and a soul.

I agree. I haven't heard of a Christian who doesn't believe in an afterlife. Which sect are you talking about?

 

[ChristineM]

How compatible is the idea of literally return of dead people back to life, with science and philosophy?

I don't care what philosophy thinks. Science shows we are all made of dead people, so yes, the dead can live again.

To explain, the first law of thermodynamics tells us that all energy/matter continues. When someone/something dies its component atoms will eventually be re-used by something growing, eventually, that something will in all probability be a growing fetus or human child.