1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Reason you left

Discussion in 'General Religious Debates' started by Jimmy, May 1, 2021.

  1. Windwalker

    Windwalker Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2013
    Messages:
    11,105
    Ratings:
    +7,114
    Religion:
    Love, Light, and Life
    Wow. That's perfect! That's absolutely brilliant. I see that's a Spong quote. Never heard that before. I love it!
     
  2. Thirza Fallen

    Thirza Fallen Crazy Cat Lady

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2013
    Messages:
    3,374
    Ratings:
    +1,156
    Religion:
    Agnostic
    Yeah, I love that he said it.
     
  3. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2005
    Messages:
    48,941
    Ratings:
    +13,291
    Religion:
    not a theist
    Why am I not the least bit surprised?


    Well, at least you are consistent.
     
  4. Windwalker

    Windwalker Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2013
    Messages:
    11,105
    Ratings:
    +7,114
    Religion:
    Love, Light, and Life
    I just added it to my signature line! :)
     
    • Friendly Friendly x 1
  5. Jimmy

    Jimmy Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 22, 2019
    Messages:
    2,489
    Ratings:
    +797
    All I know is if you take religion out of that picture unfortunately there would remain many misinformed people. So the bad religion is insignificant really
     
  6. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    32,423
    Ratings:
    +27,357
    Religion:
    None

    Therefore to say many seek religion in prison... is just guesswork

    It's the only stats we have. If/when others become available we can be more authoritative.
     
  7. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2005
    Messages:
    48,941
    Ratings:
    +13,291
    Religion:
    not a theist
    A lot of people go through dramatic religious changes in prison.
    Christians become Muslims, atheists be come Christian or Muslim, etc.
    I do not have have any numbers, only my limited experiences in the prison system.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  8. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2019
    Messages:
    4,377
    Ratings:
    +2,171
    Religion:
    It exists
    Not guess work. I already provided you a link to people that seek/find religion while in prison.

    Jailhouse Jesus - Wikipedia
     
  9. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    32,423
    Ratings:
    +27,357
    Religion:
    None
    Ok

    I don't usually take Wikipedia as evidence, anyone can edit the pages. So i go to the references and check. I see no figures, only anecdotal and historical links. And several "citation needed " notes.

    I've no doubt you have a point and some prisoners can take up or renew religion after conviction. I just dont see it making much difference to the stats.
     
    #109 ChristineM, May 3, 2021
    Last edited: May 3, 2021
  10. Windwalker

    Windwalker Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2013
    Messages:
    11,105
    Ratings:
    +7,114
    Religion:
    Love, Light, and Life
    How so? Misinformed spiritually? If the religious system is spiritually bankrupt and divisive, then people are in fact better off without it. If those people are being told that evil is good, then they are misinformed. When Jesus speaks of the blind leading the blind, he is talking about bad religion.

    I used to have a saying after I left the fundamentalist group I was in and at a point later disidentified from the religion. I'd say, "I feel more a Christian now that I'm not one, then I ever did when I was one". Many, many people, even on this site alone can relate to that. We love for the sake of love itself, rather than being focused on getting ourselves into heaven to save our own butts from a fearful, condemning deity.

    Being good, does not come from religion. It comes from being good in your heart. It comes from love.
     
  11. We Never Know

    We Never Know Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 20, 2019
    Messages:
    4,377
    Ratings:
    +2,171
    Religion:
    It exists
    In some cases inmates are simply practicing their faith by worshipping God or a higher power. Inmates either grew up practicing a religion or joined a religion later in life (or developed the interest during incarceration). In many cases, inmates gain direction and meaning for their life from the practice of religion while in prison. They feel that God, or Yahweh, or Allah will provide a direction to go in life, one that is better than their present psychological or physical condition. Religion also provides hope for the inmates-- hope to reform from a life of crime, and from a life of imprisonment. Some inmates even feel that being incarcerated is the "Will of God" and that full acceptance of this will is essential to being faithful in one's religious belief. Along these lines, some inmates feel that practicing religion gives them a “peace of mind,” which means having some level of personal contentment. Having this peace of mind helps inmates improve their well-being especially those serving long sentences.

    A very important reason why inmates become involved with religion is to improve their own self-concept. Lack of a positive self-concept is a common problem with correctional inmates who may suffer from guilt related to failures in life, remorse from criminal acts, or, from the pain of a dysfunctional family background. Because the core of many religious beliefs includes acceptance and love from a higher being, and from members of the faith group, inmates often feel better about themselves if they practice religion while incarcerated.

    In addition to the many psychological and emotional benefits, inmates also can use religion to help change their behavior. Following the principles and discipline that is required in the serious practice of religion can teach inmates self-control. Having self-control helps inmates avoid confrontations with otherinmates and staff, and it helps them comply with prison rules and regulations.

    Correctional inmates may also become involved with religion to gain protection, meet other inmates, meet volunteers, or obtain special prison resources.

    Physical Protection: To be safe, many inmates believe that they need to be part of a group which can provide physical protection from other inmates. Without this protection, inmates believe they may be subject to blackmail, sexual exploitation, or physical confrontation. Inmates who practice religion for this reason assume that the religious group will provide the protection necessary to avoid such difficulties. In some cases, inmates who join religious groups for protection are trying to be part of a “gang.” This may be especially true when certain gangs from the outside have reunited in the jail or prison.

    Religious services are considered a “safe haven” because few physical attacks usually occur in a place of worship. Inmates seem to have respect for places of worship or believe that attending services is a privilege. Inmates might also believe that religious services are too “open” a place to commit a crime.

    Meet Other Inmates: Religious services are an important meeting place for inmates because the opportunity to attend is usually available to all inmates in the general prison population. Inmates value the opportunity to meet other inmates for many reasons, but two are noteworthy. First, like those in the free world, inmates enjoy regular social interaction with friends and groups of individuals with similar interests. Becoming involved in religion while in prison can provide a mechanism for inmates to find feel accepted by other individuals or by a group. Second, some inmates meet at religious services for the purpose of passing contraband. The contraband passed can be food, written messages, cigarettes, drugs, or even weapons.

    Meet Volunteers of the Opposite Sex: Inmates have few opportunities to interact with members of the opposite sex. Civilians often volunteer to visit correctional facilities to help with religious services and programs. In many cases these volunteers are women. The male inmates look forward to coming to religious services to meet the women, and the female inmates look forward to meeting the male volunteers as well.

    Obtain Material Resources or Special Favors: Other inmates become involved with religion to gain free access to special resources that are difficult or costly to obtain while incarcerated. These include free goods such as food and coffee, holiday greeting cards and books, and musical instruments. For example, during many of the special religious programs and religious holidays coffee, cookies and donuts are supplied for inmates who attend religious services. In addition, certain religious groups can receive special food privileges during certain religious holidays. For example, Muslims are often allowed a special diet during Ramadan, and Jewish inmates are allowed a special diet during Passover. All inmates can receive these goods and privileges if they attend certain religious services or show a minimal interest in being a member of a specific religious group. The resources gained from religious involvement can also include individual favors from the faith representatives. More specifically, the faith representative can sometimes provide phone access and written recommendations for parole or transfer. Because of institutional rules about use of the telephone, inmates who need to make a call for emergency reasons may find access limited. The inmates’ only other option is to use the phone of a staff member. The faith representative is the most likely choice because they are often sympathetic to the needs of the inmates and has a phone in the privacy of their own office. Inmates may also feel that the religious representative may be a good person to ask for a letter of reference before a parole board hearing or to request a transfer to another institution.

    Religion as a “Con Game”

    The most common belief about why inmates practice religion while in prison is that many inmates "find religion" for manipulative purposes, or a “con game.” It is believed that inmates hope prison administrators and parole authorities will view their religious practice as an attempt to become moral, pro-social, and law-abiding citizens. The result will be earlier parole release. For decades the correctional literature and popular media have cultivated this belief.

    Correctional officers often support this "religion for early parole" viewpoint. They base their impressions on personal experience of witnessing inmates who have professed to be religious, but who have then acted to the contrary or who are repeat visitors to the institution. Also, correctional officers support this view because they are influenced by their own subculture. This subculture, as with other cultures, possesses certain beliefs that are accepted as truth, and passed among the officers. The belief about inmates finding religion for early parole has been transmitted through generations of correctional inmates, officers, and staff.

    Inmates' opinions of religion in prison are quite diverse. Some believe, like the correctional officers, that inmates practice religion while in prison only to influence the Chaplain or Warden for improved living conditions while incarcerated or for a positive recommendation to the parole board. Others feel that fellow inmates participate in religious programs for a "psychological crutch". These skeptics feel that religion serves to placate individual inmates who were "weak" or need assistance in dealing with the difficulties of prison life. They claim the practice of religion may enhance self-esteem and good feelings, but only because those involved could not find these things without this "crutch".

    However not all inmates, correctional officers and staff think negatively of the intentions of religious inmates. Because serious religious involvement promotes self-discipline, self-introspection, and concern for others, many feel that inmates can acquire a number of positive characteristics from the practice of religion in prison. The positive characteristics include psychological peace of mind, positive self-concept, and improvements in self-control and intellectual abilities.

    In recent years there has been an increased interest on the topic of religion in corrections and in finding out whether the practice of religion in corrections has had any positive impact on inmates. Some research evidence is present that supports the view that the practice of religion helps to control inmate behavior during incarceration. Other studies have found that inmates who are very active in religious programs are less likely to be re-arrested after release from prison, and that their likelihood of success can be enhanced by post-release religious involvement. The recent interest in the topic is encouraging, and hopefully will allow more definitive dialogue about the impact of religion in corrections. But at this juncture religious practice appears to only change some inmates in some cases, and appear to become involved with religion while incarcerated for a variety of reasons, and to determine the sincerity of religious practice and its long term impact is a daunting task.

    Conclusion

    Religious persons and religious institutions have long been associated with correctional practice. This influence began prior to the invention of the prison, continued with the development of a correctional philosophy aimed at repentance, and more recently serves to assist inmates who try to practice their faith while incarcerated. Prison Chaplains have always served as the main conduit through which religion is delivered at correctional facilities. Chaplains and other ‘faith representatives’ are currently employed in all correctional facilities and they serve a variety of functions. In the United States, the ability to practice ones religion. even for those who are incarcerated, is supported by state and federal laws, however, this right must not interfere with the security of the institution. Religious practice is no longer only in the form of the Judeo-Christian experience in American prisons. A variety of faith groups are now present in many institutions, each with their own form of religious practice.

    Although it is difficult to judge why an inmate becomes involved with religion, it is apparently for a variety of personal and practical reasons. The common belief held by many, including by some who live and work in correctional facilities, is that inmates “find religion” for manipulative reasons. Although this may be the case in some instances, there is evidence that some inmates have been changed for the better due to their incarceration and religious practice.

    Religion in Corrections | Faculty.
     
  12. ChristineM

    ChristineM "Be strong" I whispered to my coffee.
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    32,423
    Ratings:
    +27,357
    Religion:
    None
    I have a few objections to that, here are a couple


    This influence began prior to the invention of the prison,
    Untrue and contradcontradictory

    I also consider articles written by theists for religious consumption tends to highlight the parts that agrees with their needs a.d plays down that which doesn't which is glaring in the last paragraph of the conclusion.

    I also see no reference to peer review
     
  13. Mestemia

    Mestemia Advocatus Diaboli
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2005
    Messages:
    48,941
    Ratings:
    +13,291
    Religion:
    not a theist
    Based on my experience, a great big bunch of them view it as a new start.

    A new beginning.
    Starting a fresh new chapter of their life.
    A reboot.
    Becoming a better person.
    Turning over a new leaf.​

    Just a few of the direct quotes I have heard.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  14. loverofhumanity

    loverofhumanity Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    8,311
    Ratings:
    +4,155
    Religion:
    Baha'i Faith
    Hi Daniel. How are you? My best regards to your family and dad.
     
  15. Clara Tea

    Clara Tea Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2020
    Messages:
    841
    Ratings:
    +280
    Could it be that Satan is running the religion? Satan would try to split people apart, and make them fight each other. Thus, Satan would try to take apart a happy Gay marriage just in order to create disharmony.

    Christianity is a religion of hate...it splits people apart. Even similar Christian sects don't get along. If they did, they wouldn't each have their own bible.
     
  16. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    4,742
    Ratings:
    +4,290
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    I'm going well thanks. Give my regards to Aunty and family.
     
  17. loverofhumanity

    loverofhumanity Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    8,311
    Ratings:
    +4,155
    Religion:
    Baha'i Faith
    Yes will do, she always prays for you and your family daily.
     
Loading...