Open Abortion Clinics on Federal Lands!

[Subduction Zone]

I don't care what you call him. The only question I have to answer is: if we had aborted one of our children at 6 weeks would he exist today?
If the answer is "no" then we would have killed a wonderful adult who only exists today because we allowed him or her to develop in the womb.

You can call a fetus or an embryo almost anything that you want too. But if you claim that it is something that it is not you will be corrected.

And you do not know if the fetus would become a wonderful human being. He could become the next "Hannibal Lecter".

 

[Wildswanderer]

No, the public would be able to go there, not just Native Americans. They are in the dire situations because of us anyway.

And the last thing they need is the government putting abortion mills on their lands.

 

[Sand Dancer]

Interesting. I wonder if any Indigenous nations are privy for that?

The Oglala Sioux tribe discussed this but I don't think it went through. Maybe it will be discussed again.

 

[Sand Dancer]

Because of course... if you kill him at six weeks he can still exist later.?

His soul will and will go into another body. It's as plausible as your religious beliefs.

 

[Wildswanderer]

You can call a fetus or an embryo almost anything that you want too. But if you claim that it is something that it is not you will be corrected.

And you do not know if the fetus would become a wonderful human being. He could become the next "Hannibal Lecter".

So which one should we have killed?
Each individual has the potential for greatness or great depravity. It's still not in my power to decide who gets to develop.

 

[Sand Dancer]

And the last thing they need is the government putting abortion mills on their lands.

They are at least open to it. We will see what happens.

 

[Wildswanderer]

His soul will and will go into another body. It's as plausible as your religious beliefs.

Again, I can't believe what I don't believe. That might work for some Hindu. It's not my belief system. And even if it were I still could not play God.

 

[Subduction Zone]

So which one should we have killed?
Each individual has the potential for greatness or great depravity. It's still not in my power to decide who gets to develop.

You don't have a choice in the matter. That choice lies with the pregnant woman.

I think that you have already lost the key part of the debate. The right to bodily autonomy.

 

[Wildswanderer]

You don't have a choice in the matter. That choice lies with the pregnant woman.

I think that you have already lost the key part of the debate. The right to bodily autonomy.

So my wife could have killed my child without my consent? You realize that's partly my DNA, right?
Yes the baby has the right to bodily autonomy.

 

[wellwisher]

The Supreme Court decision simply brought the abortion issue back to the states, where people in each state will decide. This will allow 50 experiments to be run, to see what is the best way. Medical tourism may become common, with private funding and donations needed to replace current system of forced taxation, without representation.

Abortion is really closer to a cosmetic procedure, similar to a nose job. I own my face and have the right to a nose job. Neither are necessary for my physical health, but both may benefit my psychological well being. But since this is a choice that only benefits the ego, but is not needed by the body, it should not be paid for by the tax payer. Women may need rot start saving for college, retirement and abortion.

The fear is less about not being able to find a state for an abortion, but about Big Government losing some of its power to force feed funding, at the tax payer expense. Some states may make it legal, but may not be able to afford to foot the bill. This is an opportunity for abortion supporters to put their money where their mouth is; charity, or be hypocrites.

 

[fantome profane]

So my wife could have killed my child without my consent? You realize that's partly my DNA, right?
Yes the baby has the right to bodily autonomy.

No entity has the right to live inside a human being.

Your right to swing your arm ends at the tip of my nose.

 

[Wildswanderer]

No entity has the right to live inside a human being.

Good grief. . With that attitude the human race would have died out long ago.
The people involved presumably knew that sex can cause babies. So, no sex, no chance of a baby. People have become so stupid that they can't see the obvious?

 

[fantome profane]

Good grief. . With that attitude the human race would have died out long ago.
The people involved presumably knew that sex can cause babies. So, no sex, no chance of a baby. People have become so stupid that they can't see the obvious?

That is not a refutation of what I said.

 

[esmith]

Your right to swing your arm ends at the tip of my nose.

All depends on where you stuck your nose doesn't it?

 

[fantome profane]

All depends on where you stuck your nose doesn't it?

If someone sticks their nose somewhere it has no right to be you should be able to remove it. Even if we are talking about an embryo that may not even have a nose yet.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

The Supreme Court decision simply brought the abortion issue back to the states, where people in each state will decide. This will allow 50 experiments to be run, to see what is the best way. Medical tourism may become common, with private funding and donations needed to replace current system of forced taxation, without representation.

Abortion is really closer to a cosmetic procedure, similar to a nose job. I own my face and have the right to a nose job. Neither are necessary for my physical health, but both may benefit my psychological well being. But since this is a choice that only benefits the ego, but is not needed by the body, it should not be paid for by the tax payer. Women may need rot start saving for college, retirement and abortion.

The fear is less about not being able to find a state for an abortion, but about Big Government losing some of its power to force feed funding, at the tax payer expense. Some states may make it legal, but may not be able to afford to foot the bill. This is an opportunity for abortion supporters to put their money where their mouth is; charity, or be hypocrites.

Most abortions are already funded by private organizations. Federal funding for abortion is already illegal (because we're a primitive backwater ****hole.)
Healthcare shouldn't rely on charity. In most of the world it doesn't, because that's a stupid, short sighted, selfish sentiment. Even a nose job would be covered in most actually developed countries. But pregnancy is in no way like a nose job and neither is abortion. Americans should know this because it has *the highest maternal death rate of any developed country.*

If I ever get pregnant, which would be really difficult considering BC is part of my healthcare treatment, I plan on going to a red state to get an abortion just to spite them. Because all pregnancies I could have are high risk, thus would still be Dr recommended abortion before it becomes an emergency later.

P.s. I encourage all women unfortunately stuck in their primitive backwards red states to buy or rent a mailing box out of state with a route to your home. Then you can buy plan B or abortificents from those states and have it mailed to you. It's 100% legal and the state can't kick up a fuss about it. Not yet anyway.
Don't hoard though, a lot of people will be needing it.

 

[esmith]

If someone sticks their nose somewhere it has no right to be you should be able to remove it. Even if we are talking about an embryo that may not even have a nose yet.

Then my rights don't always end at the tip of your nose do they.

 

[Heyo]

Then my rights don't always end at the tip of your nose do they.

Depends on the state your living in. In some you can have the nose removed by the police (but not swing your fist), in others you are allowed to punch it.

 

[Stevicus]

Drat. I have always lived in states that have had quite a few reservations. But only a few states would see much in the way of relief by appealing to native tribes:

Indian reservation - Wikipedia

I saw that it's being discussed, but apparently it's not as easy as some might think: Tribal lands unlikely to become 'safe havens' for abortion clinic | 12news.com

ARIZONA, USA — The Supreme Court decision overturning Roe vs. Wade has raised a lot of questions and confusion about the law in Arizona.

And recently, people across the country have been raising the question of whether tribal lands could be so-called “safe havens” or “safe harbors” for abortion access because it’s sovereign land.

12 News first started looking into this after a City of Tucson Council Member Steve Kozachik said the city was working on giving land to the nearby Pascua Yaqui tribe for a Planned Parenthood clinic. The comments were published in a KVOA piece Friday. It turns out - Kozachik was wrong.

On Sunday, Kozachik retracted his comments, saying they were not grounded in solid legal counsel and not based on conversations with the city or representatives of the tribe.

"I think people are just looking for answers and solutions," said Stacy Leeds, a professor of law and leadership at ASU Law.

She and some of her colleagues across the country fielding questions about clinics on tribal land daily since the Supreme Court’s draft decision was leaked earlier this year.

Her take is that a scenario like this is possible but highly unlikely. And it could come with consequences.

In an interview with 12 News Monday, Leeds said she's never seen any tribe do this and hasn't heard of any tribe discussing plans to do so either.

Abortion access on tribal lands is already slim. Leeds explained that most tribal healthcare funding comes from the U.S. government's Indian Health Service. Federal law largely won't allow for federal dollars to fund abortions.

She added, that if a tribe were to do this with its own or private money, it probably wouldn’t work for non-Indians, even if a procedure is done on tribal land.

"Anytime you introduce non-members of the tribe, that’s going to implicate either state or federal jurisdiction," Leeds explained.

The Mayor’s Office in Tucson said Mayor Regina Romero wasn’t aware of any plan for this to happen on the Pascua Yaqui reservation.

Kozachik further scaled his statements back in a retraction notice, saying non-Indian residents wouldn’t be "beyond the reach of federal or state law."

"All of the conversations seem to be started by people who are non-Indian trying to see if Native American communities might provide some service to them," Leeds stated. "It’s not an organically, tribally motivated conversation at this point."

As for Tucson ceding land to the Pascua Yaqui tribe, that’s actually part of a congressional bill that passed the US House last year. But again, there are no plans right now for Planned Parenthood to go on that site.

Planned Parenthood of Arizona, the Attorney General for the Pascua Yaqui tribe and Kozachik's Office could not be reached for comment by the time of this publication.

 

[Jayhawker Soule]

They could go in federal buildings perhaps.

And here I was thinking that he really stumped you.