Non-theism is more complicated than disbelief

[SabahTheLoner]

Non-theism doesn't necessarily mean that the idea of god is completely rejected, just as in atheism, rather it is a position that rejects popular theistic claims as to what a god is. I used to be a strong atheist and then I started becoming more agnostic the more I've heard about how people veiw God (or the equivalent in their religion). Some of them I found possible. I never quite understood the Abrahamic concept of monotheism. I could be considered an atheist still because I don't believe in a supreme entity.

The world and universe are made of a balance of separate particles and states of both matter and energy. If that is a system which God is, I can only conclude that God is a cognate to the name Universe. Perhaps the Earth, just as valid a name. However if that were the case, God would be a name. What kind of a name, it depends on how you feel about it.

Personally I find that such a concept of a God is rather bleak. If God is the Universe, why do we still have disbelievers and things that we wouldn't attribute to God? And is a God a void? The only thing in the universe that is literally everywhere is space. Yes, you could argue that atoms and quarks are everywhere too. But not quite. Atoms are only present where there is matter, and atoms have different properties and are made up of some quarks, which can be classified in over a dozen verities. Honestly the only way I can imagine everything being God is if God was space in everything. This would mean the essense of God is not conscious and requires human mentality to become aware. And even then it is a paradoxical state of non-existence within existence.

So if God, in the monotheistic or pantheistic ideal, can be conceptualized variably, why can't many gods? In addition to agnostic and atheist, I do consider myself a polytheist. Every god can exist by way of mental acceptance. By that logic, Yahweh is more than alive. But so is Odin, Vishnu, Set, Satan and Gaia. I don't have to believe in them, because they existed for a long while just being imagined, experienced and honored (sometimes even dishonored) by man. Yahweh is not my god, however Yahweh can exist around me. Just because I don't believe doesn't mean that it's untrue, I can believe nonsense and despite insisting it's true, it can be entirely false. The tricky thing with Deity is that we don't know. The definition can mold accordingly. The truth here lies within mind, acceptance, spirit and attitude.

This is both unsettling and comforting. We can control our beliefs. However this also means we can believe in lies, especially when confronted with something we don't wish to believe in.

I'm an atheist because there are concepts around deity I don't accept, and I'm not a literalist. I'm agnostic because I believe deity can be proven or disproven at any time, and I don't know what the outcome of that would be. I'm polytheistic because deity can exist in various forms and I do accept multiple concepts as well as avatars. This can be summed up as a non-theistic worldview despite the precence of deity.

If you are a non-theist, why is that? If you don't consider yourself a non-theist and happen to be reading the thread, what is your concept of deity?

 

[Twilight Hue]

Non-theism doesn't necessarily mean that the idea of god is completely rejected, just as in atheism, rather it is a position that rejects popular theistic claims as to what a god is. I used to be a strong atheist and then I started becoming more agnostic the more I've heard about how people veiw God (or the equivalent in their religion). Some of them I found possible. I never quite understood the Abrahamic concept of monotheism. I could be considered an atheist still because I don't believe in a supreme entity.

The world and universe are made of a balance of separate particles and states of both matter and energy. If that is a system which God is, I can only conclude that God is a cognate to the name Universe. Perhaps the Earth, just as valid a name. However if that were the case, God would be a name. What kind of a name, it depends on how you feel about it.

Personally I find that such a concept of a God is rather bleak. If God is the Universe, why do we still have disbelievers and things that we wouldn't attribute to God? And is a God a void? The only thing in the universe that is literally everywhere is space. Yes, you could argue that atoms and quarks are everywhere too. But not quite. Atoms are only present where there is matter, and atoms have different properties and are made up of some quarks, which can be classified in over a dozen verities. Honestly the only way I can imagine everything being God is if God was space in everything. This would mean the essense of God is not conscious and requires human mentality to become aware. And even then it is a paradoxical state of non-existence within existence.

So if God, in the monotheistic or pantheistic ideal, can be conceptualized variably, why can't many gods? In addition to agnostic and atheist, I do consider myself a polytheist. Every god can exist by way of mental acceptance. By that logic, Yahweh is more than alive. But so is Odin, Vishnu, Set, Satan and Gaia. I don't have to believe in them, because they existed for a long while just being imagined, experienced and honored (sometimes even dishonored) by man. Yahweh is not my god, however Yahweh can exist around me. Just because I don't believe doesn't mean that it's untrue, I can believe nonsense and despite insisting it's true, it can be entirely false. The tricky thing with Deity is that we don't know. The definition can mold accordingly. The truth here lies within mind, acceptance, spirit and attitude.

This is both unsettling and comforting. We can control our beliefs. However this also means we can believe in lies, especially when confronted with something we don't wish to believe in.

I'm an atheist because there are concepts around deity I don't accept, and I'm not a literalist. I'm agnostic because I believe deity can be proven or disproven at any time, and I don't know what the outcome of that would be. I'm polytheistic because deity can exist in various forms and I do accept multiple concepts as well as avatars. This can be summed up as a non-theistic worldview despite the precence of deity.

If you are a non-theist, why is that? If you don't consider yourself a non-theist and happen to be reading the thread, what is your concept of deity?

When you really think about it the only place where God or theism in general originates from, is ourselves.

There is nothing else found anywhere in the known universe outside our own mind that would indicate or reflect that it's the case upon which the ideology behind theism is built.

To me , theism is a form of mental interpretation of our environment and surroundings for which it's been subsequently embellished and fabricated over the course of time to suit emotional needs as it applies to the unknown making theism a composition of various mentally introduced ideologies whereas non theism is not introduced, which is a significant point to me.

In all actuality and reality, people are born neutral, void of the concepts of God and theism for which a response is not even required to address it.

I'm non-theistic because if you take away the mental embellishments and fabrications extrapolated from our environment and surroundings, and let it speak on its own terms without allowing our own thoughts and interpretations to get in the way, the answers become clear as to how things actually and really are.

 

[idav]

Non-theism doesn't necessarily mean that the idea of god is completely rejected, just as in atheism, rather it is a position that rejects popular theistic claims as to what a god is. I used to be a strong atheist and then I started becoming more agnostic the more I've heard about how people veiw God (or the equivalent in their religion). Some of them I found possible. I never quite understood the Abrahamic concept of monotheism. I could be considered an atheist still because I don't believe in a supreme entity.

The world and universe are made of a balance of separate particles and states of both matter and energy. If that is a system which God is, I can only conclude that God is a cognate to the name Universe. Perhaps the Earth, just as valid a name. However if that were the case, God would be a name. What kind of a name, it depends on how you feel about it.

Personally I find that such a concept of a God is rather bleak. If God is the Universe, why do we still have disbelievers and things that we wouldn't attribute to God? And is a God a void? The only thing in the universe that is literally everywhere is space. Yes, you could argue that atoms and quarks are everywhere too. But not quite. Atoms are only present where there is matter, and atoms have different properties and are made up of some quarks, which can be classified in over a dozen verities. Honestly the only way I can imagine everything being God is if God was space in everything. This would mean the essense of God is not conscious and requires human mentality to become aware. And even then it is a paradoxical state of non-existence within existence.

So if God, in the monotheistic or pantheistic ideal, can be conceptualized variably, why can't many gods? In addition to agnostic and atheist, I do consider myself a polytheist. Every god can exist by way of mental acceptance. By that logic, Yahweh is more than alive. But so is Odin, Vishnu, Set, Satan and Gaia. I don't have to believe in them, because they existed for a long while just being imagined, experienced and honored (sometimes even dishonored) by man. Yahweh is not my god, however Yahweh can exist around me. Just because I don't believe doesn't mean that it's untrue, I can believe nonsense and despite insisting it's true, it can be entirely false. The tricky thing with Deity is that we don't know. The definition can mold accordingly. The truth here lies within mind, acceptance, spirit and attitude.

This is both unsettling and comforting. We can control our beliefs. However this also means we can believe in lies, especially when confronted with something we don't wish to believe in.

I'm an atheist because there are concepts around deity I don't accept, and I'm not a literalist. I'm agnostic because I believe deity can be proven or disproven at any time, and I don't know what the outcome of that would be. I'm polytheistic because deity can exist in various forms and I do accept multiple concepts as well as avatars. This can be summed up as a non-theistic worldview despite the precence of deity.

If you are a non-theist, why is that? If you don't consider yourself a non-theist and happen to be reading the thread, what is your concept of deity?

I consider myself non-theist pantheist.
I like the part where your saying God needs humans to be conscious. I think there is a sort of ego the brain produces convincing itself of its self importance. Knowing why this isn't true is a way to break the barriers down between us and everything else. People often talk of enlightenment to free ourselves from bondage but there are so many explanations of this enlightenment. With Buddhism there is a more simpler explanation of "enlightenment" that isn't talked about often enough. Which is simply knowing that the reality we see is far more complex and powerful, probably than we can even fathom. It's that illusion that says I am me and there cannot be an awareness outside of 'I'. As science shows, the me is actuallly a collection of many as a whole sort of centralized and I believe all those quirks and atoms and what have you, do the exact same thing at the micro levels. Your correct matter is just a small part of it but even that was "one", at some point, with all the rest of the universe we are still discovering. That makes sense to me when you say "even then it's a paradoxal state", that's what allows a choice in the matter.

 

[RedDragon94]

By that logic, Yahweh is more than alive. But so is Odin, Vishnu, Set, Satan and Gaia. I don't have to believe in them, because they existed for a long while just being imagined, experienced and honored (sometimes even dishonored) by man. Yahweh is not my god, however Yahweh can exist around me. Just because I don't believe doesn't mean that it's untrue, I can believe nonsense and despite insisting it's true, it can be entirely false.

You almost sound henotheistic.

If you are a non-theist, why is that? If you don't consider yourself a non-theist and happen to be reading the thread, what is your concept of deity?

Incorporeal spirit. Both immanent and transcendent. Within and without nature.

 

[osgart]

Prime reality must be as troublesome as this reality. Prime reality is uncaused, and everything in this universe depends on it.
Evil must have always existed in prime reality as well. Perhaps there are aspiring God's, but far from achieving that, they ended up making us.

They would study us, to see how life transpires on its own. They would never interfere in our lives because they are not divine or stand to lose too much if they did interfere. If there are eternal beings, than knowledge is their goal, not necessarily justice.

 

[LuisDantas]

If you are a non-theist, why is that? If you don't consider yourself a non-theist and happen to be reading the thread, what is your concept of deity?

I am non-theistic because I don't think god-concepts are generally worth the trouble of using them (at least for me personally).

Deity concepts are both highly personal - to the point of actual freestyle - and ultimately unimportant, IMO. Useful tools in certain situations, but very toxic when raised to undue emphasis. Some day, hopefully not far in the future, people will routinely describe themselves as apatheistic and/or ignostic far more often than they claim, say, agnosticism.

Come to think of it, is there already a world to "chaos-theism"? The stance that matters of god-belief are not worth of a fully formed stance?

 

[RedDragon94]

what is your concept of deity?

• Exists within creation (Omnipresent) but is not of creation (Most High).
• Transcendent (in heaven) and immanent (dwells in the hearts of certain people).
• Sovereign (100% in control) and yet gracious (allows for free will).
• Loving (accept people for who they are) but not immoral (he loves justice).

Christianity, at its root, is parodoxical.