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Refund Department

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
I occasionally get calls out of the blue from a 'Refund Department' of a major computer company (I won't give the name, but anyone can guess). Today I decided to actually let them talk me through their little fraud just to see what they would do. I want to emphasize: THIS SHOULD NOT BE DONE UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

As a preparation, I set up a virtual machine with the OS suggested by the 'Refund Department' before my call. The person who answered asked me my name (I gave a false one) and proceeded to claim that there was $499 of refund owed to me from this company. Oh Boy! almost $500 free dollars! jackpot!

So, what did I have to do to claim this wonderful refund? Well, the first thing they wanted to do was to have me download a remote desktop application. Now, these programs *do* have legitimate uses (for example, to remotely log into a work computer) but I can assure you that a refund department will never want you to download one.

So, I faked ignorance and incompetence, having the virtual computer reboot a couple of time, pausing the VM, and generally hitting wrong buttons and closing downloading stuff to drag out the overall process.

After about 30 minutes of this I *finally* got a remote desktop installed and gave over control to the person on the other side. They wanted me to go to my bank's website (oh, no, I don't do online banking!--so I said). After the other side clearly got frustrated with me, he proceeded to change the password on the machine, eventually claiming that he locked up the computer (he *would* have, but it is a virtual machine and I saved a snapshot) and called me some rather foul names for wasting his time.

All in all, about 45 minutes on the phone.

What is bothersome is that there were clearly other calls going on in the background, probably by actual suckers for this fraud. Of course, once they obtain your banking information, they will empty your account. Of course, they never got that from me.

The only reason I engaged with these guys (and I do NOT recommend doing so) is that I was bored and know how to set up a system that could (and did) fool them.

But I want to warm people who don't already know:

DO NOT GIVE OUT BANKING INFORMATION TO ANYONE CALLING YOU COLD.

ALSO, DO NOT GIVE PERMISSION TO CONTROL YOUR COMPUTER TO ANYONE YOU DON'T TRUST.

This has been a public service announcement.
 

Kangaroo Feathers

Yea, it is written in the Book of Cyril...
When my daughter was 2, when telemarketers or other scammers called, I'd just hand my daughter the handset, and she would happily babble away for as long as they'd stay on the phone. Some telemarketers, it turns out, aren't allowed to hang up on an active call AT ALL :)
 
Last edited:

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
Glad you wasted their time, the crook on the other end was probably on comission and your ploy cost him dear.

As you say, never, ever give bank account details to anyone.

Also, when using a credit card online, always check the website url begins https:// the s is important, it identifies the site as secure.
 

suncowiam

Well-Known Member
I lost my Diablo 3 inventory because I actually fell for a blizzard password reset scam.

It's good that you conveniently had a VM going at the time.
 

Polymath257

Think & Care
Staff member
Premium Member
I lost my Diablo 3 inventory because I actually fell for a blizzard password reset scam.

It's good that you conveniently had a VM going at the time.

I have one set up for just such calls. It comes up fairly quickly :)
 

David1967

Well-Known Member
Premium Member
When my daughter was 2, when telemarketers or other scammers called, I'd just hand my daughter the handset, and she would happily babble away for as long as they'd stay on the phone. Some telemarketers, it turns out, aren't allowed to hang up on an active call AT ALL :)

I did the same thing. I would tell the telemarketer that they were being transferred to our "phone solicitation dept." and hand my then 2 year old daughter the phone. She spoke some language quite fluently, but it sure wasn't English.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
When my daughter was 2, when telemarketers or other scammers called, I'd just hand my daughter the handset, and she would happily babble away for as long as they'd stay on the phone. Some telemarketers, it turns out, aren't allowed to hang up on an active call AT ALL :)

My tactic is language. I speak English and French. If a number i dont recognise calls, if the number begins 0044 (uk) i speak french otherwise i speak English. Chances are the telemarketer does not know what to do.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
I occasionally get calls out of the blue from a 'Refund Department' of a major computer company (I won't give the name, but anyone can guess). Today I decided to actually let them talk me through their little fraud just to see what they would do. I want to emphasize: THIS SHOULD NOT BE DONE UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

As a preparation, I set up a virtual machine with the OS suggested by the 'Refund Department' before my call. The person who answered asked me my name (I gave a false one) and proceeded to claim that there was $499 of refund owed to me from this company. Oh Boy! almost $500 free dollars! jackpot!

So, what did I have to do to claim this wonderful refund? Well, the first thing they wanted to do was to have me download a remote desktop application. Now, these programs *do* have legitimate uses (for example, to remotely log into a work computer) but I can assure you that a refund department will never want you to download one.

So, I faked ignorance and incompetence, having the virtual computer reboot a couple of time, pausing the VM, and generally hitting wrong buttons and closing downloading stuff to drag out the overall process.

After about 30 minutes of this I *finally* got a remote desktop installed and gave over control to the person on the other side. They wanted me to go to my bank's website (oh, no, I don't do online banking!--so I said). After the other side clearly got frustrated with me, he proceeded to change the password on the machine, eventually claiming that he locked up the computer (he *would* have, but it is a virtual machine and I saved a snapshot) and called me some rather foul names for wasting his time.

All in all, about 45 minutes on the phone.

What is bothersome is that there were clearly other calls going on in the background, probably by actual suckers for this fraud. Of course, once they obtain your banking information, they will empty your account. Of course, they never got that from me.

The only reason I engaged with these guys (and I do NOT recommend doing so) is that I was bored and know how to set up a system that could (and did) fool them.

But I want to warm people who don't already know:

DO NOT GIVE OUT BANKING INFORMATION TO ANYONE CALLING YOU COLD.

ALSO, DO NOT GIVE PERMISSION TO CONTROL YOUR COMPUTER TO ANYONE YOU DON'T TRUST.

This has been a public service announcement.
Do you know of the sport called "scambaiting"?
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
I occasionally get calls out of the blue from a 'Refund Department' of a major computer company (I won't give the name, but anyone can guess). Today I decided to actually let them talk me through their little fraud just to see what they would do. I want to emphasize: THIS SHOULD NOT BE DONE UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

As a preparation, I set up a virtual machine with the OS suggested by the 'Refund Department' before my call. The person who answered asked me my name (I gave a false one) and proceeded to claim that there was $499 of refund owed to me from this company. Oh Boy! almost $500 free dollars! jackpot!

So, what did I have to do to claim this wonderful refund? Well, the first thing they wanted to do was to have me download a remote desktop application. Now, these programs *do* have legitimate uses (for example, to remotely log into a work computer) but I can assure you that a refund department will never want you to download one.

So, I faked ignorance and incompetence, having the virtual computer reboot a couple of time, pausing the VM, and generally hitting wrong buttons and closing downloading stuff to drag out the overall process.

After about 30 minutes of this I *finally* got a remote desktop installed and gave over control to the person on the other side. They wanted me to go to my bank's website (oh, no, I don't do online banking!--so I said). After the other side clearly got frustrated with me, he proceeded to change the password on the machine, eventually claiming that he locked up the computer (he *would* have, but it is a virtual machine and I saved a snapshot) and called me some rather foul names for wasting his time.

All in all, about 45 minutes on the phone.

What is bothersome is that there were clearly other calls going on in the background, probably by actual suckers for this fraud. Of course, once they obtain your banking information, they will empty your account. Of course, they never got that from me.

The only reason I engaged with these guys (and I do NOT recommend doing so) is that I was bored and know how to set up a system that could (and did) fool them.

But I want to warm people who don't already know:

DO NOT GIVE OUT BANKING INFORMATION TO ANYONE CALLING YOU COLD.

ALSO, DO NOT GIVE PERMISSION TO CONTROL YOUR COMPUTER TO ANYONE YOU DON'T TRUST.

This has been a public service announcement.
I never matched your time, nor did I go so far as to set up a virtual machine, I never even turned my computer on. I did tell him that I had an Eniac, that it was a rather old machine and it took some time for the tubes to warm up. It went right over his head:

ENIAC - Wikipedia

But I figured the ten or fifteen minutes I kept him busy may have saved at least one victim that day. If everyone wasted just five minutes on the phone with these scammers they would be out of business in a month.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
Posted in another thread (which everyone ignored)....

Scambaiting for newbies....
Scam baiting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Note: Sector 7G is Homer Simpson's area at the Springfield Nuclear Power Plant.
Note: Fordson was a 1915-25 era tractor made by Ford.

My favorite routine is for the copier supply scammers who call me fishing for information.
Them: "Hi, I'm your copier supplier. Could I speak to the person in charge of buying supplies?
Rev: That's me.
Them: We're just updating our records...what model copier do you have?"
Rev...a couple minutes later: It's a Sector 7G
Them: Hmmm...we're not familiar with that one. Are you sure of that number?
Rev...a couple minutes later: Yes, I double checked. It's definitely a Sector 7G.
Them: What brand is that?
Rev: A Fordson
Them: I'm not familiar with that brand.
Rev: It was once quite popular in this area. Mine came with spade wheels, but I upgraded to rubber.
And on it goes until....
Them: <Click>
 

Mestemia

Advocatus Diaboli
Premium Member
I occasionally get calls out of the blue from a 'Refund Department' of a major computer company (I won't give the name, but anyone can guess). Today I decided to actually let them talk me through their little fraud just to see what they would do. I want to emphasize: THIS SHOULD NOT BE DONE UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

As a preparation, I set up a virtual machine with the OS suggested by the 'Refund Department' before my call. The person who answered asked me my name (I gave a false one) and proceeded to claim that there was $499 of refund owed to me from this company. Oh Boy! almost $500 free dollars! jackpot!

So, what did I have to do to claim this wonderful refund? Well, the first thing they wanted to do was to have me download a remote desktop application. Now, these programs *do* have legitimate uses (for example, to remotely log into a work computer) but I can assure you that a refund department will never want you to download one.

So, I faked ignorance and incompetence, having the virtual computer reboot a couple of time, pausing the VM, and generally hitting wrong buttons and closing downloading stuff to drag out the overall process.

After about 30 minutes of this I *finally* got a remote desktop installed and gave over control to the person on the other side. They wanted me to go to my bank's website (oh, no, I don't do online banking!--so I said). After the other side clearly got frustrated with me, he proceeded to change the password on the machine, eventually claiming that he locked up the computer (he *would* have, but it is a virtual machine and I saved a snapshot) and called me some rather foul names for wasting his time.

All in all, about 45 minutes on the phone.

What is bothersome is that there were clearly other calls going on in the background, probably by actual suckers for this fraud. Of course, once they obtain your banking information, they will empty your account. Of course, they never got that from me.

The only reason I engaged with these guys (and I do NOT recommend doing so) is that I was bored and know how to set up a system that could (and did) fool them.

But I want to warm people who don't already know:

DO NOT GIVE OUT BANKING INFORMATION TO ANYONE CALLING YOU COLD.

ALSO, DO NOT GIVE PERMISSION TO CONTROL YOUR COMPUTER TO ANYONE YOU DON'T TRUST.

This has been a public service announcement.
I did a similar thing except I used an old Blackberry as my "computer"

I "forgot" to mention that said Blackberry did not have service
 

Subduction Zone

Veteran Member
Posted in another thread (which everyone ignored)....

Scambaiting for newbies....
Scam baiting - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Note: Sector 7G is Homer Simpson's area at the Springfield Nuclear Power Plant.
Note: Fordson was a 1915-25 era tractor made by Ford.

My favorite routine is for the copier supply scammers who call me fishing for information.
Them: "Hi, I'm your copier supplier. Could I speak to the person in charge of buying supplies?
Rev: That's me.
Them: We're just updating our records...what model copier do you have?"
Rev...a couple minutes later: It's a Sector 7G
Them: Hmmm...we're not familiar with that one. Are you sure of that number?
Rev...a couple minutes later: Yes, I double checked. It's definitely a Sector 7G.
Them: What brand is that?
Rev: A Fordson
Them: I'm not familiar with that brand.
Rev: It was once quite popular in this area. Mine came with spade wheels, but I upgraded to rubber.
And on it goes until....
Them: <Click>
 

rocala

Well-Known Member
I have not had any contacts with intent to commit fraud but I do get a lot of calls from unscrupulous law firms. It is always " I would like to ask you about your accident". I always reply that it was not an accident I did it deliberatley. They usually hang up there and then.
 

ChristineM

"Be strong", I whispered to my coffee.
Premium Member
I never matched your time, nor did I go so far as to set up a virtual machine, I never even turned my computer on. I did tell him that I had an Eniac, that it was a rather old machine and it took some time for the tubes to warm up. It went right over his head:

ENIAC - Wikipedia

But I figured the ten or fifteen minutes I kept him busy may have saved at least one victim that day. If everyone wasted just five minutes on the phone with these scammers they would be out of business in a month.

Ive said i was using a pdp11, not quite eniac but fairly interesting
150px-PDP11-40-geerol.jpg
 

Woberts

The Perfumed Seneschal
I love scams like this. But it seems like every time, about halfway through the call, my phone dies. Oh well, better luck next time.
 

beenherebeforeagain

Rogue Animist
Premium Member
I occasionally get calls out of the blue from a 'Refund Department' of a major computer company (I won't give the name, but anyone can guess). Today I decided to actually let them talk me through their little fraud just to see what they would do. I want to emphasize: THIS SHOULD NOT BE DONE UNLESS YOU KNOW WHAT YOU ARE DOING.

As a preparation, I set up a virtual machine with the OS suggested by the 'Refund Department' before my call. The person who answered asked me my name (I gave a false one) and proceeded to claim that there was $499 of refund owed to me from this company. Oh Boy! almost $500 free dollars! jackpot!

So, what did I have to do to claim this wonderful refund? Well, the first thing they wanted to do was to have me download a remote desktop application. Now, these programs *do* have legitimate uses (for example, to remotely log into a work computer) but I can assure you that a refund department will never want you to download one.

So, I faked ignorance and incompetence, having the virtual computer reboot a couple of time, pausing the VM, and generally hitting wrong buttons and closing downloading stuff to drag out the overall process.

After about 30 minutes of this I *finally* got a remote desktop installed and gave over control to the person on the other side. They wanted me to go to my bank's website (oh, no, I don't do online banking!--so I said). After the other side clearly got frustrated with me, he proceeded to change the password on the machine, eventually claiming that he locked up the computer (he *would* have, but it is a virtual machine and I saved a snapshot) and called me some rather foul names for wasting his time.

All in all, about 45 minutes on the phone.

What is bothersome is that there were clearly other calls going on in the background, probably by actual suckers for this fraud. Of course, once they obtain your banking information, they will empty your account. Of course, they never got that from me.

The only reason I engaged with these guys (and I do NOT recommend doing so) is that I was bored and know how to set up a system that could (and did) fool them.

But I want to warm people who don't already know:

DO NOT GIVE OUT BANKING INFORMATION TO ANYONE CALLING YOU COLD.

ALSO, DO NOT GIVE PERMISSION TO CONTROL YOUR COMPUTER TO ANYONE YOU DON'T TRUST.

This has been a public service announcement.
When I read the title for this thread, somehow I was just sure this was about when you convert to a religion, and then deconvert, you have to talk to the refund department...
 
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