Paradise, heaven and humanity - your view

[Vidarsdottir]

Humans are complex things and as I was thinking of all the parts of me that make up what I perceive as myself, I realized that some of my 'better' attributes are viewed negatively by others. Eventually I wondered how that would work in any potential afterlife.

So, pick your afterlife - whether you ascribe to the notion of the three heavens in the bible, an earthly paradise or the pre-Christian Germanic notions of multiple realms for you to enter, some combination of 'heavens' or anything and everything in between - are you still you?

What makes you 'you'?

When the evil flame is returned to god's cleansing fire to be burnt away, are you still you, just 'better'? How so?

When your spirit flies apart with each aspect of the self going off to do whatever it does, do you somehow still exist as a singular conscious being?

If you exist in earthly paradise where there is no suffering or pain or general unpleasantness, does the part of you that can't relate to those who believe differently than you cease to exist? Are they simply not present? Is everyone else there a mirror image of you or are you a mirror image of them? Is the creature, deity or natural process that manages this existence a mirror of you or you of it? What if you disagree with it on a matter, simple or serious? If you prefer blue and it prefers green, does the part of you that prefers green cease to exist?

Will you, no matter where 'you' go, still be you?

What if others don't like 'you'? Would they still have that option? If they do not, would they still be themselves, however they view and define themselves? What if you don't like someone else? Are you the one who is changed or is it the other? Why?

What happens if you are not able to remain you and still exist in this afterlife? Do you cease to exist as you, or is the whole of you removed from the afterlife?

 

[Altfish]

I will be gone. Yes, I will just be a memory in my friends and off-spring's mind.
No afterlife, nothing.

 

[allfoak]

No matter where you go, there you are.

 

[David T]

I will be gone. Yes, I will just be a memory in my friends and off-spring's mind.
No afterlife, nothing.

Oh I so wish that were true.

 

[Altfish]

Oh I so wish that were true.

It is true

 

[SalixIncendium]

When my body dies, my it will decompose and become another form of matter, and thereby will remain a part of the Universe, and the energies that made me sentient and powered my body and mind (spirit?) will remain a part of the Universe as well occupying whatever from of matter It so chooses.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

Humans are complex things and as I was thinking of all the parts of me that make up what I perceive as myself, I realized that some of my 'better' attributes are viewed negatively by others. Eventually I wondered how that would work in any potential afterlife.

So, pick your afterlife - whether you ascribe to the notion of the three heavens in the bible, an earthly paradise or the pre-Christian Germanic notions of multiple realms for you to enter, some combination of 'heavens' or anything and everything in between - are you still you?

What makes you 'you'?

When the evil flame is returned to god's cleansing fire to be burnt away, are you still you, just 'better'? How so?

When your spirit flies apart with each aspect of the self going off to do whatever it does, do you somehow still exist as a singular conscious being?

If you exist in earthly paradise where there is no suffering or pain or general unpleasantness, does the part of you that can't relate to those who believe differently than you cease to exist? Are they simply not present? Is everyone else there a mirror image of you or are you a mirror image of them? Is the creature, deity or natural process that manages this existence a mirror of you or you of it? What if you disagree with it on a matter, simple or serious? If you prefer blue and it prefers green, does the part of you that prefers green cease to exist?

Will you, no matter where 'you' go, still be you?

What if others don't like 'you'? Would they still have that option? If they do not, would they still be themselves, however they view and define themselves? What if you don't like someone else? Are you the one who is changed or is it the other? Why?

What happens if you are not able to remain you and still exist in this afterlife? Do you cease to exist as you, or is the whole of you removed from the afterlife?

If I pass before my family, my spirit lives with my family as our family that passed lives in us. However one defines spirit is up to them. I've seen spirits; so, I feel I'll be on earth helping family both inwardly and outwardly.

I don't believe in heaven, paradise, and so forth.

 

[SalixIncendium]

I don't believe in heaven, paradise, and so forth.

I believe these to be a state of being rather than a place.

 

[Unveiled Artist]

I believe these to be a state of being rather than a place.

I never thought of it like that either, really. Just on earth still watching over family in spirit. Not heaven or anything positive or negative. I just have a different role and it's up to me to figure how to take care of people the best I can. I remember my grandmother saying, "now don't you be calling me from heaven. I'm up with the lord now." So, it depends.

 

[SalixIncendium]

I never thought of it like that either, really. Just on earth still watching over family in spirit. Not heaven or anything positive or negative. I just have a different role and it's up to me to figure how to take care of people the best I can. I remember my grandmother saying, "now don't you be calling me from heaven. I'm up with the lord now." So, it depends.

Not to derail the thread as I do understand that the topic is afterlife, but as I see it, one does not have to wait until death to attain heaven. One can create his/her own heaven here on earth. The Spirit is eternal, so why wait until you get out of the car to enjoy the drive.

 

[David T]

It is true

Yes and Jesus literally rose from the dead certainly fact

 

[Altfish]

Yes and Jesus literally rose from the dead certainly fact

And Elvis still works in the local supermarket

 

[FunctionalAtheist]

Humans are complex things and as I was thinking of all the parts of me that make up what I perceive as myself, I realized that some of my 'better' attributes are viewed negatively by others. Eventually I wondered how that would work in any potential afterlife.

So, pick your afterlife - whether you ascribe to the notion of the three heavens in the bible, an earthly paradise or the pre-Christian Germanic notions of multiple realms for you to enter, some combination of 'heavens' or anything and everything in between - are you still you?

What makes you 'you'?

When the evil flame is returned to god's cleansing fire to be burnt away, are you still you, just 'better'? How so?

When your spirit flies apart with each aspect of the self going off to do whatever it does, do you somehow still exist as a singular conscious being?

If you exist in earthly paradise where there is no suffering or pain or general unpleasantness, does the part of you that can't relate to those who believe differently than you cease to exist? Are they simply not present? Is everyone else there a mirror image of you or are you a mirror image of them? Is the creature, deity or natural process that manages this existence a mirror of you or you of it? What if you disagree with it on a matter, simple or serious? If you prefer blue and it prefers green, does the part of you that prefers green cease to exist?

Will you, no matter where 'you' go, still be you?

What if others don't like 'you'? Would they still have that option? If they do not, would they still be themselves, however they view and define themselves? What if you don't like someone else? Are you the one who is changed or is it the other? Why?

What happens if you are not able to remain you and still exist in this afterlife? Do you cease to exist as you, or is the whole of you removed from the afterlife?

Heaven is a road, not a destination. Everyone goes to heaven, but no one every actually gets there. You have one chance to get as close as you can. But when you die you're done. If you travel to heaven you do it while you are living and breathing on this earth and the only measure of how close you came is in the hearts and minds of the people you've touched along the way.

 

[Lirille]

Well, I believe there's no permanent self, no permanent you - who you are changes every moment, even in life. The only thing that is long-lasting in us, I believe, is our 'spirit' - an essence which is exactly the same in every living being, and has no sort of individuality.

As for the afterlife, I'm a reincarnationist. After our current physical body dies, I believe there's an immaterial part of us (you may call it 'soul') that survives, and eventually attaches itself to a new body. This immaterial part of us, or 'soul', is comprised by spirit plus our ever-changing self.

Through sucessive reincarnations, though, we slowly acknowledge the reality that there's no actual self. And as our illusion of individuality slowly dissolves, we stop being drawn to dense matter, and stop reincarnating. The process of de-individualization continues until, eventually, even our 'soul' dissolves, and we become one with the Absolute (at least until the next Big Bang... ).

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Heaven is a road, not a destination. Everyone goes to heaven, but no one every actually gets there. You have one chance to get as close as you can. But when you die you're done. If you travel to heaven you do it while you are living and breathing on this earth and the only measure of how close you came is in the hearts and minds of the people you've touched along the way.

To me, when Jesus said the meek will inherit the Earth at Matthew 5:5 Jesus was speaking about 'Earth' being a destination by being on that narrow road which lovingly touches the hearts and minds of people and God.
- Matthew 7:13-14; Matthew 24:13; Psalms 37:10-11

So, some travel, so to speak, to a heavenly resurrection as Jesus promised at Luke 22:28-30; Luke 12:32. Daniel 7:18
They have a first or earlier resurrection than the majority of mankind - Revelation 20:6; John 3:13
The majority, or most people, who will have a future healthy physical resurrection back to healthy life on a beautiful paradisical Earth during Jesus' coming 1,000-year governmental rulership over Earth begins.
That is why the ' future tense ' is used at Acts of the Apostles 24:15 that there ' is going to be ' a resurrection.......

 

[URAVIP2ME]

Humans are complex things and as I was thinking of all the parts of me that make up what I perceive as myself, I realized that some of my 'better' attributes are viewed negatively by others. Eventually I wondered how that would work in any potential afterlife.
So, pick your afterlife - whether you ascribe to the notion of the three heavens in the bible, an earthly paradise or the pre-Christian Germanic notions of multiple realms for you to enter, some combination of 'heavens' or anything and everything in between - are you still you?
What makes you 'you'?
When the evil flame is returned to god's cleansing fire to be burnt away, are you still you, just 'better'? How so?
When your spirit flies apart with each aspect of the self going off to do whatever it does, do you somehow still exist as a singular conscious being?
If you exist in earthly paradise where there is no suffering or pain or general unpleasantness, does the part of you that can't relate to those who believe differently than you cease to exist? Are they simply not present? Is everyone else there a mirror image of you or are you a mirror image of them? Is the creature, deity or natural process that manages this existence a mirror of you or you of it? What if you disagree with it on a matter, simple or serious? If you prefer blue and it prefers green, does the part of you that prefers green cease to exist?
Will you, no matter where 'you' go, still be you?
What if others don't like 'you'? Would they still have that option? If they do not, would they still be themselves, however they view and define themselves? What if you don't like someone else? Are you the one who is changed or is it the other? Why?
What happens if you are not able to remain you and still exist in this afterlife? Do you cease to exist as you, or is the whole of you removed from the afterlife?

Besides the three (3) heavens mentioned at 2 Peter 3:5,7,13, there are also three (3) earth's mentioned:
Verse 5 mentions the Earth of OLD ( Noah's day )
Verse 7 mentions the Earth of NOW ( Earth since Noah's day to our day )
Verse 13 mentions the NEW Earth when righteousness will dwell on Earth.
So, starting with Jesus' coming millennium-long day of governing over Earth ( earthly subjects - Psalms 72:8 )
then instead of wicked heavens ( Revelation 12:12,9 ) a righteous heavenly heavens ( or government ) will govern over Earth. The wicked will have been destroyed forever - Psalms 92:7; Isaiah 11:3-4; Revelation 19:14-16.
So, others will like you because our leanings will then only be toward righteousness. We will all want to follow Jesus' NEW commandment of John 13:34-35 to have self-sacrificing love for others as Jesus did.

 

[buddhist]

I am - for all practical purposes - simply my consciousness. My consciousness attaches itself to lower frequency objects, the latter which manifests as my spiritual self, mental self, physical self, etc.

Each of these lower selves are subject to change. Consciousness, however simply "is", without quality.

 

[Repox]

If salvation means people go to heaven, why is there no mention of it in Revelation? God proposed an earthly paradise, “the holy City, the new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God . . . (Rev. 21:2).” The new city would be a tribute to God's chosen people. “It shone with the glory of God, and its brilliance was like that of a very precious jewel, like a jasper, clear as crystal.” (Rev. 21:11). Next, we have a tribute to God's twelve angels from heaven. “It had a great, high wall with twelve gates, and with twelve angels at the gates. On the gates were written the names of the twelve tribes of Israel. There were three gates on the east, three on the north, three on the south and three on the West. The wall of the city had twelve foundations, and on them were the names of the twelve apostles of the lamb” (Rev. 21:12 & 13). It is an enormous city. An angel measured it. “He measured the city with a rod and found it to be 12,000 stadia in length, and as wide and high as it is long.” (Rev. 21:16). The length is 1,400 miles long. Apparently, the city could accommodate a large population of obedient followers. It is what God proposed if his chosen people obeyed His commandments. Moreover, God will be with them. “Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them.” (Rev.21:3). It would be as it was before when God and his angels were with creatures in paradise.

I do not believe it will happen. It is a freewill issue. If people do not obey God's commandments, there are consequences. If there is no holy order on earth, there can be no holy city. The book of Revelation is a possibility, not a guarantee, of paradise on earth. Paradise is not possible without God. According to Revelation, God will be with them in paradise. “Now the dwelling of God is with men, and he will live with them.” (Rev.21:3). It would be as it was before when God and his angels were with creatures in paradise during the dinosaur era.

 

[lostwanderingsoul]

Nothing in the Bible says the saved will go to heaven. It says God will set up His kingdom here on earth. If you can find Bible verses that say otherwise please list them. Even when Jesus spoke to the thief on the cross next to Him, He said they would be together in paradise, not Heaven. Adam and Eve were in paradise and it was right here on earth.

 

[George-ananda]

My understanding is that we will continue to exist as ourselves with just the physical coat removed so we will be freer (as reported in Near Death Experiences). We will enjoy and continue to grow on the astral plane appropriate for us and eventually we will reincarnate to experience further. The end goal is the realization of the Oneness of Consciousness/God/Brahman.