1. Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

Featured Parliamentary panel rejects anti-forced conversion bill amid protest by minorities’ lawmakers

Discussion in 'Religious News' started by danieldemol, Oct 16, 2021.

  1. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    5,746
    Ratings:
    +5,393
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    Pakistan:

    'A parliamentary committee on Wednesday rejected the anti-forced conversion bill after the Ministry of Religious Affairs opposed the proposed law while lawmakers from minority communities protested the decision.

    The bill came under discussion during a meeting of the Parliamentary Committee to Protect Minorities from Forced Conversions, where Religious Affairs Minister Noorul Haq Qadri said the "environment is unfavourable" for formulating a law against forced conversions.'

    Source: Parliamentary panel rejects anti-forced conversion bill amid protest by minorities’ lawmakers - Pakistan - DAWN.COM

    Do you think the religious affairs minister was wrong to reject a law against forced conversions?

    In my opinion.
     
    • Informative Informative x 3
  2. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    It's impossible to "force a religious conversion". All anyone could do would be to force feigned compliance to a religious ideology. And most methods of force are already illegal. As well as forced compliance among adults. So I doubt there was ever any need for such a bill.
     
    • Optimistic Optimistic x 1
  3. Daemon Sophic

    Daemon Sophic Avatar in flux

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Messages:
    4,790
    Ratings:
    +3,271
    So you’re asking if it’s OK that the Pakistani parliament say “Having the Muslim Inquisition in our country is peachy keen! Yay! Forced ‘Conversions!’”

    My answer would be a sad and angry, No.

    Theocracy is always a great way to kill and terrorize a population, destroy your government, make your population stupid and backwards, and start wars - both external and internal. :facepalm:
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  4. Windwalker

    Windwalker Veteran Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2013
    Messages:
    11,967
    Ratings:
    +7,915
    Religion:
    Love, Light, and Life
    Politics. They are ostensibly worried to making a law against the practice by some, luring children with promises of money and marriage to convert to Islam, and then not giving them what was promised, might be seen as a "law against Islam". Basically, it's the same crap as here in the United States with the politicians pandering to the Christian right.

    Even though their views and practices are primitive and obscene, people don't want to upset the base, as these right-wingers might get violent against minorities and make matters worse, like storm the Capitol. Or so the excuses to not take action and do what is right goes. It's just politics, and the public and the culture they are dealing with. Doesn't matter if it's the likes of the Taliban, or their American cousins Christian fundamentalists.

    Forced prayer in school, reject modern science in education, deny marriage to homosexuals, etc. Force conversions, evil in the name of God, all the same premodern tribal stuff, regardless of the country. And then layering in politicians without spines. "Don't vote against this, or you'll be seen as a servant of the West!", and other such rationalizations to maintain oppression of minorities.
     
    #4 Windwalker, Oct 16, 2021
    Last edited: Oct 16, 2021
    • Like Like x 1
    • Winner Winner x 1
  5. sun rise

    sun rise "This is the Hour of God"
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2014
    Messages:
    63,980
    Ratings:
    +31,399
    Religion:
    Love
    My first thought upon reading the thread title was this was about India forcing Christian converts to give up Christianity and return to Hinduism.

    I'm also reminded of Zoroastrians fleeing Persia for India due to forced conversions there.

    There is a very long and sordid history of forced conversions as Wikipedia documents and there's the force versions of Hindus opposing religiously mixed marriages which is a close cousin.

    The world has had much too much of "my religion is right and all others are wrong so whatever I do is justified"
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Winner Winner x 2
  6. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    5,746
    Ratings:
    +5,393
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    We are talking about Pakistan here, can you cite your sources that most methods of force in Pakistan are already illegal? And shouldn't *all* methods of force be illegal?
     
  7. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    Why are we talking about Pakistan?
     
  8. Daemon Sophic

    Daemon Sophic Avatar in flux

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Messages:
    4,790
    Ratings:
    +3,271
    Uh…Dude! Check which section you’re in. :D
     
  9. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    That doesn't answer the question. Do you live in Pakistan? Does anyone here, live there? Why should we be concerned with what the Pakistanis decide about forced religious conversion? And keep in mind that it is not possible to force anyone to believe anything. So the real issue here is just the enforcement of religious pretense.

    Though not written into or protected by law, there is a significant degree of this going on right here in the U.S. "bible belt". Where non-compliance with the majority religious ideology and practices can result in significant social-economic ostracism.
     
  10. Daemon Sophic

    Daemon Sophic Avatar in flux

    Joined:
    Mar 13, 2009
    Messages:
    4,790
    Ratings:
    +3,271
    While I agree with you here and in your post #2 in this thread, it is simply the “Religious News” thread. As such, issues relating to religion, no matter the location throughout the world, are open for discussion in this thread.
    Please keep in mind that many forum members are not now, or ever living inside the USA. Furthermore, some here may be concerned about, and/or be interested in events outside of the nations that we live in or come from. :shrug:
    We in the US often need to be reminded that we are not the be all, end all of all things. ;) E.g. - Why should anybody be concerned about religious social pressures in the southern US?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  11. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    5,746
    Ratings:
    +5,393
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    I guess some of us care about the mistreatment of decent human beings no matter where they had the misfortune of being born.

    In my opinion.
     
  12. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    Sure, but I think it would be more effective to care about them in your neighborhood. As opposed to the other side of the planet.
     
  13. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    5,746
    Ratings:
    +5,393
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    Why does it have to be one or the other?

    In my opinion.
     
  14. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    Because we are human, and very limited on our ability to effects positive change.
     
  15. danieldemol

    danieldemol Well-Known Member
    Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 24, 2011
    Messages:
    5,746
    Ratings:
    +5,393
    Religion:
    Spiritual but not religious
    It seems to me as though some of our limitations are self imposed.

    In my opinion.
     
  16. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    What do you suggest I do about Pakistanis choosing not to pass a law banning forced religious conversion, as a U. S. Citizen with absolutely no control over my own government?
     
  17. Koldo

    Koldo Incredible Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2011
    Messages:
    11,739
    Ratings:
    +1,928
    Why not say you haven't noticed this was all about Pakistan?
    It's alright, we all make mistakes. This post of yours came across as an attempt not to lose face, but it didn't work...
     
  18. Koldo

    Koldo Incredible Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2011
    Messages:
    11,739
    Ratings:
    +1,928
    I confess I would be a bit worried about the draft bill, particularly this part:

    "A copy of the draft bill, which is available with Dawn, shows that any non-Muslim, who is not a child, and is able and willing to convert to another religion will apply for a conversion certificate from an additional sessions judge of the area where he or she is residing.

    The draft law highlights that the application will have to include the name of a non-Muslim who is willing to change the religion, age and gender, CNIC number, details of parents, siblings, children and spouse (if any), current religion and the reason to convert to the new religion."

    It seems there would be a whole lot of interference in any conversion. Not something I would support per se.

    Althought the latter part seems just fine:

    "The proposed law also awards punishment between five to 10 years and a fine from Rs100,000 to Rs200,000 to any person who uses criminal force to convert a person to another religion."
     
    • Like Like x 1
  19. PureX

    PureX Veteran Member

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Messages:
    19,392
    Ratings:
    +9,502
    Religion:
    Philosophical Taoist/Christian
    I never pay attention to the thread headings. And my comment is my comment. I have no need to 'save face' because I don't really care about thread headings. I pretty much respond in the same way regardless. But I leave the thread to those interested.
     
  20. Koldo

    Koldo Incredible Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2011
    Messages:
    11,739
    Ratings:
    +1,928
    It is not in the heading though. It is in the very first line of the OP.
    The talk about a Ministry of Religious Affairs, his name being Noorul Haq Qadri, the sourced link in itself specifically mentioning Pakistan (you wouldn't even have to click the link to read what this is all about)... Even if you didn't read the very first line, all of those should hint towards this topic having nothing to do with the USA.
     
Loading...