angellous_evangellous said:
I can see the old maxim here, "You can lead a horse to water..." However, the water and the horse are truly there.
However, the philosophical idea that "all truth is subjective" is still not proven in your argument. It is more like a presupposition.
Yes. For example, the waveform spectrum of light is vast, however the human eye can only percieve a small fraction of this spectrum. The frequency spectrum of sound exceeds beyond 20,000 htz, which means that there is more sound than what the human ear can hear. There is more sound that objectively exists, however it does not exist because it cannot enter into the subjective human mind because of the limitations of the human ear.Everything that you percieve is a replication of an objective reality, making everything in reality subjective. When light hits the retina of your eye, this information is transduced into electricity, which causes neurons to fire, making a replication of an objective reality. When you stroke your fingers across a brick wall, you feel the roughness of it's texture, which seems objectively real to you. However, it is your nerves and the neurons in your brain that creates a replication of an objective reality, and therefore this sensory experience is ultimately a subjective experience. Something only becomes real to you when you become aware of it, by experiencing it through perception and sensation. Otherwise it does not exist. Matter must exist in order for a consciousness to exist, and a consciousness must exist in order for something to become aware of matter. In this mathematical anology, say that matter are numbers and the conscious mind an equation. In reality, your conscious mind is simply created by the complex organization of matter. It can easily be annihilated by removing portions of the brain.
There is more than what the eye can see. IMO It is all based on evolution. We are built according to our immediate environment, not so we can percieve everything in the vast universe, but so we can survive in our immediate environment. If the sun were a white dwarf, our eyes would have been built to see more of an infra-red spectrum due to the low emission of light. If that were so, our universe would appear different to us.`You call this naive, but your reality is only a subjective one extracted from an objective one. There is more than what the human eye can see, there is more than what the human ear can hear. What objectively exists however does not exist subjectively, does not exist subjectively because it exists outside of the subjective human mind due to the limitations of our sense organs and the limited capacity to interpret information that exceeds our immediate environment which is non essential to our survival.
angellous_evangellous said:
In fact, in your view, you obviously think that all truth is subjective, including the subjective means by which you yourself come to your conclusions. That is, you think that what you think is truth: truth is subjective. How do you yourself know this truth? Subjectively.
Personally, it is my truth. But that's all it is, personal. You truth is not mine and vice versa. I cannot force anyone to believe what I am saying, and I actually am starting to enjoy this more neutral standpoint. I don't think you are wrong, I think we all have our own way of percieving truth. Who am I to say you are right or wrong? I cannot grasp All truth that is objectively out there.
angellous_evangellous said:
So there is no spoon. This "no spoon" idea cannot be worked out pragmatically, as I pointed out above. Sure, there is no "right way" to drive a car, but we still have traffic laws.
And what is your point of adding traffic laws to my analogy?
angellous_evangellous said:
It looks like you are contradicting yourself in the above where I have emboldened the text. You can explain if you want to, but I also anticipate that we will be going around in circles. Please enjoy your subjective experience. Subjectively.
Thank you. Pleace enjoy your subjective experience too.
All of our conscious minds are like personal theatres. It's just that my projection screen doesn't project the same movie as yours. And don't forget to go to the lobby...