Paul and the People of God

[Fool]

Paul claims that one is a jew not by birth but by some inward state.

Deuteronomy 30:6
The LORD your God will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, so that you may love him with all your heart and with all your soul, and live.


Romans 2:29
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.


Is this what is meant by the speaker in revelation? That God determines who is a jew and who isn't?



Revelation 2:9
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Revelation 3:9
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

 

[Tumah]

Paul claims that one is a jew not by birth but by some inward state.

Looking at Matt 15:21-28 there appears to be a contradiction between Paul and Matthew about who is a Jew.

Who would have suspected that the preacher to the Gentiles would maintain a position that can include Gentiles under the name "Jew", while the preacher to the Jews who hold that only Jews have this name? It's almost like the truth is whatever will get you more adherents.

 

[Fool]

Looking at Matt 15:21-28 there appears to be a contradiction between Paul and Matthew about who is a Jew.

Who would have suspected that the preacher to the Gentiles would maintain a position that can include Gentiles under the name "Jew", while the preacher to the Jews who hold that only Jews have this name? It's almost like the truth is whatever will get you more adherents.

and yet he gave her what she asked for. she had what he had been sent for

you would do well to understand, or have that state of mind, that concerns deuteronomy 30 and coming into you own, camelot. the kingdom of love is within our grasp, or in your case a land flowing with milk and honey. moses saw it but was not allowed to enter into it. joshua, jesus did.

fallow?

 

[Tumah]

and yet he gave her what she asked for

That's true, but getting to that point, the author revealed his position on Jews as being the nation, not some spiritual quality.

 

[Fool]

That's true, but getting to that point, the author revealed his position on Jews as being the nation, not some spiritual quality.

all jews =/= all israelites


he gave her what she deserved as one he was sent to serve, to love. she humbled herself.

Before destruction comes pride, and before stumbling [comes] a haughty spirit.


i'd love to be a fly on that wall

A man will beg
A man will crawl
On the sheer face of love
Like a fly on a wall
It's no secret at all


Deuteronomy 8:2
And thou shalt remember all the way which the Lord thy God led thee these forty years in the wilderness, to humble thee, and to prove thee, to know what was in thine heart, whether thou wouldest keep his commandments, or no.

 

[Fool]

If they are humble, you will say, "Raise up!" and He will save a humble person.

my love, my drug.

Humble yourselves in the sight of the Lord, and he shall lift you up.


i found the Way. i built a bridge and got over myself. i found my love. i found god within the promise.

If you're gonna let me down, let me down gently
Don't pretend that you don't want me
Our love ain't water under the bridge
If you're gonna let me down, let me down gently
Don't pretend that you don't want me
Our love ain't water under the bridge


It would seem the illusion wanted was collapsing around her. More and more was unraveling, just when she thought she had found the pattern for weaving life. She was exhausted and fell asleep on the floor. She awoke to something. Long enough to see, whose house it was, placing a coverlet over her. She went back to sleep. She felt safe. Felt warm and cool all at once.

The connection made. Love established. Life changed. She could see it slowly growing. She bridged the gap. There was awareness that the game would end. Someone would lose but for now they were winning, she'd play the game. She took off the mask and wove the tapestry.


All the world is a stage

 

[Tumah]

all jews =/= all israelites

Prove it from Matthew.

 

[Fool]

Prove it from Matthew.

In the Old Testament the term "Jew" appears to be applied to adherents of the worship of Yhwh as conducted at Jerusalem after the Exile: it is thus used in the late Book of Esther. In more modern usage the word is often applied to any person of the Hebrew race, apart from his religious creed. At one time during the emancipation era there was a tendency among Jews to avoid the application of the term to themselves; and from 1860 onward the words "Hebrew" and "Israelite" were employed to represent persons of Jewish faith and race, as in the titles


being a person from canaan, she would have been a lost sheep of israel.

 

[Tumah]

In the Old Testament the term "Jew" appears to be applied to adherents of the worship of Yhwh as conducted at Jerusalem after the Exile: it is thus used in the late Book of Esther. In more modern usage the word is often applied to any person of the Hebrew race, apart from his religious creed. At one time during the emancipation era there was a tendency among Jews to avoid the application of the term to themselves; and from 1860 onward the words "Hebrew" and "Israelite" were employed to represent persons of Jewish faith and race, as in the titles

Did you bring this to prove me right? Because that's what you seem to have done.

being a person from canaan, she would have been a lost sheep of israel.

If that were true, then the ensuing conversation makes absolutely no sense.

 

[Fool]

Did you bring this to prove me right? Because that's what you seem to have done.

first line says it all

In the Old Testament the term "Jew" appears to be applied to adherents of the worship of Yhwh as conducted at Jerusalem after the Exile: it is thus used in the late Book of Esther.

you obviously, like the jews of old, don't consider the canaanite woman an israelite. obviously jesus did.

it wasn't what jacob wore that got him the name, nor even to whom he was born. he wrestled with something within himself. that is what got him the name.

If that were true, then the ensuing conversation makes absolutely no sense.

to you i'm sure it does. again it was the woman's response and not what she wore, or to whom she might have, or haven't, belonged.


I have descended to rescue them from the hand of the Egyptians and to bring them up from that land, to a good and spacious land, to a land flowing with milk and honey, to the place of the Canaanites, the Hittites, the Amorites, the Perizzites, the Hivvites, and the Jebusites.



And these are the cities which the children of Israel inherited in the land of Canaan, which Eleazar the priest, and Joshua the son of Nun, and the heads of the tribes of the children of Israel, distributed for inheritance to them.


The stories told in the Hebrew Bible say that after the Israelites escaped from Egypt they fought a series of wars against the Canaanites (and other groups), which led to the Israelites taking over most of the Canaanites' land. The stories say that those Canaanites who survived had to do forced labor. The stories also say that this conquered land was incorporated into a powerful Israelite kingdom that eventually split in two.

 

[savagewind]

I think that maybe "Jew" means someone who is God's own. A Jew is someone who gets invited to God's house. That is what I think.

 

[savagewind]

Ive got a satchel of gems. No one is making me question my religious beliefs.

Interesting. I liked that last post and it brought me on a mini adventure. The last post? The one that was but then wasn't. I think the right word for that is, "cool!".

What am I talking about? What about I tell you is you tell me? LOL

He posted something that I replied to and then I got a notice, a wonderful notice! that said I could not do that. And, that is all. Carry on......

 

[savagewind]

And, just so you know, I realize that @Disciple of Jesus might just be a girl and not a boy. But, I really don't care.

 

[Desert Snake]

And, just so you know, I realize that @Disciple of Jesus might just be a girl and not a boy. But, I really don't care.

Man...

 

[savagewind]

Man...

Oh. And, I am a woman. No, really. Not sex changed. OMG! How expensive is that?

 

[Desert Snake]

I didnt have that marked, now its marked on profile

 

[savagewind]

My troll thinks that I might know where you live. The reason why is it suspects that sometime in the future I'll think that I might need someone. But, wait a minute! Can I do that here?

 

[savagewind]

I didnt have that marked, now its marked on profile

Ah yes, I could have looked it up. I didn't.

 

[Chris Lovel]

Paul claims that one is a jew not by birth but by some inward state.

Deuteronomy 30:6
The LORD your God will circumcise your hearts and the hearts of your descendants, so that you may love him with all your heart and with all your soul, and live.


Romans 2:29
But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.


Is this what is meant by the speaker in revelation? That God determines who is a jew and who isn't?



Revelation 2:9
I know thy works, and tribulation, and poverty, (but thou art rich) and I know the blasphemy of them which say they are Jews, and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan.

Revelation 3:9
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.

Wow, all these Bible quotes, my question is, how do you know all this information is correct? what is the source of this information? For some reason people accept the words of an ancient book without question. They have forfeited their powers of critical thinking. In other words they have been indoctrinated, you are totally disempowered. Why do you need religion to believe in a God? Let's face it the Bible has over 400 conflicting passages in it, which passage do you choose to believe and why?

 

[Chris Lovel]

Looking at Matt 15:21-28 there appears to be a contradiction between Paul and Matthew about who is a Jew.

Who would have suspected that the preacher to the Gentiles would maintain a position that can include Gentiles under the name "Jew", while the preacher to the Jews who hold that only Jews have this name? It's almost like the truth is whatever will get you more adherents.

No surprise there, the Bible has over 400 conflicting passages, the contradiction between Paul and Matthew are just one. It must be difficult to know which passage to believe.