ONCE AGAIN! Facts in the Bible is supported by archaeology.

[David T]

Pontius Pilate’s ring may have been discovered at ancient biblical fortress

Just another nail that keeps appearing again and again.

It's amazing, to me, how the information in the Gospels and letters are supported by facts that are discovered.

And?
Not sure what the point of the post is at all. i assume the worst but hey i might be suprised. Explain your point. I mean jesus existed. The view jesus didnt exist has always been a fairy tale logic theory about like creationism, ID, And literal resurrectionism, and inerrancy in religion itself.

I would say the fact that jesus actually existed has zero to do with the previous nut job theories that exist in religion.. Please dont say but but but ..... Dont even bother.

 

[Kenny]

Do you have any idea how many "facts" in the vast majority of fictional works are actually verifiable? And do you suppose, therefore, that the fiction surrounding those facts must therefore also be true?

Writers, of all sorts, not just historians, use what they know to provide the background against which they tell their stories. The fact is, it is well attested that Pilate existed. The evidence that he presided at the trial and condemned Jesus is scantier, but even if evidence is found for that, do you actually think that it verifies in any way the supposed divinity of Jesus, his resurrection, or any of the rest of the foundational Christian notions?

In short: Pilate existed, somebody found a ring that MIGHT have belonged to Pilate, therefore Pilate executed Jesus and Jesus became God. There are, for me, just a couple of teeny gaps in the logical sequence...

Archaeology is painstakingly slow.

Also, do you know how many "facts" in the vast majority of non-fictional works are actually verifiable?

 

[Kenny]

And?
Not sure what the point of the post is at all. i assume the worst but hey i might be suprised. Explain your point.

So many people say it is a fictional book

 

[ADigitalArtist]

Then again, does that mean George Washington didn't exist?

Not sure how you got there from my post.

 

[ADigitalArtist]

So many people say it is a fictional book

Lots of fictional books contain non-fiction parts. Heck there is a whole genre of it called historical fiction. Where a fictional story is cultivated in a historically accurate period which contains many real world people and events. Some of my favorite stories are from that genre (such as Shogun).

 

[David T]

So many people say it is a fictional book

Its an esoteric ancient narrative story. A real person is involved.

Because he existed has zero to do with validating nonsense theories in religion and all theories he didnt exist are wistful thinking indentical and as stupid as theories in religion at best.

 

[lukethethird]

So many people say it is a fictional book

Well duh, have you read it?

 

[shunyadragon]

Yes... And then there was a time when they said King David never existed.

secular historians are always justifiably skeptical without justifiable archaeological evidence. The Bible is not history, but set in history. There are many ancient writings set in history with both real and mythical events and people. The Bible is one of those ancient collection of writings. Genesis is one of the books genuinely set in ancient mythology.

 

[Kenny]

May" is a very big and crucial word in archaeology, and certainly can't be taken as a definite affirmation as in "Facts in the Bible is supported by archaeology.

"Experts in Israel have identified a ring that may have belonged to Pontius Pilate, the Roman governor who oversaw the trial and crucifixion of Jesus Christ.

SCIENTISTS may have discovered the remains of Noah’s Ark in what could be the biggest Biblical archaeological discovery of all time.

Archaeologists working at the site of an ancient church in Turkey believe they may have found a relic of the cross of Jesus.

More than 25 years ago, archaeologists discovered a simple first-century A.D. home in Capernaum that may have been inhabited by Jesus during his Galilean ministry.

Major biblical discovery: Archaeologists may have found the Prophet Isaiah's 'signature'

In 2016, however, the purported tomb of Christ was opened for the first time in centuries as a part of restoring the Edicule. When samples of the actual burial bed and simple marble slab covering were dated, researchers got a surprise. The samples dated to A.D. 345, the same time as when Constantine first had the tomb of Christ officially recognized. As such, the Holy Sepulcher may well be the actual burial place of Christ.

Discovery of Philistine Cemetery may Solve Biblical Mystery

Archeologists have uncovered what may be the oldest Hebrew text, marking a possibly groundbreaking discovery for both Biblical and regional history.

​

And why do they use the word "may"? because they're not sure. The leap of certainty you make simply isn't justified.

.

Welcome to the real world:

(PhysOrg.com) -- Life's ability to replicate itself is essential for evolution, yet even the simplest kind of replication requires a relatively complex system. So what kind of non-replicating system might have served as the predecessor of evolution, paving the way for life as we know it? The answer, according to a recent study, is a kind of "prelife" -- a chemical system that can lead to information and diversity, and that is capable of selection and mutation, but does not yet have the ability to self-replicate.

In their study, Hisashi Ohtsuki of the Japan Science and Technology Agency and the Tokyo Institute of Technology, along with Martin Nowak of Harvard University, have investigated how evolution might have first begun. As the researchers explain, the origin of life is a transition from chemistry to biology, and has been widely studied. Here, Ohtsuki and Nowak have presented a model where a purely chemical system (prelife) becomes more efficient (catalytic prelife) and then builds the sequences needed for replication, finally resulting in life. Their work is published in a recent issue of Proceedings of the Royal Society B.

“As you know, the ability of replication is critical for life,” Ohtsuki told PhysOrg.com. “We can conceive several forms of life, such as prelife catalysts and replicators, as in our paper. We are interested in which form of life is most efficient and thus is selected in prelife (a soup of chemicals). The significance of our study is that we have mathematically shown for the first time that replicators, which have the ability to remain attached with a growing sequence, have a great advantage over the other forms of life. Replication is usually taken for granted in the study of evolution. We think that our result gives a justification of why replicators are so dominant.”

Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2009-09-evolution.html#jCp

And why do they use the word "might, conceive, we think"? because they're not sure. The leap of certainty you make simply isn't justified.

 

[Kenny]

Well duh, have you read it?

Your response gives the appearance you have never studied it.

 

[Kenny]

secular historians are always justifiably skeptical without justifiable archaeological evidence. The Bible is not history, but set in history. There are many ancient writings set in history with both real and mythical events and people. The Bible is one of those ancient collection of writings. Genesis is one of the books genuinely set in ancient mythology.

Except we then come up with evidence that says otherwise

 

[Salvador]

Pontius Pilate’s ring may have been discovered at ancient biblical fortress

Just another nail that keeps appearing again and again.

It's amazing, to me, how the information in the Gospels and letters are supported by facts that are discovered.

Some Archaeology findings might prove some aspects of some Biblical stories are somewhat based on certain historical facts, but there are some archaeology findings that refute some Biblical stories.

For instance, There is archaeological evidence that there was never any significant flood having occurred anywhere near the place of Noah's Ark alleged landing spot during the most recent 12,000 years.

The 12,000 year old Göbekli Tepe archaeological site is evidence of non-deluged land having existed in the region near Mount Ararat for several thousands of years.

As I've noted elsewhere in some other discussions about Christianity, Jesus's family tree has a time span of 77 generations listed between his generation and Adam whom the Bible claims was the "first man" and Eve whom the Bible alleges was the mother of everybody. Reference: (Luke 3:23-38) (Genesis 3:20)

However, the Australian aborigines have evidently been in Australia for over a thousand consecutive generations. Reference: Aboriginal Australians - Wikipedia

There have been hundreds of generations of Native Americans between the time their common ancestry migrated from Asia until the time of Christ.
Reference: Native Americans in the United States - Wikipedia

The Bible falsely claims there were only 77 generations between Christ and the first man; when people have indeed actually existed for thousands of generations, which proves the Bible and Christianity as being false.

Adam as being the first man and perpetrator of "original sin" is an important premise of Christianity. If Adam wasn't the first man, then there isn't actually any "origin sin". Jesus supposedly died on the Cross to save humankind from "original sin". If there isn't any "original sin" from which to be saved, then Jesus Christ's death on the Cross is pretty pointless and meaningless. Evidently, there were many generations of people prior to the 76th generation before Christ spawned by Adam. So then, Adam, Eve and original sin are mythological. There is neither any "first man" nor "original sin" throughout human evolution. Thus, Jesus Christ having died on the cross to save mankind from "original sin" is not reality but is rather quite mythological.

 

[shunyadragon]

Except we then come up with evidence that says otherwise

This incomplete statement gets you nowhere.

The historians and archaeologists come with the evidence. There are historical methods to verify and support historical facts and people in ancient writings, and 'arguing from ignorance' to justify the book of Genesis as historical is horrendously just not there. The account of Exodus is also severely problematic.

 

[David T]

Extremely well put.
The new testament is no ordinary historical fiction it is and a something else. Tolkien conveyed this to CS Lewis, but they are actual writers and artists, rather than just readers. So if someone goes "jesus is not real" thats clearly a reader. Kind of like creationists. Literalists, ID advocates, Ierrancy proponents in religion. Its all debates between readers is all, not artists not writers. Besides i am invlclined towards music much much older than writing art. And full of history, becomes legend, becomes myth, cycle, in just a single song.

 

[David T]

Extremely well put.
The new testament is no ordinary historical fiction it is and a something else. Tolkien conveyed this to CS Lewis, but they are actual writers and artists, rather than just readers. So if someone goes "jesus is not real" thats clearly a reader. Kind of like creationists. Literalists, ID advocates, Ierrancy proponents in religuon. Its all debates between readers is all, not artists not writers. Besudes i am invlined towards music much much older than writing art. And full of history, becomes legend, becomes myth, cycle, in just a single song.

 

[shunyadragon]

So many people say it is a fictional book

'So many people?!?!' This not meaningful. By the way even though set in history, and containing historical people and facts it indeed also contains fiction and ancient mythology.

 

[David T]

I remember when the atheists were taunting us because no record could be found confirming Pontius Pilate as a Roman official in any capacity. Those crickets stopped chirping when an inscription with his name was found near the excavated governors mansion in Jerusalem.

I don't doubt that much in the Bible is factual. Or at least -- as the movies say -- "based on facts". I just wonder if some of the key claims are also factual. Such as the seemingly key claim that a god exists.

I have a theology degree. There is zero evidence that religion is remotely clear on the topic itself.

Are you proposing they actually do know what they are talking about? Which version of god? there are about 40,000 versions inside christianity alone! Confronted with all those versions is religion clear on what they claim to be god suddenly? Hell they disagree internally even.

I put modern religion as out there beyond the physical. Which btw is identical to many modern cosmologies views including mathmatical realism, self contained reality, perpetual motion machine, there is no such thing as a free lunch, except for the cosmos nonsense. Normal, religious nutty, in secular drag Identical to religions god. What ever that might be.

 

[David T]

This incomplete statement gets you nowhere.

The historians and archaeologists come with the evidence. There are historical methods to verify and support historical facts and people in ancient writings, and 'arguing from ignorance' to justify the book of Genesis as historical is horrendously just not there. The account of Exodus is also severely problematic.

Well tolkien, said history, becomes legend, legend becomes myth! All story is rooted in someones experience. How thats written out and understood varies including science . From an artist perspective easy stuff. Everyone else not so much.

 

[Skwim]

Welcome to the real world:

(PhysOrg.com) -- Life's ability to replicate itself is essential for evolution, yet even the simplest kind of replication requires a relatively complex system. So what kind of non-replicating system might have served as the predecessor of evolution, paving the way for life as we know it? The answer, according to a recent study, is a kind of "prelife" -- a chemical system that can lead to information and diversity, and that is capable of selection and mutation, but does not yet have the ability to self-replicate.

In their study, Hisashi Ohtsuki of the Japan Science and Technology Agency and the Tokyo Institute of Technology, along with Martin Nowak of Harvard University, have investigated how evolution might have first begun. As the researchers explain, the origin of life is a transition from chemistry to biology, and has been widely studied. Here, Ohtsuki and Nowak have presented a model where a purely chemical system (prelife) becomes more efficient (catalytic prelife) and then builds the sequences needed for replication, finally resulting in life. Their work is published in a recent issue of Proceedings of the Royal Society B.

“As you know, the ability of replication is critical for life,” Ohtsuki told PhysOrg.com. “We can conceive several forms of life, such as prelife catalysts and replicators, as in our paper. We are interested in which form of life is most efficient and thus is selected in prelife (a soup of chemicals). The significance of our study is that we have mathematically shown for the first time that replicators, which have the ability to remain attached with a growing sequence, have a great advantage over the other forms of life. Replication is usually taken for granted in the study of evolution. We think that our result gives a justification of why replicators are so dominant.”

Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2009-09-evolution.html#jCp

And why do they use the word "might, conceive, we think"? because they're not sure. The leap of certainty you make simply isn't justified.

Not that this in the least absolves you of having made your unjustified leap, but I find it rather amusing that you're looking for company to share in your fondness for leaping to conclusions.


.

 

[Subduction Zone]

Oh, but it was in dispute once. In fact, Christians were told it was a total made up name, since no record of a prefect of that name could be found in Roman documentation of the time. This has happened a number of times, he Bible has been said to be in error, and archaeology or some other discipline proves it true.

Really? I have never heard any atheists make this claim. Do you have some evidence to support this claim? Right now it looks like a base canard.