Oh no there's a homosexual in me!

[oracle]

I am surprised that no one has joined in this thread in support of Dr. Khan. Well, here is some support. Why is it that when someone condems homosexuality as a sin (as it is clearly stated in the Bible), then that person is labeled as a 'homophobe', or accused of hating homosexuals? If I tell someone they are sinning, it is not to harrass that person. It is showing my love for that person, to give them the chance of eternal life in heaven. It is to show them their sin, to bring them to repentance. Repentance is the way into heaven. We are commanded by God to love everyone, but to hate sin. I can love my children, but hate what they do. If I tell my children they are sinning, I am not harassing them, nor am I hating them; I am showing my love for them, as I want them to have eternal life in heaven. I feel very sad for people who find the idea of eternal life in heavenly bliss - no sickness, cares, or trouble of any kind - so distasteful that they would rather 'grab the sunblock'. All I can do is pray for you. There is so much more to say, but it's late so I'm done for now.

"Eternal life" in "heaven" has a much different meaning to me. I don't believe that heaven is a place. To me it is an ideal, and you can bring heaven into this life or you can make it hell. Hell to me is simply experiencing the consequence of ones actions, actions that cause suffering to oneself and everyone else around them. My definition of sin is causing harm to others. My definition of love is unity. I understand that grace is not conditional. Whether heterosexual or homo, its still sexuality, it's still human nature, and you cannot supress who you are inside.

Our perceptions of what is evil is not always accurate. But I see that real evil is inside the heart and inside the mind, and it is ultimately being selfish, ignorant, and lacking self-control.

 

[Quoth The Raven]

I am surprised that no one has joined in this thread in support of Dr. Khan. Well, here is some support. Why is it that when someone condems homosexuality as a sin (as it is clearly stated in the Bible), then that person is labeled as a 'homophobe', or accused of hating homosexuals? If I tell someone they are sinning, it is not to harrass that person. It is showing my love for that person, to give them the chance of eternal life in heaven. It is to show them their sin, to bring them to repentance. Repentance is the way into heaven. We are commanded by God to love everyone, but to hate sin. I can love my children, but hate what they do. If I tell my children they are sinning, I am not harassing them, nor am I hating them; I am showing my love for them, as I want them to have eternal life in heaven. I feel very sad for people who find the idea of eternal life in heavenly bliss - no sickness, cares, or trouble of any kind - so distasteful that they would rather 'grab the sunblock'. All I can do is pray for you. There is so much more to say, but it's late so I'm done for now.

Re read C1's post...she said she'd go for the sunblock rather than be an intolerant bigot.She's not saying your concept of heaven is distasteful, but rather that the actions and attitudes some people take in order to get there most certainly are.
There are plenty of homophobes that justify their standpoint using the bible, and it's not that old saw about loving the sinner while hating the sin; it's all about hating homosexuals and finding a handy justification.

 

[Feathers in Hair]

.
I'm sorry that there are those in society who harrass homosexuals.

Me, too... Oh, wait-

(From Dictionary.com)
ha·rass
tr.v. ha·rassed, ha·rass·ing, ha·rass·es

1. To irritate or torment persistently.
2. To wear out; exhaust.
3. To impede and exhaust (an enemy) by repeated attacks or raids.

I think the word I might be searching for is 'irony'. That's due to you saying you feel sorry that there are those in society that harass homosexuals, and yet it's clear in your posts (in this thread and in others) that you are the one doing the harassing, especially according to definition #3, which is what you are doing on this forum. What may be truth to you is an attack to others. The excuse 'but I'm not attacking' falls apart when other people are feeling attacked. I'm not even homosexual, but I feel that I am being attacked by your tirades against my friends. I also feel that you are being insulting toward my Christian friends by purpoting that your attitude is what Jesus believed.

Did you feel 'insulted' when someone suggested that Jesus might have been gay? If that's the case, why not say so? This would save a lot of arguing and dragging your Savior's name through the mud. (While personally I think it is a much greater attack on Jesus' character to say that he hates homosexuality than it is to say he might have been one, that's just me.)

Since I haven't fully moved yet, though, I'm still going to hope that you'll prove to be a kind and wonderful individual when I 'officially' come back.

 

[robtex]

. (While personally I think it is a much greater attack on Jesus' character to say that he hates homosexuality than it is to say he might have been one, that's just me.)

I would frubal you but I have to spread my karma around.

 

[Melody]

I've been staying out of this debate up to now because I'm conflicted on this topic but I'm going to take a stab at it.

As far as Jesus being a homosexual, I would doubt it. While homosexuality was a normal part of some cultures, my understanding of Jewish culture (limited though it may be) is that it was not acceptable. He would have been an outcast which would make it extremely difficult to gain a following as a rabbi. Consider how offended they were just by Him healing the sick on the Sabbath.

There are very few verses in the bible that speak about homosexuality (and only one in the NT I believe)...and even then they are vague and open to interpretation. My husband and I had a *long* discussion on this and I've listened to the arguments here on this forum and it certainly left me with some questions and doubts as to the more commonly held interpretation. Particularly when I combine it with Jesus' message of love, compassion and forgiveness.

I often wonder, if homosexuality is such an "abomination", why there is so little mention of it in the bible. In fact, there are far more verses condemning liars (notice it was mentioned in the above verse)...and not only do we tolerate them, but we elect them to our highest public offices...and put them in the pulpit.

So, is homosexuality a sin? I honestly don't know at this point, but I do know we are to be a reflection of Christ's light and, if I as a Christian, do not see evidence of Christ's love, compassion and tolerance from the "Christian" community, then how can the unbeliever see it?

If you believe homosexuality is a sin, then don't practice it....but it's not our place as Christians to judge and condemn others either. Live a Christ filled life, teach them about Christ when they ask, but teach them about His love and compassion and the salvation He offers....and then let God convict them on what is sin.

 

[Dr. Khan]

IF sin is tolerated, then why are you pointing out someone's speck in their eye? I don't think that it is so much as non-acceptable, I think heterosexuality or homosexuality does not apply. "Heaven" is non-sexual. However whether hetero or homo, we are sexual creatures, and our sexuality cannot be suppressed. Whether you are hetero or homo, you still have sexual thoughts and sin. Don't lie or pretend that you don't. People who suppress their sexuality and pretend that they don't have one usually end up with a psychological complex. And BTW all sin is the same in God's eyes.
So I don't understand why you point out a specific group of people and exclude the people outside of this group, when the sinful nature can apply to sexuality in general.

What's really sinful, is when you intentionally cause harm on others.

Please define the behavior that the bible specifically speaks of. In the OT, God promoted slaughter, so evidently that is not sinful by your definition.

You only perceive me to be pointing out a specific group of people. it is the central theme in this thread, since there are those who make sexuality and issue. It is nothing to me until you make it and issue. My concern is for those who want eternal life. Eternal life is something given to you while you live in this world and becomes the centerpeice of living for those who have it. When a person makes sexuality an issue in an attempt to persuade those who have already obtained eternal life as it is described in the bible
then it becomes an issue with me.

I will correct and rebuke those who try to turn the glory of our Lord Jesus in to a shame who belittle his sacrifice and accuse Christians for their own hardships simply because the behavior is not tolerated among those who have accepted the bible as it is written. My message to you is that I have found (eternal life; that unique quality that makes me understand that God himself is my deliverer)as it is written in the bible. That it is hidden and those who want it can have it,it's available. But don't try to tell me that you can't change because that is what the Kingdom of Heaven is all about. The first thing you notice when you receive Jesus is change. That this change takes over your entire life and recreates you after the image of him. Yes a male and a female you will remain, while you live in this world. "Male and female created he them"


My understanding is that homosexuality as described by Paul the apostle whom I have more respect for than any living is that it is wrong, period. My mind will never change from that. He goes on to say that those who are given up to these are lost and are become of reprobate mind when they cannot accept that which is right. Your arguement is with Paul, Jesus, Peter, John. The theme of the gospel.

The gospel is about the new creature whose first and foremost instinct is to worship, praise, adore, bless, honour, glorify, serve Jesus. And this continuously as you see Jesus is risen From the dead. Now that is the most remarkble thing about Him is that he is alive from the dead. His resurrection from the dead controls my life and I crucify my affections and lusts whatever they may be. Because my affections are set upon those things where Christ sits, which is at the right hand of power.

 

[Lycan]

I often wonder, if homosexuality is such an "abomination", why there is so little mention of it in the bible. In fact, there are far more verses condemning liars (notice it was mentioned in the above verse)...and not only do we tolerate them, but we elect them to our highest public offices...and put them in the pulpit.

Frubals to you!!!!

 

[Dr. Khan]

"Eternal life" in "heaven" has a much different meaning to me. I don't believe that heaven is a place. To me it is an ideal, and you can bring heaven into this life or you can make it hell. Hell to me is simply experiencing the consequence of ones actions, actions that cause suffering to oneself and everyone else around them. My definition of sin is causing harm to others. My definition of love is unity. I understand that grace is not conditional. Whether heterosexual or homo, its still sexuality, it's still human nature, and you cannot supress who you are inside.

Our perceptions of what is evil is not always accurate. But I see that real evil is inside the heart and inside the mind, and it is ultimately being selfish, ignorant, and lacking self-control.

The kingdom of heaven is within you. Jesus is the only one that can cause you to discover it. It is not and ideal but a real place. It is ruled by Jesus and he created this place for you. It is a place where the (seed of Abraham) out of the inhabitants of the earth shall jump off into the next age or dispensation, with God almighty himself who is our father.

Love suffers long and is kind, envieth not, vaunteth not it self, is not puffed up, is not unseemly, seeketh not her own, is`not easily provoked,thinketh no evil; rejoiceth not in iniquity, but in the truth; beareth all things, hopeth all things, endureth all things, believeth all things, love never fails.

Love may seek to unite with all things but for all things to become like love. Now for all things to unite with love they all must take on all the characteristics of love.



You can not only can supress who you are but you can destroy who you are by the power of God. This is the most amazing miracle, is the tremendous change that can come as a result of believing the word of God. All things are possible with God. And it is written "as a man thinketh in his heart so is he."

That's what the Kingdom of Heaven is all about "man" you can be what you want by the power of God. Jesus came to give us power.


With this knowledge in me, you can see, that I seriously question anyone who says he cannot change. I say that person has never met Jesus. That he doesen't want to change, (I noticed this about myself). Change is hard, the reason is that we do not know what we shall become and we don't even know if it is worth it until we see the change.


"We do not know what we shall be but we do know that when He shall appear we shall be like him for we shall see him as he is."

Now we are changed by the exceeding great and precious promises which contain the divine nature of God.

 

[Lycan]

I am surprised that no one has joined in this thread in support of Dr. Khan. Well, here is some support. Why is it that when someone condems homosexuality as a sin (as it is clearly stated in the Bible), then that person is labeled as a 'homophobe', or accused of hating homosexuals? If I tell someone they are sinning, it is not to harrass that person. It is showing my love for that person, to give them the chance of eternal life in heaven. It is to show them their sin, to bring them to repentance. Repentance is the way into heaven. We are commanded by God to love everyone, but to hate sin. I can love my children, but hate what they do. If I tell my children they are sinning, I am not harassing them, nor am I hating them; I am showing my love for them, as I want them to have eternal life in heaven. I feel very sad for people who find the idea of eternal life in heavenly bliss - no sickness, cares, or trouble of any kind - so distasteful that they would rather 'grab the sunblock'. All I can do is pray for you. There is so much more to say, but it's late so I'm done for now.

This is something that so annoys me about some christians...
First, if the person being preached at is a christian then they should already know everything they do is a sin. Second, if the person being preached at is not a christian but believes in the god of the bible, they too, should already know everything they do is a sin.
Third, if the person being preached at is not a christian and does not subscribe to the concept of sin, then you are wasting your breath because the point is moot because they don't "sin".

And on the point of "I do it to show I love the person being preached at".... A. They are probably happy in the path they follow or they would seek you out. B. Stop being so arrogant to think that your spiritual truth is their spiritual truth. C. Why is it so hard to let your god do his job, instead of insisting that he needs christians to do it?

I have no problem with people discussing faith (obviously ) what I do have a problem with is any person trying to tell me that I am doing something wrong according to their faith. If I do not believe as you then leave me out of judgements and condemnation.

 

[jewscout]

The kingdom of heaven is within you. Jesus is the only one that can cause you to discover it.

Oh so that's how it's done? Silly me:areyoucra

 

[Lycan]

You can not only can supress who you are but you can destroy who you are by the power of God.

Do you actually believe your god wants this?

 

[Dr. Khan]

Well, if he doesn't understand that homosexuality is sinful, it's certainly not from lack of people telling him so. And if God's not in the business of listening to sinners, then why the hell is ANYONE on their knees praying?

Read John chapter 9:31

 

[Dr. Khan]

This is something that so annoys me about some christians...
First, if the person being preached at is a christian then they should already know everything they do is a sin. Second, if the person being preached at is not a christian but believes in the god of the bible, they too, should already know everything they do is a sin.
Third, if the person being preached at is not a christian and does not subscribe to the concept of sin, then you are wasting your breath because the point is moot because they don't "sin".

And on the point of "I do it to show I love the person being preached at".... A. They are probably happy in the path they follow or they would seek you out. B. Stop being so arrogant to think that your spiritual truth is their spiritual truth. C. Why is it so hard to let your god do his job, instead of insisting that he needs christians to do it?

I have no problem with people discussing faith (obviously ) what I do have a problem with is any person trying to tell me that I am doing something wrong according to their faith. If I do not believe as you then leave me out of judgements and condemnation.

If you believe different then why should another's belief disturb you so.

Take for example "I revell in the knowledge that say 98% of the 1.3 billion muslims in the world believe that the Christian and the Jew is the infidel. "

It defines their position and confirms to me that they need Jesus. To which I am happy to supply. We (the christian and the muslim are at war) opposed to each other, we are different in many ways. Many of them hate my existance as a christian and would like to see me converted to islam or die. I hate that they are muslim and I want them to change; I'm waiting for them to change as soon as they understand what I want for them. Eternal life. I do not hate them, just because I want them to change and accept Jesus. I love them "because you shall love your neighhbor as yourself" And from the day I was filled with the Holy Ghost to this day, and forever, I wish that this (which is for all them that believe) would be given to everyone living in the world today.

No matter who you are Jesus wants you to be filled with the Holy Ghost!!!

 

[Dr. Khan]

Do you actually believe your god wants this?

Take up your cross and follow me, is what Jesus said, deny yourself." Destroy your will accept mines" He is asking you to trust him.

The bible says that he endured the cross and the contrdiction of sinners despising the shame for the joy that was set before him. Which is the right hand of God, angels and principalities and powers being made subject to him.

He desires the same thing for us.

 

[Dr. Khan]

LL, brings up a good point... I thought your religion taught that EVERYONE, including the holier-than-thous, are sinners? Are you saying that your God listens to no one?

John9:31

I do not speak in defence for the holier thatn thous nor continual sinners.

I speak only in defence of the gospel of Jesus Christ

 

[Dr. Khan]

Hi, Dr Khan,
PART QUOTE]:
Saint Basil the Great"PART QUOTE]

I am not sure that your reply to Prima is in the manner befitting a Christian - according to the above, as I see it.

Perhaps this might also apply ?

Matthew 7:1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye

I am not subject to the words of a certain basil as It is written he that is spiritual judgeth all things yet himself is judged of no man. 1Corinthians 2:15

And let him that is least among you be your judges.

 

[Dr. Khan]

Me, too... Oh, wait-

(From Dictionary.com)
ha·rass
tr.v. ha·rassed, ha·rass·ing, ha·rass·es

1. To irritate or torment persistently.
2. To wear out; exhaust.
3. To impede and exhaust (an enemy) by repeated attacks or raids.

I think the word I might be searching for is 'irony'. That's due to you saying you feel sorry that there are those in society that harass homosexuals, and yet it's clear in your posts (in this thread and in others) that you are the one doing the harassing, especially according to definition #3, which is what you are doing on this forum. What may be truth to you is an attack to others. The excuse 'but I'm not attacking' falls apart when other people are feeling attacked. I'm not even homosexual, but I feel that I am being attacked by your tirades against my friends. I also feel that you are being insulting toward my Christian friends by purpoting that your attitude is what Jesus believed.

Did you feel 'insulted' when someone suggested that Jesus might have been gay? If that's the case, why not say so? This would save a lot of arguing and dragging your Savior's name through the mud. (While personally I think it is a much greater attack on Jesus' character to say that he hates homosexuality than it is to say he might have been one, that's just me.)

Since I haven't fully moved yet, though, I'm still going to hope that you'll prove to be a kind and wonderful individual when I 'officially' come back.

A lot of people are going to feel that they are come under attack from Dr. Khan.


You see I am destroying every thing, and every institution in this world which comes in direct contradiction to the Lord Jesus preparing the way, making it straight, and smooth, tearing down the mountians and filling in the valleys.

This is what I see in Isaiah chapter 25. I shall magnify these words until they are made glorious in everyone's eyes.

Already I sing chapter 26 to the nineth verse

This mountain I command that it be cast into the sea. Mark 11:22-23

 

[robtex]

You see I am destroying every thing, and every institution in this world which comes in direct contradiction to the Lord Jesus preparing the way, making it straight, and smooth, tearing down the mountians and filling in the valleys.
This is what I see in Isaiah chapter 25. I shall magnify these words until they are made glorious in everyone's eyes.
Already I sing chapter 26 to the nineth verse
This mountain I command that it be cast into the sea. Mark 11:22-23

Your JC's muscle?

 

[jewscout]

Your JC's muscle?

only if you choose to believe that poor interpretation of Isaiah 25 and 26:1-9:sarcastic

 

[Lycan]

If you believe different then why should another's belief disturb you so.

comments like this:

Take for example "I revell in the knowledge that say 98% of the 1.3 billion muslims in the world believe that the Christian and the Jew is the infidel. "

It defines their position and confirms to me that they need Jesus.
To which I am happy to supply. We (the christian and the muslim are at war) opposed to each other, we are different in many ways. Many of them hate my existance as a christian and would like to see me converted to islam or die. I hate that they are muslim and I want them to change; I'm waiting for them to change as soon as they understand what I want for them. Eternal life. I do not hate them, just because I want them to change and accept Jesus. I love them "because you shall love your neighhbor as yourself" And from the day I was filled with the Holy Ghost to this day, and forever, I wish that this (which is for all them that believe) would be given to everyone living in the world today.
No matter who you are Jesus wants you to be filled with the Holy Ghost!!!