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Okay Creationists, Explain These!
- Thread starter Skwim
- Start date
Yeah... uh no... Extensions of the coccyx, the triangular bone at the end of the sacral spine. It's what's left of the tail. Appearance of it is called atavism.
MrMrdevincamus
Voice Of The Martyrs Supporter
Not to stir things up but wouldn't those aberrations still be birth defects? I remember when my HS biology teacher threw me out of class for saying babies had gill slits...I had misread an article....lol ; {>
By today's standards, probably. But that doesn't negate the fact that they are an evolutionary trait explainable by geneticists and evolutionary biologists.
Milton Platt
Well-Known Member
Sure, anything that is out of the normal is called a birth defect. That does not change the fact that there is a gene in the human genome that when switched on produced a tail. The question I think the OP was getting at is why would a "creator" see the need to provide humans with that gene?
I can wiggle my ears a tiny bit.
Faithofchristian
Well-Known Member
Could be birth defects or fake pictures.
No more than two babies joined at the head or body's, just a birth defects.
No more than two babies joined at the head or body's, just a birth defects.
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
And what if I do? Will you agree? No, not at all. It is just another nail in the chasm dividing our beliefs.
Did you know that car makers use many parts that are exactly the same in different models?
Did you know that computer programmers use many many subroutines in different programs because they have already been written and debugged?
All living things, be they plant or animal, insect or flying things of higher order, use the cell to create their complex bodies. All, that I know of, use DNA programming to build their complex bodies.
Do you really find it strange that God would use a copy paste, plug in, type of design. Naturally, every kind would have its programming adjusted to fit its needs.
When then God caused our fall to impact our bodies so as to include illness - which doctors many times admit are due to DNA mutations, thereby admitting that a perfect type of code does exist for this section, is it any great mystery that if we can be born in severe cases with both genitals, with all kinds of deformities, with people sharing body parts, that some may be born with a tail.
You are too eagerly grabbing for straws to support your own beliefs. That is fine with me, it is but water on the back of a duck as far as I am concerned.
Depends on how we're defining birth defects anyway. If we're dealing with statistical aberrations, a POC with blue eyes is also a birth defect. In medicine the term birth defect is usually used interchangeably with congenital disorder, which has a negative connotation when referencing things which don't really harm the person, such as the aforementioned blue eyed POC.
However, there are actual accounts of tails on people causing problems with the back, since there isn't the muscular, cartilaginous or tendonous support systems that other animals have to keep nearby nerves and blood vessels in a stable state. So this would probably still qualify (though probably called a congenital deformity rather than a disorder.)
That seems a stretch. Mutations doesn't imply that what came before the mutation was better than what came after. The vast majority of mutations are neutral, and a good deal of mutations are beneficial. Nor are most illnesses caused by mutation (most are caused by microbiotic organisms).
It was a mutation which caused early apes to lose their tails, since they were no longer necessary for a largely non arboreal life. And it's a mutation which sometimes cause tails to reappear in apes.
Skwim
Veteran Member
It isn't that I think creationists can come up with a reasonable explanation, but the extent they go in trying to do so that's interesting, such as dancing around the issue with irrelevancies, like:
Thank you
.
Grandliseur
Well-Known Member
All things may be interpreted, atheists interpret things one way, creationists another, and so forth, at times individuals have their own slight of opinion on this.
Quoting: (WHO | Genes and human disease)
Dysfunctional gene behaviour is commonly termed as a mutation. These mutations are responsible for causing illnesses. Moreover, if the gene mutations exist in the egg or sperm cell, children can inherit the defective gene from their parents. Diseases can occur due to a defect in a single gene or in a set of genes. According to the degree of gene mutation, diseases are categorised into the following:
What we see here is that 'dysfunctional gene behavior, ergo, mutation, ergo, 'defect in a gene, or a set of genes' may cause disease. - Chromosomal diseases: occur when the entire chromosome, or large segments of a chromosome, is missing, duplicated or otherwise altered. Down Syndrome is a prominent example of a chromosomal abnormality.
- Single-gene disorders: occur when an alteration occurs in a gene causing one gene to stop working. An example of a single gene disorder is sickle-cell anaemia.
- Multifactorial disorders: occur as the result of mutations in multiple genes, frequently coupled with environmental causes. An example of a multifactorial disorder is diabetes.
- Mitochondrial disorders: are rare disorders caused by mutations in non-chromosomal DNA located within the mitochondria. (The mitochondria are subcellular organelles.) These disorders can be found to affect any part of the body including the brain and the muscles.
As seen from the above, not all individuals suffer from the same defect, and therefore from the same disease.
What is also seen is that when there is no defect, you have code that works without causing disease. In this then, it is my prerogative to interpret this as 'in the beginning, mankind's genetic code was without flaws.'
It is your prerogative to dissent.
God clearly used plug and play, copy paste, in many case with sometimes the code being changed a little to fit the organism it was inserted into. This is exactly how engineers work, be it mechanical, electrical, or computer programmers.
People who do not think God works in our reality have this right. They ignore the proof before their own eyes.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
It's not really a defect as it's in our genes.
We do have tail bones so it's not surprising to see in some cases tail still growing. It's just naturally phased out for the most part through the evolutionary process, but it hasn't completely gone away obviously.
It's not really a random mutation like birth defects although may be similar. Every person on the entire Earth has the genetics for tails. It's a question of dormancy and awakening the gene.
Twilight Hue
Twilight, not bright nor dark, good nor bad.
Keyword is 'may.' The article is not suggesting that all illnesses come from mutated genes, nor that all altered genes become defective. For example a mutation of LRP5 creates an amplified bone structure which is more resilient than those without that mutation. MMS: Error It is, in fact, a beneficial mutation and certainly not a disease. There are tons of such beneficial mutations which are new, not part of basal hominid history. Which would mean the idea of a 'pre-mutation perfect code' wouldn't work.All things may be interpreted, atheists interpret things one way, creationists another, and so forth, at times individuals have their own slight of opinion on this.
Quoting: (WHO | Genes and human disease)
Dysfunctional gene behaviour is commonly termed as a mutation. These mutations are responsible for causing illnesses. Moreover, if the gene mutations exist in the egg or sperm cell, children can inherit the defective gene from their parents. Diseases can occur due to a defect in a single gene or in a set of genes. According to the degree of gene mutation, diseases are categorised into the following:What we see here is that 'dysfunctional gene behavior, ergo, mutation, ergo, 'defect in a gene, or a set of genes' may cause disease.
- Chromosomal diseases: occur when the entire chromosome, or large segments of a chromosome, is missing, duplicated or otherwise altered. Down Syndrome is a prominent example of a chromosomal abnormality.
- Single-gene disorders: occur when an alteration occurs in a gene causing one gene to stop working. An example of a single gene disorder is sickle-cell anaemia.
- Multifactorial disorders: occur as the result of mutations in multiple genes, frequently coupled with environmental causes. An example of a multifactorial disorder is diabetes.
- Mitochondrial disorders: are rare disorders caused by mutations in non-chromosomal DNA located within the mitochondria. (The mitochondria are subcellular organelles.) These disorders can be found to affect any part of the body including the brain and the muscles.
As seen from the above, not all individuals suffer from the same defect, and therefore from the same disease.
What is also seen is that when there is no defect, you have code that works without causing disease. In this then, it is my prerogative to interpret this as 'in the beginning, mankind's genetic code was without flaws.'
It is your prerogative to dissent.
God clearly used plug and play, copy paste, in many case with sometimes the code being changed a little to fit the organism it was inserted into. This is exactly how engineers work, be it mechanical, electrical, or computer programmers.
People who do not think God works in our reality have this right. They ignore the proof before their own eyes.
