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Right to healthcare

Discussion in 'General Debates' started by Kungfuzed, Oct 8, 2010.

  1. Kungfuzed

    Kungfuzed Student Nurse

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    I believe this topic is sort of being discussed in another lengthy thread. I wanted to get your current thoughts on the right to healthcare. Of course anyone with money or the right insurance can buy the care they need, but what if you're broke? Do people have the right to free healthcare if they can't pay for it? Do they have the right to be treated by a hospital if they don't have insurance, or should the hospital have the right to accept or reject patients based on their ability to pay?
     
  2. Gunfingers

    Gunfingers Happiness Incarnate

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    A better question is whether people have a right to equal access to healthcare, since even in the US (in theory*) even the poor are able to get healthcare. From there questions become "should we spend the same amount keeping grandpa alive on a rhespirator for a few more days that we do trying to save a prematurely born baby"** and so on.

    *Medicare and medicaid are kind of broken, but establish that the majority in the US do acknowledge the right to access to healthcare. It also establishes that we don't give two ***** about making sure we implement such systems well.

    **The much-maligned death panels actually sounded like the best thing that could come from universal healthcare to me. One of the reasons healthcare in the US costs more per-capita is because medicaid really will keep grandpa alive on the rhespirator, at a cost of tens of thousands of dollars, where most other countries realize that that's stupid.
     
  3. Kungfuzed

    Kungfuzed Student Nurse

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    But should a certain degree of healthcare a right, like the right to vote? And if so, should it also be free to those who can't pay for it?
     
  4. Gunfingers

    Gunfingers Happiness Incarnate

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    Healthcare isn't quite as fundamental as voting. I regard providing healthcare for the poor as similar to welfare. It's a safety net, a way to make sure a person can still function and try to make themselves self-sufficient enough to not need the safety net anymore.
     
  5. Reptillian

    Reptillian Hamburgler Extraordinaire

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    I think they do. In an ideal world all people would have access to top notch medical care. What is the point of civilization if not to provide for every member's safety and health? If we have an elite healthy educated upper class and a downtrodden suffering ignorant lower class I don't think we can consider ourselves civilized...we ought to be ashamed. It may take a radical restructuring, but I think excellent healthcare (and education) can be provided to everyone. It'll never happen though because people fear change and only embrace it after the status quo becomes absolutely unbearable.
     
  6. tomato1236

    tomato1236 Ninja Master

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    Was healthcare ever considered a right prior to the 20th century?
     
  7. Gunfingers

    Gunfingers Happiness Incarnate

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    Healthcare wasn't particularly helpful prior to the 20th century, so i imagine not.
     
  8. tomato1236

    tomato1236 Ninja Master

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    Ummmm that's not true.
     
  9. DallasApple

    DallasApple Depends Upon My Mood..

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    You have to remember...we have the RIGHT to be born.(because our parents had sex).NOT a right to healthcare..(or even food for that matter)

    Ya'll dont forget that..

    After you are born ..WHO CARES!!!

    Its your problem man..
     
    #9 DallasApple, Oct 8, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 8, 2010
  10. Walkntune

    Walkntune Well-Known Member

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    Do we have the right to be born?
     
  11. DallasApple

    DallasApple Depends Upon My Mood..

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    Yes as long as my mother is pregnant with me..

    The rest is my problem..
     
  12. Kungfuzed

    Kungfuzed Student Nurse

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    There were many rights that didn't come along until the 20th century. I think more rights are to come in this century. I know here in the US that health care wasn't a right and still isn't, but do you think it should be?
     
  13. Sunstone

    Sunstone De Diablo Del Fora
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    I think people have a right to healthcare. The tribe would have looked after them in the past. Nations have replaced tribes. So, I think nations now have an obligation to look after their members.
     
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  14. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Rival's Wife

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    I couldn't have said it better.
     
  15. sandandfoam

    sandandfoam Veteran Member

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    Everyone should have equal access to healthcare.
    Life is already skewed in favour of those with the money.
     
  16. Eliot Wild

    Eliot Wild Irreverent Agnostic Jerk

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    Though it is not a formalized entry into in our criminal or civil law code, the United States was FOUNDED on the notion that all peoples are entitled to the rights of 'life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness'.

    By extension, the right to life would seem to naturally imply the 'right to healthcare', as healthcare is, or can be, a necessary element in maintaining human life.

    In other words, though there is nothing in the U.S. Constitution that makes LEGAL and BINDING Jefferson's philosophical proposition regarding our inherent human rights, it is a conceptual foundation that supposedly frames our very purpose and reason for existing as a nation, as a common people. We were literally designed as a state to be the guarantor of HUMAN RIGHTS that other failing and flawed political systems had denied to their citizens.

    However, all that being said, there is really NO SUCH THING AS INHERENT HUMAN RIGHTS. There is only a compact that exists between humans and the forces that govern them. That is called the LAW. The LAW can be amended or revoked at anytime, and what we once held in compact with the state, the state can duly or unduly change.

    That is why, like Spiderman, I operate outside the law. I expect no free healthcare for I pay no taxes, or at least as little as I can get away with. And furthermore, I refuse to stop at red lights if there are no cars to bar my passing. I am a rebel. I am a man without a country . . . but I do have one helluva heath insurance plan, so ehhh, what do I care.



    (the last paragraph above is pure comedy and not to be taken seriously . . . not good comedy, but still not to be taken seriously, nonetheless)
     
    #16 Eliot Wild, Oct 9, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 9, 2010
  17. tomato1236

    tomato1236 Ninja Master

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    No. To me, healthcare is much like any other service we receive in society. Not altogether different from deciding I have the right to regular haircuts. If it's something I want, I should pay for it, or my insurance should pay for it. If I'm 87 years old and I'm dying, and I can't afford the $600,000 medical bill for a surgery that will keep me alive for 2 more years, I would feel irrisponsible to decide that I should have the surgery at any cost, leaving others with a large financial burden for my benefit. Suffering sucks. I'm not opposed to help being available to those who are suffering. I just think that would fall much more into the privilege category rather than in "my rights". If a millionaire came and paid for my surgery, I would certainly feel and show gratitude for it, rather than saying, "jeez, it's about time someone recognized my right to this surgery."
     
  18. tomato1236

    tomato1236 Ninja Master

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    I heard on the radio that there are European countries that have decided that family vacations are a right. The government now subsidizes family vacations for workers there.

    If it's so unfair that the wealthy have good healthcare, why don't we decide it's a right to drive a lamborghini too? I mean, why should only the rich drive a lamborghini? Driving a lamborghini falls under my right to pursue happiness, because, well, who can deny they would smile while driving a lamborghini?
     
  19. tumbleweed41

    tumbleweed41 Resident Liberal Hippie

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    No society in the 21st Century should be called civilized that does not provide equal access to healthcare without regard to social status or financial ability to pay for said healthcare.

    A healthy society is a productive society.
     
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  20. tumbleweed41

    tumbleweed41 Resident Liberal Hippie

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    Are you really comparing driving a Lamborghini to the ability to see a Doctor about that unexplained lump in your chest?
    :facepalm:
     
    #20 tumbleweed41, Oct 11, 2010
    Last edited: Oct 11, 2010
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