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Pantheists everywhere, unite! :)

Discussion in 'Pantheism-Panentheism DIR' started by Nefelie, May 4, 2016.

  1. Nefelie

    Nefelie Member

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    ~~~

    Hello everyone!

    It’s nice to be somewhere where there are other Pantheists like me. Where I live, we seem to be an extremely rare “specie”.

    I’d like to ask what made you a Pantheist?

    Thank you for responding! :)

    .
     
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  2. Terese

    Terese Mangalam Pundarikakshah
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    My religion. God is reality, as we say :D How did you become a pantheist\panentheist?
    Also it was a very interesting concept when i was looking into Vaishnavism
     
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  3. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    From this one's perspectives, the gods - all the forces of reality - set things on their determined and fated path, and I am of course no different. There was simply no other way I could be.

    For better or worse, I was brought up in a culture pervaded by classical monotheism, a theology that never made much sense to me. For years I thought the only "live" option for theism was classical monotheism - there was only one god, and if I rejected that one, I was a non-theist or an atheist. It took years before I became more educated about the subject of theism, and in particular, encountered the notion that gods are that which peoples deem worthy of worship. It took more time still to understand that "worship" did not mean "grovel in servitude" but "to hold something in high regard, deep respect, and humble gratitude." Once the conditioning of classical monotheism was shattered.


    I'd always felt the world around me was sacred and wondrous. Once the conditioning of classical monotheism was shattered, and I understood I was allowed to call those things gods, I did. They always had been my gods, only my culture had taught me there was only one god, and all others were false, or "dead" theological options.
     
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  4. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta and Spiritualist and Pantheist
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    I am a non-dual Hindu pantheist based on my study of the teachings of many spiritual masters I have come to respect.

    One issue I have is that there seems to be two types of pantheism that I think are fundamentally different. The type of pantheism I believe in says that consciousness is fundamental and the entire universe is part of that One Consciousness. A second type of pantheism is materialistic. It believes that matter is fundamental and consciousness was created by matter.

    How do you understand your pantheism?
     
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  5. Ouroboros

    Ouroboros Coincidentia oppositorum

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    And a third one that both of those things that we see are really emerging from the unknown source that's neither conscious nor material. That what we see as material is just an illusion of the mind, and the mind is an illusion of matter, makes the third option more likely, both illusion of the same fundamental thing.
     
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  6. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta and Spiritualist and Pantheist
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    What is this fundamental thing that is not material nor conscious? What is this? It has to be something?
     
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  7. Ouroboros

    Ouroboros Coincidentia oppositorum

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    I could say life. :) So in a way, "God" (as the pantheistic God of all things that is) led me to it.

    Short story: Born in Christian family in Sweden. Became "saved" at the age of 7. Spoke in tongues at 11. Went to Bible school and mission trips and so on. Super dedicated, fundamentalist Christian. Joined Word of Faith movement. Moved to USA in the 90's with my wife and kids. Had a huge car accident months later that totally crushed us, and it took a lifetime to deal with (i.e. we still suffer the consequences). I kept my belief in Jesus and God for years after. Promised myself not to ask "why?" My subconscious did anyway. One day, around 2001 or after (don't remember), I basically suddenly one morning realized that I didn't believe in God anymore. A few years ago, started to realize that atheism only describes something about me that I'm not, i.e. it's a label to tell people what I don't believe in, but it doesn't say anything about what I do believe in. At one point, I had an amazing experience of unity with the universe, life, reality, and such, and my conversion journey to call myself a pantheist was on its way.
     
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  8. Ouroboros

    Ouroboros Coincidentia oppositorum

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    Sure. But why categorize it in one or the other box of things that we only can see in this universe?

    Matter breaks down at the quantum level. There's no "matter" in quantum physics. Just think of the fact that an electron is a null-point or no-volume point in space. And I think its the same with the other particles. They don't have volume. There's no "particle" the way we think of matter. There's no "thing" in matter. It's only forces, energies, properties, information flow, energy fields, interactions, and so on. From this, matter emerges. From this, consciousness emerges. And most likely, those things deep down there at the core of our fabric of existence, they're also illusions of something beyond that we can't even grasp. So is it a "thing". Yes and no. Not a thing in the sense we think of things in this world. But does it exist, of course, otherwise the illusions couldn't emerge from it. All things we see and experience are just different modes of facets of the underlying substrate of reality. I could call it Dao, perhaps.

    The point here is only that you claim there's only two kinds of pantheists. And I tell you, no, there's a third kind (maybe more kinds, but at least one more), which is my kind.

    Now, you might not agree or understand my view. You don't have to. Just accept that the number of types of pantheists are 3 not 2. Unless you prefer that I stop calling myself a pantheist all together?
     
  9. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Three things made me realize I am a pantheist:

    1. Religious Forums: I never knew there was a word for what I believed until I looked up all the -isms and -ists. It made sense.

    2. Interrelationship with life itself. I found that my creativity is a good way to express my faith. Through this, I pray in life. It's an interrelationship with the "divine" by having an interrelationship with life: the physical earth, spirits, and people. Its sacred. Everything is sacred and divine. Everything is "god."

    3. Practicing "religious witchcraft" made me think of how I do my rituals with the divine. The only way I can do that is with the earth, people, and self. So, I see everything as divine to connect with life.

    Of course, it's complicated; and, it's a work in progress.
     
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  10. 'mud

    'mud ~~ Life is Stuff ~~
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    ~~ LIFE ~~
    I don't think I'm a Pan person, but I love the way most of you think.
    Not believing in any sort of single creator,
    I believe in the infinite resurrection of all energy.
    We live as we will, causing most of our own failings.
    We will all die eventually, and become some other format.
    I believe I'm doomed to spend the rest of infinity,
    on this earth, there is no heaven, and that, in itself, is sad.
    I worship life and what it gives, or takes, the balance must vary.
    But I shall not begin to worship some imaginary vision the skies.
    I'll just hang with Life's Stuff for awhile,
    shortly...shortly, we'll all be memories,
    and I'll go to what is waiting there, whatever it will be.
    But....I do love most of thinking...also I doubt that I understand.
    NuffStuff
    ~
    'mud
     
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  11. 'mud

    'mud ~~ Life is Stuff ~~
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    OHHHHHHH
    Welcome Nefelie,
    I hope your happy.....:cool:
    ~
    'mud
     
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  12. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    The number of types of pantheism is equal to the number of pantheists. :D

    (I don't fit into GA's schema either, in no small part because I'm not a dualist)
     
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  13. Nefelie

    Nefelie Member

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    I was interested in theology for as long as I can remember. My parents were both atheists, but my father was very much willing to talk religions with me and encouraged me to find what I believe on my own. He was always very subjective when we where talking about religions and never once tried to enforce his beliefs on me.

    But, no matter what religion I studied at the time, none seemed to fit me.

    Untill a NDE (near death experience) :)

    I was almost 19 and I had to have a very serious life threatening surgery. I was 6 hours in surgery. Everything went well, but while in recovery, due to the anaesthesiologists’ mistake, I started chocking. I was still under the anaesthesias influence, so I couldn’t move my body to let them know that I was chocking. They understood that there was something wrong from my cardiac pulse that started freaking out, but couldn’t understand what. Let me tell you that they are very much correct when they say that death by chocking is the worse! The agony is far beyond anything you can imagine. The last thing I remember was the nurse over me asking “what’s wrong? What is it?...” and then...

    Silence. Peace. I was floating among stars and feeling amazing. I understood I was dead, so the first thing I thought was “I’ll finally know if god exists!” :D

    Then, my personal consciousness, my ego, was gone and all of the sudden I felt that I was… everything! Anything! I really can’t describe that feeling, but it was as if I was a star, a breeze, a tree, a human, a kitty, etc all together, all at once. Truly amazing.

    And then, I started falling. And crashed into something cold, wet and... well, really disgusting, to be honest. The first thing I heard was the anaesthesiologist saying “OK, I got a pulse!” and so I understood that this disgusting thing I crushed into, was my body :p

    The next day, when I asked the anaesthesiologist what happened. She said that I really scared them and that I was “off” (flat-lined) for about 3 minutes. They never found out that I chocked to death. I told her that... no comment, right? :p

    That experience marked me and finally formed my beliefs. Years later, I came across Zen and Tao... and “fell in love” with them both :)

    I still had no idea I was a Pantheist, but, about the same time, I discovered the Empedoclian philosophy and finally found out that there is a term for my beliefs: Pantheism. :)

    Thank you for asking!

    “Fate”... that’s a weird thing. Do you believe in fate?


    I think the “first type” covers my beliefs fine, but combined with Ouroboros’ type:

    Yes. That! :)

    Care to share this experience?

    I practised witchcraft for a while too. It was helpful in so many ways :)

    I am! Thank you :)

    I hope you are too!


    .
     
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  14. Ouroboros

    Ouroboros Coincidentia oppositorum

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    Sure. And it was one ouf of many.

    I was out walking my dogs late at night. I walked through a path with no street lights. Saw the stars. Got hit by an intense feeling of unity with life, universe, everything. God and I was not separate. We're all that one.
     
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  15. George-ananda

    George-ananda Advaita Vedanta and Spiritualist and Pantheist
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    I had deleted that post but you must have saw it before I deleted it.

    Maybe I'm the one that should not classify myself as a 'Pantheist' because the interpretations are too broad and numerous and many I do not accept. I should just call myself 'Advaita'. I will have to exit this DIR.
     
  16. Quintessence

    Quintessence Tale Weaver
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    It is likely easier to say that I'm a determinist. "Fate" is a more literary, poetical term for that. Regardless of how it is termed, it does not seem to be a popular philosophical position.
     
  17. Ouroboros

    Ouroboros Coincidentia oppositorum

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    Oh. Then I'll delete my answer as well.

    But to explain my view, I will quote from Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy:
    http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/pantheism/
    The "neither of these types" refers (1) Physicalism and (2) Idealism. Which are those two categories mentioned earlier. The materialist and the spiritual/pure-consciousness aspects.

    Spinoza stepped out of the sphere of natural categories. Refused to see it as either material or immaterial. The force behind it is something more, something else.

    It's a bit like "If you name Dao, it's not longer Dao." Matter and consciousness are things or stuff that we can name. The ultimate "thing" behind it all, it's neither one of them. It's something we can't understand and can't name.

    In reality, Dao isn't a thing or a thought, but action. It's the flow, current, fire, motion, which is endless. The constant dance of yin and yang, chaos and order. And in the borders between the two fighting forces, that's where we have the emergence and evolution of things that we can truly name and see, but the dance itself, doesn't have a name. It just is.

    This, interestingly enough ties into the concept of God as verb instead of a noun. God is the motion of life and existence, not a something or a someone.

    (Other similar ideas to look into: neutral monism, reflexive monism, and more)
     
    #17 Ouroboros, May 4, 2016
    Last edited: May 4, 2016
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  18. Unveiled Artist

    Unveiled Artist Veteran Member

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    Exactly!
     
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  19. fantome profane

    fantome profane Have you read the Mueller Report?
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    um, if everything is one, how much more united can we get? ;)
     
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  20. Acintya_Ash

    Acintya_Ash Bhakta

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    Hard to say exactly, I was scouting around Panentheism, Solipsism and gradually got drifted to Pantheism. Its a wonderful to experience your oneness with The Nature!
     
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