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religious agnostics

Earthtank

Active Member
agnostics can be very religious, and they can have strong faith in god. they are agnostic when it comes to knowledge of god by scientific standards. they simple say ''we don't know'' in my opinion. agnostics can be devout christians, when it comes to the teachings of christ.

Hey Mods, can we please get a "confused" rating added?
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Depends on the God you are talking about. Some people's concept of is known what he is or is not, and some concepts of God are described as a he or she.

True, but if God exists God cannot be defined by any of the above.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
True, but if God exists God cannot be defined by any of the above.
That's only if YOUR concept of God exists he can't be described that way; but not everybody has your concept of God, some people have concepts of God that if they did exist they could and are described that way
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
That's only if YOUR concept of God exists he can't be described that way; but not everybody has your concept of God, some people have concepts of God that if they did exist they could and are described that way

Of course anyone can define God as a dragon, 'Spaghetti Monster,' A King in the clouds, or whatever, but this presents a problem and contradictory if God is an all powerful Creator of our physical existence.

Conflicting views and beliefs of God in many diverse religions does make the different religions irrational and illogical and questionable whether God exists or not. Part of the problem is that the way God is defined in different religions has a strong cultural element. Considering the nature of of universal Creator God if God exists fallible humans cannot define God from the human perspective.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Of course anyone can define God as a dragon, 'Spaghetti Monster,' A King in the clouds, or whatever, but this presents a problem and contradictory if God is an all powerful Creator of our physical existence.
The contradiction is only if God is described as YOUR God is described. Again; not all God concepts are described as all powerful creator of physical existence like yours
Conflicting views and beliefs of God in many diverse religions does make the different religions irrational and illogical and questionable whether God exists or not. Part of the problem is that the way God is defined in different religions has a strong cultural element. Considering the nature of of universal Creator God if God exists fallible humans cannot define God from the human perspective.
What’s preventing them? Especially when you consider nearly every God comes with a unsubstantiated Ancient Holy Text that does a pretty good job of describing him.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
The contradiction is only if God is described as YOUR God is described. Again; not all God concepts are described as all powerful creator of physical existence like yours.

I do not describe God as my God. Actually, pretty mu all the Abrahamic religions describe God as all powerful creator of physical existence, which is the subject here. Yes, there are many polytheistic, and miscellaneous Gods in many cultures, but not the subject here.

What’s preventing them? Especially when you consider nearly every God comes with a unsubstantiated Ancient Holy Text that does a pretty good job of describing him.

Nothing is preventing anyone from believing in any version of God they choose. When did I say they could not?
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
I do not describe God as my God. Actually, pretty mu all the Abrahamic religions describe God as all powerful creator of physical existence, which is the subject here. Yes, there are many polytheistic, and miscellaneous Gods in many cultures, but not the subject here.
When you said “if God exist, he can’t be defined” you made it about all monotheistic Gods; not just the God of Abraham. If you meant specifically the God of Abraham, you should have clarified by saying so hence my misunderstanding of the point you made.
Nothing is preventing anyone from believing in any version of God they choose. When did I say they could not?
That’s not what I asked. What’s preventing (since we’re talking about the God of Abraham) a Christian from reading the bible, using the descriptions of God from the bible to describe him?
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
When you said “if God exist, he can’t be defined” you made it about all monotheistic Gods; not just the God of Abraham. If you meant specifically the God of Abraham, you should have clarified by saying so hence my misunderstanding of the point you made.

Consider my view the God of Abraham for now on for discussion, but this does preclude that Monotheists do not believe in many Gods . Other religions are not as clear nor consistent in belief of a Monotheistic God. Belief in Monotheism precludes the existence of many other different kinds of Gods.

Again, Monotheists believe their God is the only universal God, and define God in many conflicting ways, which is a contradiction.

It is obvious you do not believe in Gods, and I acknowledge that. You do not seem to comprehend the substance of my argument that from the human perspective we cannot define God, if it is believed, at the exclusion of other religious beliefs in a Monotheistic God.

That’s not what I asked. What’s preventing (since we’re talking about the God of Abraham) a Christian from reading the bible, using the descriptions of God from the bible to describe him?

Nothing as I said before. People can believe in any kind of Monotheistic God the want. Christians for the most part do not believe in many kinds of Gods, ie like the Greeks.
 
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Kfox

Well-Known Member
Consider my view the God of Abraham for now on for discussion,
Will do.
Other religions are not as clear nor consistent in belief of a Monotheistic God.
You say that from the outside looking in. When I stand outside and look in at your religion, Christianity doesn’t look very clear nor consistent in a belief of a Monotheistic God; when you look at issues like the Trinity, let us make man, etc.
Belief in Monotheism precludes the existence of many other different kinds of Gods.
Christianity is not the first monotheist religion; there were others before it.
Again, Monotheists believe their God is the only universal God, and define God in many conflicting ways, which is a contradiction.
If a Christian get their description of God from the Bible, where is the contradiction?
Nothing as I said before. People can believe in any kind of Monotheistic God the want. Christians for the most part do not believe in many kinds of Gods, ie like the Greeks.
Did you even read what I said? Because your response had nothing to do with what I asked.
Again; what’s to stop a Christian from reading the Bible, and describing God in accordance to how he is described in the Bible?
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Will do.

You say that from the outside looking in. When I stand outside and look in at your religion, Christianity doesn’t look very clear nor consistent in a belief of a Monotheistic God; when you look at issues like the Trinity, let us make man, etc.

Yes, but they consider the Trinity Monotheistic, and other Christians do not believe in the Trinity as Monotheist based on the same Bible.

Christianity is not the first monotheist religion; there were others before it.

True, so what?!?!?! Not an issue

If a Christian get their description of God from the Bible, where is the contradiction?

First even though the same Bible many Christians come up with different beliefs in God.

Did you even read what I said? Because your response had nothing to do with what I asked.
Again; what’s to stop a Christian from reading the Bible, and describing God in accordance to how he is described in the Bible?

Yes, I did read your responses. My responses are specific.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Hey Mods, can we please get a "confused" rating added?

It is not as confusing as you think. I believe in God, but consider myself a 'philosophical agnostic,' because in reality I do not know whether God exists or not. Many theists realize that there is no factual certainty that God exists.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
First even though the same Bible many Christians come up with different beliefs in God.
Like your belief that God can't be described? You're making my point.
Yes, I did read your responses. My responses are specific.
Your answer was about people who worship other Gods; not the Christian God. My question was about those who worship the Christian God. Care to try again? This time answer MY question; not something else
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
Like your belief that God can't be described? You're making my point.

Your answer was about people who worship other Gods; not the Christian God. My question was about those who worship the Christian God. Care to try again? This time answer MY question; not something else

Answered your question.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
Answered your question.
You did not answer my question. I asked about Christians who read the Bible, and you answer about people who are of other religions. It appears you aren't going to answer my question; and I think I know why. My point is, though you may not be able to describe God, there are others who feel they can and do.
 

shunyadragon

shunyadragon
Premium Member
You did not answer my question. I asked about Christians who read the Bible, and you answer about people who are of other religions. It appears you aren't going to answer my question; and I think I know why. My point is, though you may not be able to describe God, there are others who feel they can and do.

It remains that Christians and non-Christians who read the Bible come up with many different interpretations, and just simply describe God differently based on their interpretation.

Actually, this thread is about religious agnostics, and your line of reasoning is off topic.
 

Kfox

Well-Known Member
It remains that Christians and non-Christians who read the Bible come up with many different interpretations, and just simply describe God differently based on their interpretation.
Ahh so he can be described. Thanks for finally answering my question.
 
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