Maya3
Well-Known Member
Have you heard of this?
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/24/w...modi-hindu-conversions-missionaries.html?_r=0
Maya
http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/24/w...modi-hindu-conversions-missionaries.html?_r=0
Maya
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Reconverstion in India
- Thread starter Maya3
- Start date
What an absurd double standard! But not at all unexpected. It's fine with Congress if Christians convert Hindus, but not the other way around. In the meantime they use blocking techniques to block Modi from getting the economy on track. Hopefully the people will see through this nonsense.
Here's another slightly less biased report. RSS claims it re-converted 100 people from 37 families in Agra | The Indian Express
Poeticus
| abhyAvartin |
... we are, after all, worthless heathens. Decapitation of kafirs? Awesome! Forcefully converting Yazidi females after gang-raping them en masse? Wonderful! Bombing abortion clincs? Great! ... but how dare those pagan, idol-worshiping heathens, scum of all scums, do such a thing?! Who do these infidels think they are? Did being colonized by a superior, faith-based people not teach them anything? Outrageous!
ps - Here's something about the leftist outlet, NY Times:
No need to worry, V-dada. BJP demolished opposition in Jharkhand and got 25 seats, trailing PDP by only 3 (in other words, PDP won on paper but politically BJP won due to gaining so many seats), in Kashmir---both of these results being of the recent Assembly Elections. Congress got decimated in both. Whenever people complain about Modi, I keep thinking about the tenacity with which BJP keeps winning/gaining ground, smiling effervescently as ground realities continue to shatter their irrationally idealistic, preconceived notions.
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There is nothing wrong with the RSS bringing others into Hinduism or back to Hinduism. I have no problem with that. In fact, I was a member of the VHP, and have been to a couple of RSS sponsored meetings in California - I should probably start donating to the RSS (I have in the past). One day the many in Pakistan (former India) will come back to Hinduism, that is my prediction.
Jai Hind.
Jai Hind.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Nothing of the sort. The Delhi Christian agitation was pre-mature. Why should they blame Hindus for the arson without any proof? There is a slum behind the church and it could have been muslim youth from there. The investigations are going on. And the fire started in the dressing room of the church. It could have been because of faulty wiring which is so common in India.
Secondly, why should Christians object to reconversion of some back to Hinduism when they are themselves engaged in conversions. Even after the hew and cry some people in Agra are reported to have been converted to Christianity clandestinely. They do not want Hindus to have the liberty which they themselves have. Christians cannot eat the cake and have it too.
Women in Agra village lured into Christianity while husbands stay Hindus : India, News - India Today
BJP's stand is that if people do not want reconversions, then they would have to stop conversions also (Note: That will require a change in Indian Constitution with 66% of the parliament members agreeing to it). I think it is completely fair. Indian constitution has given people the liberty to follow whatever belief they want. If people want to convert back to Hinduism, nobody can stop them.
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
And here is the fun, Poeticus - If People's Democratic Party (28) aligns with Congress (12), BJP (25) can align with National Conference (15). The total in both cases is 40. Amit Shah and Raj Nath Singh, both have said that BJP will surely be a partner in any future Kashmir government. BJP got the highest percentage of votes in the state, 23% which is more than 22.7% of PDP.
Sumit
Sanatana Dharma
For Bjp all 25 seats from came from Jammu, no seats from Kashmir Valley. In Kashmir 33 out of 34 members even lost their deposits. However now Bjp will be politically more active in J&K.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
BJP has support of 6 independents out of 7, including those of J&K Peoples Conference (2) from the valley, of Sajjad Lone, son of the assassinated moderate leader, Abdul Gani Lone. The problem is that they are not the largest party and as per constitution, the Governor has to ask the largest party in the first instance, otherwise they would have already formed the government. PDP as well as NC, both have partnered with BJP in the past.
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Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
We too are ready and we feel the same way. Missionary organizations now need to give the account of the receipt and expenses of money received as per Indian law. The previous government had closed their eyes on it (being led by a Roman Catholic). We know how to handle them if they act smart.
I think that in the long run it will reduce Christian proselytizing. In countries where proselytizing is outright banned, only the hard core fundamentalist groups go, and even then it's reduced. They risk jail time and deportation, besides being largely ineffective with their agenda. Six states in India have already banned it, and in a matter of time, all of them most likely will. In speaking with my Mormon neighbours about their missions in China, they told me they just do everything (charity, helping build things, medicine) except proselytize. Zealous Christian groups need to get the message loud and clear.
I'm also against Hindus proselytising, but from these news reports, I don't think they are, at least in most cases. They're just offering a way to correct a mistake. I don't think they're going after long time (many generations) Christians, just the more recent ones, and it's mostly the poor who were given false promises.
In the end, it should always be by the person's own volition completely.
Sir, criticism of Hindus by non-Hindus is not allowed in this DIR.
As you know I go toe-to-toe with you in the debate DIRs
Maya3
Well-Known Member
I agree with what you are saying and I think that if it is to help poor who were coerced in to another religion it´s one thing.
Still I think Sapien have a point here, it doesn´t look too good and it might cause a lot more problems. My gut reaction is that it is fundamentalist and will cause a fundamentalist fervor that becomes nationalistic and non inclusive.
I think governments should be secular no religion should be favored by any government. If proselytizing is illegal in six states already then it should be the same for proselytizing to Hinduism as well.
Maya
Maya, I don't think you understand the history of discrimination against the majority - Hindus. If Muslims can get government grants to go to Mecca, then Hindus should be granted money to go to Rameswaram, Varanasi, Kedarnath, Muktinath, etc. if they so wish. If donations to Hindu temples are taken and controlled by the government, then so too should churches and mosques be under government control.
Yes the Indian government should be secular, and stop granting any and all religions money, or taking their money. Fair is fair, and what people want is a fair shake. This includes Hindus, not just the minorities.
My understanding of the re-conversion origins is that the dalits of 100 years ago when they got converted realised it was a huge mistake. "Oh no, what the heck have we done?" The social reform group Arya Samaj solved the problem by taking them back.
In the west you're going to hear the term Hindutva, right wing Hindu terrorism, etc. for a long time. That's just part and parcel of the anti-Hindu agenda.
In all fairness to outsiders, and that includes me, we don't understand the situation all that well. But I do know Modi is no terrorist, and I also know that conversion away from dharma has caused a great deal of pain for many of my Hindu brothers and sisters. Pain that the western press simply does not understand or denies outright. Take RSS, for example. The largest volunteer and charitable service organisation by far in all of India ... demonised by western press.
Yes the Indian government should be secular, and stop granting any and all religions money, or taking their money. Fair is fair, and what people want is a fair shake. This includes Hindus, not just the minorities.
My understanding of the re-conversion origins is that the dalits of 100 years ago when they got converted realised it was a huge mistake. "Oh no, what the heck have we done?" The social reform group Arya Samaj solved the problem by taking them back.
In the west you're going to hear the term Hindutva, right wing Hindu terrorism, etc. for a long time. That's just part and parcel of the anti-Hindu agenda.
In all fairness to outsiders, and that includes me, we don't understand the situation all that well. But I do know Modi is no terrorist, and I also know that conversion away from dharma has caused a great deal of pain for many of my Hindu brothers and sisters. Pain that the western press simply does not understand or denies outright. Take RSS, for example. The largest volunteer and charitable service organisation by far in all of India ... demonised by western press.
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One of the determiners of press bias is the adjectives they use. In front of Hindu, or Hinduism, you will often see words like radical, right-wing, extremist, nationalist, fundamentalist, unyielding, self-righeous, etc.
In studying newspapers with my Grade seven Language Arts class, we looked at bias, and how it was portrayed. In the Sri Lankan war rhetoric, 'terrorist' would come up on one side, and 'freedom fighter' on the other side. Personally, I try to read between the lines.
In studying newspapers with my Grade seven Language Arts class, we looked at bias, and how it was portrayed. In the Sri Lankan war rhetoric, 'terrorist' would come up on one side, and 'freedom fighter' on the other side. Personally, I try to read between the lines.
Aupmanyav
Be your own guru
Just as many in the West want to return to their pagan roots, some Christians and Muslims in India too want to return to their roots. We have muslims in India and Pakistan with the surname Pandits and Butts. It clearly shows that their ancestors were brahmins. We have muslims with surnames like Rathore and Chauhans, clearly showing that they were from Hindu warrior clans. We have personal names like Azim Premji or Akbar Padamsee. What is wrong if they want to come back to Hindu fold. Why should it be only a one-way road? Is any use of force reported?
I may mention that the government of India and the state governments made special arrngements for safety of Christians all over India. Hindus joined the celebrations. My grandson had a game stall in our neighborhood celebration. So, where is the problem?
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ratikala
Istha gosthi
namaskaram
having read and agreed with so much that has been writen here , ...
I can only back the suggestion that we read between the lines of all media reports , ....
but as far as conversions go , I am for religious freedom . therefore there should never be any incentive to convert , if a religion wishes to do charity work amongst the poor they should do so out of love for humanity with No strings attatched !
as for incentives or grants to visit holy sites , if only this money were spent in releiving the poverty at home , there would be less reliance on NGO's and charity workers therefore their influence and bias would be substantialy reduced .
having read and agreed with so much that has been writen here , ...
I can only back the suggestion that we read between the lines of all media reports , ....
but as far as conversions go , I am for religious freedom . therefore there should never be any incentive to convert , if a religion wishes to do charity work amongst the poor they should do so out of love for humanity with No strings attatched !
as for incentives or grants to visit holy sites , if only this money were spent in releiving the poverty at home , there would be less reliance on NGO's and charity workers therefore their influence and bias would be substantialy reduced .