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Reunification (NOT): the Israeli "left" never fails to disgust

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I'm not really sure about your thread title. As the law was not passed, that actually means there will be more unifications of families. The law was created to stop this from happening and must be voted on annually.

I honestly expected you'd be making a celebratory thread marking the occasion of an event that could (if certain people continue playing their cards right) may well lead to the realization of your dream of Jews finally leaving Israel as the Arabs there create a "Palestinian" state.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
I was not aware of this law. I noted this: "there was also a demographic goal" which tells me that Israel will do everything it can to stop the inevitable demographic effect of Israeli Arabs having more children than Jews.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I was not aware of this law. I noted this: "there was also a demographic goal" which tells me that Israel will do everything it can to stop the inevitable demographic effect of Israeli Arabs having more children than Jews.
You know, I'm pretty sure I've heard you push this claim several times around here, but as far as I know from demographic studies done in Israel over the past decade or so, there is no fear of this. Israeli-Arab childbirth has dropped significantly and is still dropping.

דו"ח: ירידה בילודה באוכלוסייה הערבית והחרדית
"היום בחברה הערבית רמת הילודה זהה לזו של היהודים"
לא מה שחשבתם: מספר ערביי ישראל דווקא מתחיל לרדת
לראשונה, שיעור הפריון של היהודים בישראל ובהתנחלויות גבוה מזה של ערביי ישראל
http://aranne5.bgu.ac.il/others/Qaddah-AmaraNada.pdf
הנתונים מוכיחים: אין שום 'פצצת זמן דמוגרפית' ערבית

Sorry the links are in Hebrew.

The end goal of the law, however, had and has nothing to do with Arab childbirth rates. It was instituted because terrorists during the Second Intifada realized they could use Israeli law to gain citizenship and thus kill more Jews - which is exactly what happened. The reverse law, which is the one that needs to be voted upon annually - was instituted to ensure that terrorists would not be able to gain citizenship.
 

Jayhawker Soule

-- untitled --
Premium Member
I'm not really sure about your thread title. As the law was not passed, that actually means there will be more unifications of families. The law was created to stop this from happening and must be voted on annually.
I an delighted that it was not passed. I am disgusted by the willingness of Meretz et. al. to capitulate for the dubious honor of being in a "coalition" with the likes of Bennett.

I honestly expected you'd be making a celebratory thread marking the occasion of an event that could (if certain people continue playing their cards right) may well lead to the realization of your dream of Jews finally leaving Israel as the Arabs there create a "Palestinian" state.
^ filth
 

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
I an delighted that it was not passed. I am disgusted by the willingness of Meretz et. al. to capitulate for the dubious honor of being in a "coalition" with the likes of Bennett.
To be fair, was there any other way to get rid of Netanyahu?
Or a realistic constellation of government that wouldn't include genocidal ethnostate fanatics?
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I an delighted that it was not passed. I am disgusted by the willingness of Meretz et. al. to capitulate for the dubious honor of being in a "coalition" with the likes of Bennett.
Oh, good. I'm happy for you. I'll likely be here during the next Intifada. What will you be doing then?

Also, I still don't get your title. To be more specific, I don't get the "Reunification (NOT)" part.
I seem to recall seeing you once (or more) writing here something along the lines of the two-state solution being the lesser of two evils. I can only assume that the biggest evil is the reality of there being no "Palestinian" state and that the best reality would be no Jewish state.
Feel free to correct me on the matter. In an optimal reality (per your definition), is there any room for a Jewish State anywhere in the Land of Israel? And if not, is there room for such a state anywhere in the world? Like, say, Antarctica?
 
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Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
@Harel13
Why would you want a Jewish ethnostate?
What benefit do you believe it conveys that a secular state that grants equal rights to Jews and non-Jews could not?
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
@Harel13
Why would you want a Jewish ethnostate?
What benefit do you believe it conveys that a secular state that grants equal rights to Jews and non-Jews could not?
The Jewish state is a key step in the process of the final, full redemption, per Judaism. A Jewish state with a secular government is the first step towards a Jewish state with a religious government, one that will follow the statutes of Jewish law, further pushing the entire Jewish Nation towards the redemption.
 

sun rise

The world is on fire
Premium Member
The Jewish state is a key step in the process of the final, full redemption, per Judaism. A Jewish state with a secular government is the first step towards a Jewish state with a religious government, one that will follow the statutes of Jewish law, further pushing the entire Jewish Nation towards the redemption.

To me the real redemption will have arrived when Jews say to Arabs "Shalom Aleichem" and the Arabs reply "Wa-Alaikum-Salaam". To me, true redemption is through seeing everyone as brothers and sisters and not through religious divisiveness and strife.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
To me the real redemption will have arrived when Jews say to Arabs "Shalom Aleichem" and the Arabs reply "Wa-Alaikum-Salaam". To me, true redemption is through seeing everyone as brothers and sisters and not through religious divisiveness and strife.
You know, I never defined the Jewish redemption on this thread. And I don't know whether you actually know what that is.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
I don't know and would like to know please. :)
In Jewish thought, the redemption is divided into phases. There are disagreements on what order the phases will be in, but in general, what we expect that will happen:

All of the Jewish People will be gathered from around the world to the Land of Israel. The state there will be governed according to Jewish law and led by the Jewish king, often referred to as "the Messiah". He will defeat Israel's enemies and establish peace in the world (note: he will not rule the world, only the Jewish people. The nations will still govern themselves). The Jews will rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem. There will be universal recognition of God, and people from the nations will come to Jerusalem to worship. The Jews will fulfill their roles as teachers of mankind, while the other nations will fulfill the various roles they were tasked with by God. Each nation has its own duty in the world. And at some point far into the future of the redeemed world, the world will transition into The-World-To-Come.
 

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
So, does anybody else want to argue that the state of Israel has an inherent right to subjugate all non-Jews under a Jewish theocracy?
 

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
Anyone "else"? No one has done so on this thread so far.
The other options to deal with Israel's non-Jewish population would be ethnic cleansing or genocide; I assumed that you had ruled those out already. Feel free to correct me if I was wrong.
 

Harel13

Am Yisrael Chai
Staff member
Premium Member
The other options to deal with Israel's non-Jewish population would be ethnic cleansing or genocide; I assumed that you had ruled those out already. Feel free to correct me if I was wrong.
You're wrong in that no one had ever discussed the matter on this thread.

So, O fan of democracy. What would you think of the "Palestinian" Arabs if they were to create their own theocratic state? And what would you think if they decided to split it between all the khamulot (clans) so they could freely carry on with their in-fighting? If you think either situation is implausible because democracy is the greatest form of governance ever and why would anyone choose anything else over it, then you know nothing of the Middle East.
 
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Secret Chief

nirvana is samsara
In Jewish thought, the redemption is divided into phases. There are disagreements on what order the phases will be in, but in general, what we expect that will happen:

All of the Jewish People will be gathered from around the world to the Land of Israel. The state there will be governed according to Jewish law and led by the Jewish king, often referred to as "the Messiah". He will defeat Israel's enemies and establish peace in the world (note: he will not rule the world, only the Jewish people. The nations will still govern themselves). The Jews will rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem. There will be universal recognition of God, and people from the nations will come to Jerusalem to worship. The Jews will fulfill their roles as teachers of mankind, while the other nations will fulfill the various roles they were tasked with by God. Each nation has its own duty in the world. And at some point far into the future of the redeemed world, the world will transition into The-World-To-Come.
What is this based upon? :)
 

Justanatheist

Well-Known Member
In Jewish thought, the redemption is divided into phases. There are disagreements on what order the phases will be in, but in general, what we expect that will happen:

All of the Jewish People will be gathered from around the world to the Land of Israel. The state there will be governed according to Jewish law and led by the Jewish king, often referred to as "the Messiah". He will defeat Israel's enemies and establish peace in the world (note: he will not rule the world, only the Jewish people. The nations will still govern themselves). The Jews will rebuild the Temple in Jerusalem. There will be universal recognition of God, and people from the nations will come to Jerusalem to worship. The Jews will fulfill their roles as teachers of mankind, while the other nations will fulfill the various roles they were tasked with by God. Each nation has its own duty in the world. And at some point far into the future of the redeemed world, the world will transition into The-World-To-Come.
Just out of interest, after you have established your theocracy what are you going to teach me?
 

Kooky

Freedom from Sanity
You're wrong in that no one had ever discussed the matter on this thread.
So how do you expect your Israeli ethnostate to deal with the non-Jews currently living on Israeli land?

So, O fan of democracy. What would you think of the "Palestinian" Arabs if they were to create their own theocratic state? And what would you think if they decided to split it between all the khamulot (clans) so they could freely carry on with their in-fighting? If you think either situation is implausible because democracy is the greatest form of governance ever and why would anyone choose anything else over it, then you know nothing of the Middle East.
What does any of this have to do with what I said?
 
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