• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Principal to Kids: I’m “Personally Offended” If You Don’t Stand for the Pledge

Skwim

Veteran Member
.

If you’re a student at Mira Costa High School in Manhattan Beach, California, you may have seen Principal Dr. Ben Dale visiting classrooms in the morning to find out who’s standing for the Pledge of Allegiance. This, apparently, is what he thinks is a good use of his time.

BenDaleCA.png

Dale also used the intercom to announce his distaste for Pledge protesters. A teacher reported his actions to the American Humanist Association, which just sent a letter to the school district:

… The teacher reports that…[Dale] announced over the intercom on Wednesday, September 11, 2019, that he was “personally offended by any teacher or student who did not stand for the pledge.” Mr. Dale has been going to classes to determine who is standing and who is not. The teacher is concerned that their students’ rights are being violated.
While there’s no indication anyone’s been punished for refusing to stand, or that any students are even protesting at all, the idea that a principal would pressure kids to stand for a religious, xenophobic, pseudo-patriotic ritual is appalling.

Students can always remain seated during the Pledge. No one has to say it. In fact, it’s a waste of time for schools to even bother with it. But what Dale is doing crosses all kinds of legal boundaries.

Says AHA attorney Monica Miller:

Students at Manhattan Beach Unified School District schools do not deserve to be mistreated merely because they choose to exercise their constitutional rights. Based on the above, we demand the following written assurances: (1) That all students and teachers in your school district be advised that students may stay seated for any Pledge exercise at the school; (2) That teachers and administrators be instructed that under no circumstances should they attempt to persuade students to refrain from exercising the right to nonparticipation, question students as to the reason for nonparticipation, or characterize opting out as misconduct or otherwise wrongful; and (3) That no disciplinary or other retaliatory measures of any kind will be directed toward any student or teacher for nonparticipation in the Pledge exercise.
The school has one week to respond.

How the hell does someone become principal with no awareness of why students might want to sit out the Pledge ritual? How little do you have to care about students that you seek out the ones who understand the Pledge in order to coerce them to stand anyway?

The irony is that Dale himself says his personal philosophy is to “make school a place where everyone can enjoy success” and to make sure “everyone here feels part of our family.”

He should take his own advice.
source

.
 
Last edited:

Shadow Wolf

Certified People sTabber
religious, xenophobic, pseudo-patriotic ritual is appalling.
Considering pledges and anthems and such are pretty common, and a token of national pride, it's hard to describe it as pseudo-patriotic because it is patriotic, and I wouldn't say it's xenophobic. Rituals overall are pretty silly, but neurotypicals like them.
 

Twilight Hue

Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
It's interesting that the pledge originated and was authored by a Christian socialist named Francis Bellamy in 1892.

Published in the, "Youth's Companion" in September 1892, the pledge went alongside with the campaign to sell the American flag to every school as part of the magazine's promotion.

That gave life to the schoolhouse flag movement, and the rest of course is history .

The original pledge went like this....

"I pledge allegiance to my Flag and to the Republic for which it stands, one nation, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all".


Short simple and sweet.


Who would have thought that the pledge started out as part of a magazine promotion?


 

SomeRandom

Still learning to be wise
Staff member
Premium Member
I find the American pledge fascinating. It reminds me of Starship Troopers. This weirdly fascist like ritual. Of course national pride is something everyone is indoctrinated to participate in. With national anthems and such.
But only America seems to give a damn what people do during such rituals. Which always confused me. Isn’t a core principle of America personal freedom?
I’ve honest to god heard people say to me burning the flag is their god given right. Which I agree with, provided you bought the thing. So wouldn’t sitting during the pledge technically fall under free speech? Or am I misunderstanding Americastan politics again?
 

Earthtank

Active Member
that he was “personally offended by any teacher or student who did not stand for the pledge.”

So? :D

People can be offended about whatever they want, who cares? I don't care if my actions, that have nothing to do with you offend you. As long as you remain offended in silence or don't do anything that bothers me, I don't care. The Principal did not take any action against anyone so let him voice his frustration in hopes people change so, as long as he does not take it any further, leave him be.
 

columbus

yawn <ignore> yawn
The Principal did not take any action against anyone so let him voice his frustration in hopes people change so, as long as he does not take it any further, leave him be.
You really think that the principal making announcements and watching classrooms isn't "taking action"?

I'd actually be okay with his behaviour if he were willing to reinstate the Original Pledge. It was an attempt at unifying people. This newfangled pledge was designed to separate people and it works very well.

The USA already has enough divisiveness. Why is this dude trying to make that worse?

I have my opinions about why he is, but I'm asking you for yours.

Tom
 

Sand Dancer

Crazy Cat Lady
.

If you’re a student at Mira Costa High School in Manhattan Beach, California, you may have seen Principal Dr. Ben Dale visiting classrooms in the morning to find out who’s standing for the Pledge of Allegiance. This, apparently, is what he thinks is a good use of his time.

BenDaleCA.png
Dale also used the intercom to announce his distaste for Pledge protesters. A teacher reported his actions to the American Humanist Association, which just sent a letter to the school district:

… The teacher reports that…[Dale] announced over the intercom on Wednesday, September 11, 2019, that he was “personally offended by any teacher or student who did not stand for the pledge.” Mr. Dale has been going to classes to determine who is standing and who is not. The teacher is concerned that their students’ rights are being violated.
While there’s no indication anyone’s been punished for refusing to stand, or that any students are even protesting at all, the idea that a principal would pressure kids to stand for a religious, xenophobic, pseudo-patriotic ritual is appalling.

Students can always remain seated during the Pledge. No one has to say it. In fact, it’s a waste of time for schools to even bother with it. But what Dale is doing crosses all kinds of legal boundaries.

Says AHA attorney Monica Miller:

Students at Manhattan Beach Unified School District schools do not deserve to be mistreated merely because they choose to exercise their constitutional rights. Based on the above, we demand the following written assurances: (1) That all students and teachers in your school district be advised that students may stay seated for any Pledge exercise at the school; (2) That teachers and administrators be instructed that under no circumstances should they attempt to persuade students to refrain from exercising the right to nonparticipation, question students as to the reason for nonparticipation, or characterize opting out as misconduct or otherwise wrongful; and (3) That no disciplinary or other retaliatory measures of any kind will be directed toward any student or teacher for nonparticipation in the Pledge exercise.
The school has one week to respond.

How the hell does someone become principal with no awareness of why students might want to sit out the Pledge ritual? How little do you have to care about students that you seek out the ones who understand the Pledge in order to coerce them to stand anyway?

The irony is that Dale himself says his personal philosophy is to “make school a place where everyone can enjoy success” and to make sure “everyone here feels part of our family.”

He should take his own advice.
source

.
These people care more about their individual views instead of what is best for the kids and people in general. They don't seem to realize that standing is a choice and they can't force it. Petty dictators...
 
Top