organic vs inorganic

[Thief]

stumbled into text that left a huge divide

and the same article leaned to the notion that a line drawn seems elusive

anyone want to give it a shot?

 

[Daemon Sophic]

stumbled into text that left a huge divide

and the same article leaned to the notion that a line drawn seems elusive

anyone want to give it a shot?

Care to give a shot at an explanation?
Like maybe a link to this “article” you mention?

 

[SalixIncendium]

stumbled into text that left a huge divide

and the same article leaned to the notion that a line drawn seems elusive

anyone want to give it a shot?

Not only will I give it a shot, I'll give it a whole bottle...

 

[Thief]

ok guys.....wikipedia
but I was thinking the forum might have a go at it

wiki is all fine and good.....but states the line drawn is questioned

example....carbon dioxide....
inorganic

I would not have thought so

 

[Wu Wei]

ok guys.....wikipedia
but I was thinking the forum might have a go at it

wiki is all fine and good.....but states the line drawn is questioned

example....carbon dioxide....
inorganic

I would not have thought so

All I got is this

From here

"Compounds that are considered organic must contain carbon bound to hydrogen and possibly other elements. By this definition, iron cyanide complexes, carbon dioxide, carbon tetrachloride, and sodium bicarbonate are all inorganic."

And that is all I will likely contribute to the discussion

 

[Thief]

ok...
but I must be mistaken by a line drawn earlier in my life

the compound in question must PROMOTE life

carbon dioxide is of no use to us humans
but plants suck it up

 

[David T]

Inorganic potatoes. The grow by rivers and in glaciers. They seem impervious to cooking for some reason that mAybe shunydragon can explain.

Organic potatoes.
They multiply and grow by having sex underground. Ohhh baby potatoes are a fine tasty treat.

 

[ScottySatan]

stumbled into text that left a huge divide

and the same article leaned to the notion that a line drawn seems elusive

anyone want to give it a shot?

Organic is an archaic word that chemists themselves will say was made obsolete 100 years ago when someone synthesize an inorganic compound into an organic one.

For modern chemistry in general, organic does not refer to carbon based molecules, but hydrocarbon based molecules.

Ethanol: CH3-CH2-OH is organic. Carbon monoxide C=O is inorganic.

Edited to add: Organic used to be an important term referring to the stuff from which life comes. It was hypothesized by some that organic molecules had some kind of living essence infused into them. At the time, people did not know that all atoms are made from the same stuff, and didn't know (or didn't want to know) that there is nothing particularly unique about the materials from which life is made.

To a biologist, the distinction doesn't really matter, and it's not something we think about. No biologist is going to not study CO2 in life just because it's an inorganic compound.

 

[Thief]

Organic is an archaic word that chemists themselves will say was made obsolete 100 years ago when someone synthesize an inorganic compound into an organic one.

For modern chemistry in general, organic does not refer to carbon based molecules, but hydrocarbon based molecules.

Ethanol: CH3-CH2-OH is organic. Carbon monoxide C=O is inorganic.

Edited to add: Organic used to be an important term referring to the stuff from which life comes. It was hypothesized by some that organic molecules had some kind of living essence infused into them. At the time, people did not know that all atoms are made from the same stuff, and didn't know (or didn't want to know) that there is nothing particularly unique about the materials from which life is made.

To a biologist, the distinction doesn't really matter, and it's not something we think about. No biologist is going to not study CO2 in life just because it's an inorganic compound.

so eventually.....association of a compound
to the chemistry of life
will fade

maybe to say.?....it is organic DURING the use of the compound
and inorganic when not within the body of a a living thing

 

[Milton Platt]

ok guys.....wikipedia
but I was thinking the forum might have a go at it

wiki is all fine and good.....but states the line drawn is questioned

example....carbon dioxide....
inorganic

I would not have thought so

My understanding is that anything carbon based is organic. In this last century, people have hijacked the word to mean “grown without artificial fertilizers or pesticides”

 

[ScottySatan]

so eventually.....association of a compound
to the chemistry of life
will fade

maybe to say.?....it is organic DURING the use of the compound
and inorganic when not within the body of a a living thing

No, organic just means it's hydrocarbons. As opposed to metals or noble gasses. Or non-hydrogenated carbon like diamond, graphite, CO, CO2. If you add anything other than a molecule being a hydrocarbon, then you've gone beyond the scope of what Organic means in science and you should probably call it something else.

Gasoline is organic. Vegetable oil for cooking is organic. The ethanol in a bottle of vodka is organic. They're not in a living thing. And if you drink enough of any of those three organic drinks, you will not be a living thing either.

 

[Polymath257]

ok...
but I must be mistaken by a line drawn earlier in my life

the compound in question must PROMOTE life

carbon dioxide is of no use to us humans
but plants suck it up

Well, it has a role in human biochemistry also. The acidity of the blood is largely determined by carbon dioxide content.

But, no, organic chemicals do NOT need to 'promote life'. There are a great many organic chemicals out there that are almost uniformly deadly.

The terms 'organic' and 'inorganic' are classification tools and little else. They are for the convenience of the chemists who study such compounds and not for, say, biologists.

 

[Thief]

drink enough of any of those three organic drinks, you will not be a living thing either.

I get overdose......


but carbon gets around
and when it hooks up it can promote life
or kill it

the human fat molecule is carbon, hydrogen, and oxygen
and breaks down into water and carbon dioxide

if carbon is key.....then is water organic?

kinda hard to not drink water

 

[Polymath257]

I get overdose......


but carbon gets around
and when it hooks up it can promote life
or kill it

the human fat molecule is carbon, hydrogen, and oxygen
and breaks down into water and carbon dioxide

if carbon is key.....then is water organic?

kinda hard to not drink water

No. Water is NOT considered to be an organic compound. Again, these are technical terms, not popular ones.

 

[Thief]

or·gan·ic
/ôrˈɡanik/
adjective

1. 1.​
   relating to or derived from living matter.
   "organic soils"
   synonyms:living, live, animate, biological, biotic
   "organic matter"
2. 2.​
   PHYSIOLOGY
   relating to a bodily organ or organs.

from a quick look on Google

 

[Polymath257]

Again, the term 'organic' is a technical one for chemistry.

Organic chemistry - Wikipedia

Not all organic compounds in chemistry are related to living things. In fact, a great number of them are made in labs and can be quite toxic.

 

[Thief]

Again, the term 'organic' is a technical one for chemistry.

Organic chemistry - Wikipedia

Not all organic compounds in chemistry are related to living things. In fact, a great number of them are made in labs and can be quite toxic.

so you lean to the lab.....fine

and some poisons are medicine

 

[Polymath257]

so you lean to the lab.....fine

and some poisons are medicine

Not that I lean to the lab. But you asked about the meaning of the term 'organic' in the context of chemistry. In that context, the word does NOT require a link to living things. It is the chemistry of most carbon compounds.

 

[Thief]

Not that I lean to the lab. But you asked about the meaning of the term 'organic' in the context of chemistry. In that context, the word does NOT require a link to living things. It is the chemistry of most carbon compounds.

and chemistry does not exist?.......in organs

 

[Polymath257]

and chemistry does not exist?.......in organs

Huh?

If you want the chemistry specifically of living things, you want *biochemistry*.