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One Shepherd

Discussion in 'Scriptural Debates' started by OtherSheep, Jul 16, 2018.

  1. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

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    Jesus spoke not one word on his own authority, but only that which he was commanded to say by the Lord God, The Son of Man, the MOST HIGH in the creation and the only begotten son of God.

    Deuteronomy 18: 18-19; I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put MY WORDS in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him. I myself will call to account anyone who does not listen to MY WORDS that the prophet speaks in my name.

    John 12: 48, John 14: 26, Matthew 28: 19, John 17: 20, 10: 16, 10: 5, 10: 1, Matthew 15: 24, John 6: 44 and 14: 6; are all the words of our Lord God and savior as spoken through the mouth of his chosen prophet 'Jesus.'
     
  2. OtherSheep

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    Good to know.

    How many from your list came before Jesus, and how many were hirelings?

    John 10:7-16 "Jesus said therefore again to them, `Verily, verily, I say to you -- I am the door of the sheep; all, as many as came before Me, are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them; I am the door, through me if any one may come in, he shall be saved, and he shall come in, and go out, and find pasture.

    `The thief doth not come, except that he may steal, and kill, and destroy; I came that they may have life, and may have [it] abundantly. `I am the good shepherd; the good shepherd His life layeth down for the sheep; and the hireling, and not being a shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, doth behold the wolf coming, and doth leave the sheep, and doth flee; and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep; and the hireling doth flee because he is an hireling, and is not caring for the sheep.

    `I am the good shepherd, and I know My [sheep], and am known by Mine, according as the Father doth know Me, and I know the Father, and My life I lay down for the sheep, and other sheep I have that are not of this fold, these also it behoveth Me to bring, and My voice they will hear, and there shall become one flock -- one shepherd."
     
  3. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg World Citizen
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    What a magnificent prophecy.

    What we could consider, is that Christ is all The Messengers, as it is the Spirit that gives life and the flesh amounts to not a thing.

    We could also consider that Christ means 'Annointed One' and it is the same Spirit that annoints all Gods Messengers.

    From my view of scriptures , this is how we will have one fold with One Shepherd, God. To me, The 'Glory of God', the Father has shown us how this is so. He has taken what was said by Jesus the Christ and shown it unto us.

    May Christ be with you always.

    Regards Tony
     
  4. OtherSheep

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    Matthew tells us that Jesus is God with us.
    But what is it that you are saying, dude?
     
  5. OtherSheep

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    Matthew 24:4-5 "And Jesus answered and said unto them, 'Take heed that no man deceive you. For many shall come in My name, saying, I am {the anointed}; and shall deceive many."
    Matthew 7:23 "And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from Me, ye that work anomia {without law}." {obviously, these both apply to Paulianity}

    p.s., that's only a magnificent prophecy when taken in context with everything else Jesus says. His sheep don't hear the voice of anyone Jesus didn't send to them. Otherwise, it wouldn't be one flock with one message. Jesus warns us against people who say the idiocy of 'faith without the works of the law'. James and Jude, do, too; they both had the same adversary in mind, because of the trial which Saul derailed by making the whole thing about resurrection... rather than about whether or not Saul had taught anomianism. Obviously, he did. But to pretend otherwise, he became the chameleon he prides himself on being. Jesus praises the man in whom there is no guile. Saul brags about having caught someone with guile. And indeed, that is precisely his M.O... by pretending that he is talking about the same Jesus who stands behind the Gospel of Matthew and John and the Revelation... his followers are convinced that everything changed at the cross. But since Jesus says that His word will never pass away, one can only wonder why those dupes fell for any word of Paulianity.
     
    #105 OtherSheep, Sep 18, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2018
  6. Tony Bristow-Stagg

    Tony Bristow-Stagg World Citizen
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    Likewise Christ tells us about True Prophets;

    I will not post passages here, as they are available for all that wish to search for a true prophet.

    What Does the Bible Say About True Prophet?

    Regards Tony
     
  7. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

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    Of course the only begotten son of God, who was chosen by Abraham as his God, was with us in the body of his chosen heir and successor, the man Jesus, who he filled with his spirit, which descended upon him in the form of a dove as he came up out of the baptismal waters of the Jordan as the heavenly voice was heard to say; "You are my Son, THIS DAY I have begotten thee.

    Exodus 6: 2; God spoke to Moses and said; "I am the Lord. I appeared to Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob as God Almighty, but I did not make my name known to them by my Holy Name, the Lord/Jahweh.

    Deuteronomy 18:18-19 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put MY WORDS in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him. I myself will call to account anyone who does not listen to MY WORDS that the prophet speaks in my name.

    The words that came out of the mouth of the man Jesus, were the words of our Lord God and savior, the Son of man, who is the MOST HIGH in the creation and the only begotten Son of God.

    Even you have admitted that the words that came out of the mouth of the man Jesus, were the words of God's only begotten Son.

    Open your eyes and unplug your ears, and lift that cloud that dulls your mind, and you will see the Lord God our savior.
     
  8. OtherSheep

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    Unlike Saul, who came in his own name and is frequently saying he THINKS he's right.

    But I have to confess that your way of expressing yourself leaves almost as much in doubt as does Saul of Tarsus... which is why I asked you what YOU thought, "the anointed".
     
    #108 OtherSheep, Sep 19, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2018
  9. OtherSheep

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    I'm not interested in Paulianity, so, I don't read the ramblings of his Pharisized proselytes.

    And obviously, your Paulianity has no place in a thread called One Shepherd.
    But, since you're here... the cautionary tale:

    To Nazareth or Tarsus?

    Do a web search on the word Paulianity...
    you won't even have to put it in quotes... yep, it's that popular.

    Jesus' words Only - Jesus' words as the sole inspired portion of the New Testament Scripture.
     
    #109 OtherSheep, Sep 19, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2018
  10. The Anointed

    The Anointed Well-Known Member

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    The Anointed……. JHWH is our God, who said to Moses; “I will send them a prophet like you from among their own people; I will put MY WORDS into his mouth and he will tell the people everything that I command him. Anyone who does not heed MY WORDS that he will speak in my name.

    Peter confirms that Jesus was that that prophet, when in reference to Jesus he said in Acts 3: 22; For Moses said; "The Lord your God will send you a prophet, Just as he sent me, and he will be one of your own people, etc."

    Did the people of his day believe that he was the Lord, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob. The God of our ancestors? No, they did not, for on the day of his triumphant entry into Jerusalem, the people escorting him cried out, "Blessed is he, who comes in the name of the Lord." Verifying that they believed Jesus to be the one that God had promised that he would choose from among the Israelites, and send to the people to speak in his name.

    Other Sheep wrote…… John 10:7-16 "Jesus said therefore again to them, `Verily, verily, I say to you -- I am the door of the sheep; all, as many as came before Me, are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not hear them; I am the door, through me if any one may come in, he shall be saved, and he shall come in, and go out, and find pasture.

    The thief doth not come, except that he may steal, and kill, and destroy; I came that they may have life, and may have [it] abundantly. `I am the good shepherd; the good shepherd His life layeth down for the sheep; and the hireling, and not being a shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, doth behold the wolf coming, and doth leave the sheep, and doth flee; and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep; and the hireling doth flee because he is an hireling, and is not caring for the sheep.

    I am the good shepherd, and I know My [sheep], and am known by Mine, according as the Father doth know Me, and I know the Father, and My life I lay down for the sheep, and other sheep I have that are not of this fold, these also it behoveth Me to bring, and My voice they will hear, and there shall become one flock -- one shepherd."

    The Anointed……. Our Lord God and saviour, who chose the man Jesus from among the Israelites to speak the words that he was commanded to speak in HIS name, said through his chosen prophet in GNB John 10: 7-16; “I am telling you the truth; I am the gate for the sheep. All others who came before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep did not listen to them. I am the gate. Whoever comes in by me; he will come in and go out and find pasture. The thief comes only in order to steal, kill, and destroy. I have come in order that you might have life----life in all its fullness.

    The Lord God our saviour, who put his words into the mouth of his chosen prophet Jesus, continues to speak through his obedient servant

    “I am the good shepherd, who is willing to die for the sheep. When the hired man, who is not a shepherd and does not own the sheep, see a wolf coming he leaves the sheep and runs away; so the wolf snatches the sheep and scatters them. The hired man runs away because he is only a hired man and does not care about the sheep. I am the good shepherd; As the Father knows me and I know the Father, in the same way, I know my sheep and they know me. And I am willing to die for them. There are other sheep which belong to methat are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them too, they will listen to my voice, and they will become one flock with one shepherd.

    So said the Lord through his chosen heir and successor, who was his physical image on earth. And Just as Moses lifted up the bronze IMAGE of the serpent, whose venom was coursing through the veins of God people and destroying them, in like manner the earthly IMAGE of ‘The Son of Man’ had to be lifted up, in order that all those who turn their eyes to the one who was lifted up, would be saved.

    The Son of Man, The Only Begotten Son of the Most High, who filled Jesus with his spirit on the day he was baptised, could not die, but he ceased to be an individual entity, when he abandoned his chosen heir on the cross, and released all the righteous spirits who had been gathered to him in his ascension to the ends of time, these were they who came out of their graves and three days later, entered into the city and revealed themselves as the risen body Of Christ, the only man to have ascended to the very throne of the MOST HIGH in the creation, where he was ANOINTED as the successor to that throne, and translated in order that he should never experience death.

    The Son of Man, who came down and was chosen by Abraham as his God. Was the only exception of all mankind to have ascended to the ends of time and witness the universe burn up and fall as massive columns of fire beyond all measure in height and depth into the Great Abysss/Black Hole, which he described as the prison of all the stars and the host of heaven.
     
  11. OtherSheep

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    Whew... pretty glad I didn't address that question to you.
    Reading manmade dogma is never on my to-do-list.


    Which actually makes zero witnesses to Paulianity having replaced the words of Jesus.

    Go and create your own thread, "the anointed".


    Comparing the Pauline Hierarchy to One Shepherd won't work here.

    12:28 And god hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.

    23:8 But be not ye called Rabbi: for one is your Master, [even] Christ; and all ye are brethren.


    That 12:28 hierarchy is the doctrine of some strange god... which makes Saul of Tarsus a false prophet, by definition... and he writes specifically against what Jesus tells His sheep.

    Deuteronomy 18:20 "But the prophet whosoever shall impiously speak in my name a word which I have not commanded him to speak, and whosoever shall speak in the name of other gods, that prophet shall die."
     
    #111 OtherSheep, Sep 20, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2018
  12. OtherSheep

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    ONE SHEPHERD
    according to Scripture


    Ezekiel 34:10 Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I [am] against the shepherds; and I will require My flock at their hand, and cause them to cease from feeding the flock; neither shall the shepherds feed themselves any more; for I will deliver My flock from their mouth, that they may not be meat for them. 11 For thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I, [even] I, will both search My sheep, and seek them out. 12 As a shepherd seeketh out His flock in the day that He is among His sheep [that are] scattered; so will I seek out My sheep, and will deliver them out of all places where they have been scattered in the cloudy and dark day.
    16 I will seek that which was lost, and bring again that which was driven away, and will bind up [that which was] broken, and will strengthen that which was sick: but I will destroy the fat and the strong; I will feed them with judgment.
    20 Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD unto them; Behold, I, [even] I, will judge between the fat cattle and between the lean cattle. 21 Because ye have thrust with side and with shoulder, and pushed all the diseased with your horns, till ye have scattered them abroad;
    23 And I will set up one shepherd over them, and He shall feed them, [even] My servant David; He shall feed them, and He shall be their shepherd.

    John 10:14 `I am the good shepherd, and I know My [sheep], and am known by Mine, 10:15 according as the Father doth know Me, and I know the Father, and My life I lay down for the sheep, 10:16 and other sheep I have that are not of this fold, these also it behoveth Me to bring, and My voice they will hear, and there shall become one flock -- one shepherd. 10:17 `Because of this doth the Father love Me, because I lay down My life, that again I may take it; 10:18 no one doth take it from Me, but I lay it down of Myself; authority I have to lay it down, and authority I have again to take it; this command I received from My Father.'
     
  13. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

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    You do recognize that Peter's heir, the pope, is often shown carrying a shepherds staff. That would be with respect to Zechariah 11:15, "the equipment of a useless/foolish shepherd". As for "fat" and "strong", shepherds such Billy Graham, a millionaire, and his son, who makes around $350,000 per year as head of his charity for the poor, seems to be doing quite well. What "judgment" is would be in store for such as these?
     
    #113 2ndpillar, Sep 21, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2018
  14. OtherSheep

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    To Peter:
    16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

    To all believers:
    18:18 Verily I say unto you, Whatsoever ye shall bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever ye shall loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.

    Peter's heirs know this. But they don't seem to have a clue in Rome.

    It was a pretty good way of knowing what was going on, wasn't it. Not the first spy system, but one of the most comprehensive, right? And if the sins told to men you never harmed were blackmailable... you can imagine many reasons for many otherwise inexplicable things within Romanism.

    People like Graham are in a position to act like Judas on a grand scale. If they never got paid, ther'd be fewer false shepherds, and few if any church buildings skipping the whole 'render unto Caesar' thing. If you get special treatment from Caesar, he's got control over you. It's bad enough that anti-slavery wasn't ratified but has morphed us all into wage-slaves... now government runs the unversities where dogma is created.
    "It was a bright cold day in April, and the clocks were striking thirteen." -- Orwell, 1984
     
  15. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

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    Exactly what was said to the heir of Peter/Shebna, the head of household (Isaiah 22:15- 22), Eliakim (pope), who was to "fall" "in that day", and all who are "hanging on" to him, will be "cut off" (Isaiah 22:25). Matthew 18:18 was spoken to all the disciples, including Judas. The key note of Matthew 18:17, was it takes two witnesses to confirm any matter. If the two are not listened to, let their listeners be as "Gentiles". The first part of Matthew 18, was about stumbling blocks, of which Yeshua called Peter both a "stumbling block to me", and "Satan" (Matthew 16:23), right after Peter was given the keys of the kingdom (Matthew 16:19).
     
  16. OtherSheep

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    Isaiah Chapter 22 - King James Bible With Strong's Dictionary - Bible Software by johnhurt.com

    In context, it's all about those who lived carelessly, like before the flood.

    But... you're [somehow] calling a Romanist God's servant... and even the God of raising?
    When was the Romanist ever father to Jerusalem? Jesus wanted to gather their children... Jesus was being portrayed and prophesied, and you still don't see it... at all. Amazing.

    And when was Peter ever acting as treasurer? Did Matthew or John call him that?
    In fact, treasurer is publican in Jesus' days... the treasurer was Judas...
    And not to be confused with a member of the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel... which Peter must have been, by definition... since it is only to the 10-tribes that Jesus came, and to them was the Kingdom Gospel both preached and received... the nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

    Jesus forgave Peter... and proved it:

    17:1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,17:2 And was transfigured before them: and His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light.


    Matthew Chapter 18 - King James Bible With Strong's Dictionary - Bible Software by johnhurt.com

    18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell [it] unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

    Publican means tax-gatherer... not "Gentiles".
    And it wasn't the listeners who were to be shunned.
    In history, tax-gathering was almost all, if not exclusively, a Jewish thing.
    Sayce says they were tax-farmers in Egypt, too.
    And all over European History, east and west, in all ages we see the same thing happening.
     
    #116 OtherSheep, Sep 26, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2018
  17. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

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    You seem confused in your response. Maybe a better bible translation might help. Matthew 18:17 was about both Gentile and tax collector. It wasn't about Peter. The only tax collector was Matthew, chosen last, and ranked first (Matthew 19:30).

    New American Standard Bible Matthew 18:17
    "If he refuses to listen to them, tell it to the church; and if he refuses to listen even to the church, let him be to you as a Gentile and a tax collector.

    Per your referenced Matthew 17:1, what was there to forgive Peter for? Peter denied Yeshua after your referenced meeting on the mountain. Plus Yeshua set Peter up to fulfill the role of Shebna, why would he undercut him?

    Isaiah 22:22 was about the "key of the house of David", which "when he opens no one will shut", which both Shebna/Peter, the steward in charge of the royal household, and Eliakim both held.

    Shebna, and his double, Peter, were Jews, not a Romanist. The only Romanist was Paul, a citizen of Rome, and one of the two staffs/shepherds taken to "pasture the flock doomed to slaughter" (Zechariah 11:8-10).
     
  18. OtherSheep

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    ++++++
    QUOTE="2ndpillar, post: 5791154, member: 51388"]Exactly what was said to the heir of Peter/Shebna, the head of household (Isaiah 22:15- 22), Eliakim (pope), who was to "fall" "in that day", and all who are "hanging on" to him, will be "cut off" (Isaiah 22:25). [/QUOTE
    ++++++

    xxxxxxxxxxxx
    QUOTE="OtherSheep, post: 5793790, member: 64612"]

    Isaiah Chapter 22 - King James Bible With Strong's Dictionary - Bible Software by johnhurt.com


    In context, it's all about those who lived carelessly, like before the flood.

    But... you're [somehow] calling a Romanist God's servant... and even the God of raising?
    When was the Romanist ever father to Jerusalem? Jesus wanted to gather their children... Jesus was being portrayed and prophesied, and you still don't see it... at all. Amazing.

    And when was Peter ever acting as treasurer? Did Matthew or John call him that?
    In fact, treasurer is publican in Jesus' days... the treasurer was Judas...
    And not to be confused with a member of the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel... which Peter must have been, by definition... since it is only to the 10-tribes that Jesus came, and to them was the Kingdom Gospel both preached and received... the nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

    Jesus forgave Peter... and proved it:

    17:1 And after six days Jesus taketh Peter, James, and John his brother, and bringeth them up into an high mountain apart,17:2 And was transfigured before them: and His face did shine as the sun, and His raiment was white as the light.

    ++++++
    QUOTE="2ndpillar, post: 5791154, member: 51388"]
    Matthew 18:18 was spoken to all the disciples, including Judas. The key note of Matthew 18:17, was it takes two witnesses to confirm any matter. If the two are not listened to, let their listeners be as "Gentiles".[/QUOTE
    ++++++

    Matthew Chapter 18 - King James Bible With Strong's Dictionary - Bible Software by johnhurt.com

    18:17 And if he shall neglect to hear them, tell [it] unto the church: but if he neglect to hear the church, let him be unto thee as an heathen man and a publican.

    Publican means tax-gatherer... not "Gentiles".
    And it wasn't the listeners who were to be shunned.
    In history, tax-gathering was almost all, if not exclusively, a Jewish thing.
    Sayce says they were tax-farmers in Egypt, too.
    And all over European History, east and west, in all ages we see the same thing happening.
    [/QUOTE
    xxxxxxxxxxxx

    +++++++
    QUOTE="2ndpillar, post: 5793908, member: 51388"]

    Maybe a better bible translation might help.
    New American Standard Bible

    Plus Yeshua set Peter up to fulfill the role of Shebna, why would he undercut him?
    [/QUOTE
    ++++++
    :eek: :rolleyes:

    Circular reasoning is less than worthless.
    Heathens and revenuers are obviously put into the same boat by Jesus.
     
    #118 OtherSheep, Sep 26, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2018
  19. 2ndpillar

    2ndpillar Well-Known Member

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    Judas was the treasurer, and was chosen because of his greed, so that he could fulfill Zechariah 11:12-13, as shown by the quote of Matthew 27:9-10 with respect to Judas Iscariot.

    Yeshua came and preached the kingdom of heaven to the Jews/Judah, and sent his disciples to the "lost sheep of the house of Israel".
     
  20. OtherSheep

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    That's not what Jesus says.

    Ma.15:24 "But He answered and said, 'I am not sent but unto the Lost Sheep of the House of Israel.'" {not the house of Judah}

    Jo.1:11 "He came unto his own, and His own received Him not."

    Ma.21:43 "Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof."

    Ma.23:37 "O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, [thou] that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under [her] wings, and ye would not! 38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate. 39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see Me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed [is] he that cometh in the name of the Lord."

    The same thing happened in the Oldest Testament... the kingdom was ripped from the hand of Solomon's son and given to 10-tribed Israel. The divided kingdom is not yet healed.
     
    #120 OtherSheep, Sep 26, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 26, 2018
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