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Featured Reincarnation

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Spartan, Jun 2, 2019.

  1. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चितानन्द
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    I won’t speak for @Kapalika, but there my be a reason she capitalized “Universe.” It could be she was speaking of something different than the physical universe?

    At least that’s what I read into it.
     
  2. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    the majority of these kids are from third world countries going all the way back to the 1970s with the initial studies by Dr. Ian Stevenson.

    you don't know what you're talking about.
     
  3. sooda

    sooda Veteran Member

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    Reincarnation was widely accepted in the Roman Empire until the 5th century AD. They were deathly afraid Nero would return from the dead with an army of Parthians and start the persecutions again. That may explain some of the symbolic language in Revelation.

    And, in a way he did.... if you consider Dominitan. He was really an ugly piece of work.
     
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  4. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    They aren't as secluded or as isolated as you'd think. Third world doesn't mean cut off from the rest of the world.
    You'd like to think, but it was researching this, and similar things, as a believer that lead me to realize there are some serious issues and problems with the evidence. one example I kind of remember is a girl who claimed to have lived in ancient Egypt. It seemed convincing, but the girl had no idea about horses in ancient Egyptian life and those details she got wrong is how she was revealed as a fraud.
    Really, kids get away with it because adults severely downplay and underestimate the abilities and capabilities of children.
     
  5. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

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    But reincarnation is not present in most western religions or beliefs as compared to the east so that it could be seen as confirmation bias or part of social conditioning.

    How is that western children talk about reincarnation then !

    Children Who Report Memories of Previous Lives | Division of Perceptual Studies

    Here, we see a whole website devoted to western children's past life memories and advice to western parents on how to respond and handle them. Obviously there is not going to be a lot of smoke without fire.
     
  6. ameyAtmA

    ameyAtmA ~ SacchidAnanda ~
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    That is correct. So what actually happens is this:

    unmanifest manifest unmanifest manifest unmanifest manifest unmanifest....

    This cycle is what is eternal. When you/scientists see the universe is going to 'end' owing to laws of thermodynamics and entropy, that is simply the physical energy of the current cycle. What happens after THAT cycle is not being considered, hence that is only a snapshot of the Truth of timeless existence.

    Because Brahman is consciousness, awareness, in manifests the universe again, in stages, which expand over a very very long period of time until we come to the galaxy formation stage.

    Surprisingly, this is described with amazing accuracy in the Hindu purANas. The eternal cycles of time-space.

    As for savior versus learning life-lessons and transformation of the jivAtmA, why does it have to be mutually exclusive as Christian versus Hindu?

    While we learn our life lessons and try to abide by wisdom imparted by the ancients, our IshTaDev or SadGuru can be our savior. The role of the savior is to provide unconditional love and nourishment which makes you strong at heart, ready to take on the challenging spiritual lessons.

    Shri KRshNa is my Everything, a super-set of savior, and other forms of the same Brahman also bless the seeking souls, including Jesus by the way.

    So your IshTaDev and Guru is Jesus and mine is Shri KRshNa.
    The difference is I embrace Jesus except for the "Only Way" part (unless you interpret Jesus == the Principle of SadGuru = anyone who fits that role), whereas many Christians reject Hindu dharma without knowing even the tip of the iceberg floating on the ocean of this eternal Dharma :) but that is OK.

    Question: How do you know that those Christians who follow Jesus only namesake or half-heartedly, and do not really follow his instructions will not be reborn in the world because their lessons are unfinished ?
    but not necessarily go to eternal hell -- since what purpose would that serve? Would you fail a 4th grader eternally because they failed the exam once?
    -----

    This summation of common Hindu thought only shows humility: I do not know if I will live up to your expectations completely in this life, O God, but Thy Will be done, and if I do have to come back to this world, please make it so that I will never forget You, and resume where I left off.

    Even without this prayer, KRshNa assures Arjun in BG Chapter 6 - Yogis who did not reach the Ultimate State, resume where they left off.

    My prayer to Shri KRshNa is to follow the principle of early MS-Windows in case I have to come back :: "Don't call Me, I'll call you."

    So now I have created this hook and can rest in peace because now it is His responsibility to call the hook, because I won't know any better. Who is the "I" in this context? The current left-over pieces of ego just in case it remains.
     
    #86 ameyAtmA, Jun 2, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2019
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  7. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta and Spiritualist and Pantheist
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    Here's a good example. The case of Shanti Devi (from Wikipedia):

    According to these accounts, when she was about four years old, she told her parents that her real home was in Mathura where her husband lived, about 145 km from her home in Delhi. Discouraged by her parents, she ran away from home at age six, trying to reach Mathura. Back home, she stated in school that she was married and had died ten days after having given birth to a child. Interviewed by her teacher and headmaster, she used words from the Mathura dialect and divulged the name of her merchant husband, "Kedar Nath". The headmaster located a merchant by that name in Mathura who had lost his wife, Lugdi Devi, nine years earlier, ten days after having given birth to a son. Kedar Nath traveled to Delhi, pretending to be his own brother, but Shanti Devi immediately recognized him and Lugdi Devi's son. As she knew several details of Kedar Nath's life with his wife, he was soon convinced that Shanti Devi was indeed the reincarnation of Lugdi Devi. When Mahatma Gandhi heard about the case, he met the child and set up a commission to investigate. The commission traveled with Shanti Devi to Mathura, arriving on 15 November 1935. There she recognized several family members, including the grandfather of Lugdi Devi. She found out that Kedar Nath had neglected to keep a number of promises he had made to Lugdi Devi on her deathbed. She then traveled home with her parents. The commission's report concluded that Shanti Devi was indeed the reincarnation of Lugdi Devi.[2]
     
  8. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    It doesnt have to be for someone to be aware of it. Even before google and the internet, we learned of things, as children even, that happened elsewhere in the world, what people believed, religions of other people, and so in.
     
  9. Salvador

    Salvador RF's Swedenborgian

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    Attn: Reincarnation/Resurrection believers., Consciousness might not be able to exist as being disembodied. Consciousness may have emerged naturally with the evolution of the body and its encased brain. Hence, please keep in mind that neither reincarnation "soul" nor resurrected "souls" might not actually exist. The fact consciousness has always been observed as being embodied, there is good reason to believe neither reincarnated souls nor resurrected souls do likely actually exist.
     
    #89 Salvador, Jun 2, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2019
  10. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    It does seem silly given we have advanced in neurosciences enough to say the brain is basically our operating system, and it functions heavily within parameters of one's culture of birth. This means a soul is going to be heavily restricted to what the brain is, but once the brain dies then this soul would somehow have to leave this body, and either reform as something else until reincarnation or reincarnate immediately, and forgetting it all from the past anyway. So it begs to be asked what's the point when we are a brain and we cant reflect upon a past life to learn from it like we can examine e the details of last week to not make the same mistakes again.
     
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  11. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

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    How would you explain James Leininger's emotional traumas as an infant, and his technical understanding of aircraft and world war 2 history which even his parents were ignorant of !

    Reincarnated! Our son is a World War II pilot come back to life | Daily Mail Online
     
  12. SalixIncendium

    SalixIncendium सच्चितानन्द
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    Heard you the first time. Still disagree. :)
     
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  13. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    He grew up in the digital age. People his age have never known the limited access to information like the generations before his. And the parent's knowledge or ignorance is irrelevant. I'm sure many of us, even as children, knew things our parents didn't.
     
  14. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

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    Should he, as a two year old, have to cry about his plane crashing into flames , to the point of five nightmares a week till the age of eight, just because he had access to information about world war 2 fighter jets and history in a detailed manner at the age of two !
     
  15. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    I doubt his details were actually that good (I'd need to see any actual interviews or other prime source material in order to review them in full), but at two, kids get frightened of things. Some kids got scared of robots or dinosaurs, clowns or aliens because of media influences. A kid who saw a WWII video and was frightened, or a kid who was a WWII fighter pilot? Only one actually seems plausible.
     
  16. ajay0

    ajay0 Well-Known Member

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    You can read a book that covers his story in a detailed manner...

    Soul Survivor: The Reincarnation Of A World War II Fighter Pilot by Bruce and Andrea Leininger with Ken Gross


    I remember seeing Jurassic Park as a kid and having a nightmare over a dinosaur chasing me. But it was a single nightmare that ended there, and later I laughed about it.

    For a two year old kid to have a significant detailed understanding of world war 2 history and figher jets and other factual information like the names of the pilots, and cry over some made up story for years , seems to indicate an extraordinary attention span even for a teenager.
     
  17. Fool

    Fool ALL in all
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    i've read the research. you implied they all had access to tv and information. they don't

    there is never going to be an absolute in science. real science doesn't make that assumption. i don't believe for a minute that all those children are making this up just to prove reincarnation exists.
     
  18. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    If they have no access to information then how then did they learn their native tongue?
     
  19. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    I doubt most of them are making it up. They probably are envisioning and dreaming things. But those aren't past lives.
     
  20. Shadow Wolf

    Shadow Wolf Crazy Diamond

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    From what I gather, the kid was obsessed with aircraft prior to, and could name models of aircraft with ease. That isn't unusual or impressive, and again its adults downplaying and underestimating the mind of a child (I've known children of a similar age who can do the same with cars). The book was also written by the parents after several years of trying to confirm their belief, to the point of taking their child to a reunion meeting of a WW2 crew, and their only evidence is they don't believe their child who was obsessed with aircraft and saturated with information about them could have named a few things during WW2, including naming a pilot who just happened to have a very common name. There is no mention about airplane mechanics or specific details about them.
     
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