Well you shouldn't spread right wing disinformation.
Explain. Why is making sure there are business environments safe from a deadly virus not pro life?
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No more babies being delivered at NY hospital
- Thread starter Kenny
- Start date
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
No. Here's an example of anti-vax nonsense
A new study shows how to make 70% of anti-vaxxers change their mind on vaccination
A new study has shown it's possible to persuade members of our community who oppose vaccines to change their opinion by confronting them with the costs of their hesitation.
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No one. Should be in a position to convince others of healthcare decisions but their doctors, possibly loved ones, and the patients involved.
It's negative for any person pro/anti, vaccinated, or unvaccinated to spread disinformation. That was never political until people started taking sides to get others to get the vaccine. Thanks to the US government and media, there's a whole war of people trying to convert the unvaccinated.
It's not disinformation.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
A lot of the problems vaccines (adverse side effects for example) are on the CDC site. The experts try to keep track of problems that arise in the vaccines but any opinions based on these facts, well, that's a touch and go.
So when re you going to change your mind?
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This only works if those people ever get around to asking their doctor.
Do you have a doctor? Have you asked about the vaccines yet?
No, it was political when naysayers made it political. Those who want the eliminate Covid are on the right side of all the issues. The dispute isn't Coke versus Pepsi. It's life or death.
I know. You don't seem to be listening because you've said so many untrue things and have beliefs that are contrary to facts.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Of course not. This is my point though. Misinformation and nonesense such as antivax stuff leads to unnecessary arguments rather than debates.
Yes, I actually do. . I go to two doctors for chronic illnesses. I didn't ask because I'm not getting vaccinated. Good doctors won't convince a patient otherwise. That aside, healthy people wouldn't need to go to their doctor. It's a judgement call but ideally one would if its concerning their health and their loved ones health too.
When anti/pro vaxers are determined by political parties, it is political.
No. It's just that the majority sides with civil duty and a lot of what is on media and government supports their consensus. How can they see otherwise when the facts support their opinions?
So you can't even convince yourself that your arguments are reasonable.
What is there to debate about? We citizens follow expert advice. That's it. We aren't experts. The only way to debate is we lay people citing what experts say, that's it. We have no opinion on the matters. If you aren't an expert, and you don't accept expert advice, then you're wrong.
In this discussion the reasonable and wise have responded to disinformation and opinions that ignore experts. That is the nature of the USA today, and it seems most Western nations have the same problem to varying degrees. I suspect modern civilization is going to have mounting problems because there are too many unreasonable citizens who deny the facts and probable future disasters.
Wow, so all the talk about asking your doctor for advice is something you don't even do.
The pro vaccination people are deferring to expert advice. You suggested people do research, right? Research what, what non-experts say? Might as well get advice from your mechanic.
You color this as if Covid isn't that bad, and Democrats are just pushing vaccination to appease the base. As I noted, you don't have a clear understanding of anything that involves any part of Covid, vaccinations, and why there is disinformation. You have a right wing slant to your view, and while it isn't extreme, it prevents you from understanding any of the real circumstances at hand.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
What do you mean? I use the same arguments for not taking any vaccine and medication. Go to your doctor.
Yes, but antivax nonsense is not something experts would talk about if they went by medical ethics.
Probably. Most citizens are just going to work and taking care of loved ones vaxed or not. I don't see how their opinions do anything unless, maybe, through voting or they are activists or something or other. People's opinions can't cause damage. People's actions can though.
Unless I need to. It depends on if new symptoms pop up, if I have a health concern bothering me, or having a regular check up. Other than that, no. Doctors have other patients to see that need their help.
My comment said the provax argument is political when it associates one's vaccination status with political parties.
This is a good example of connecting the pandemic to political parties.
Once you get away from politics and talk about health then it would be easier to talk-I hope.
You suggest going to your doctor for advice to get vaccinated.
You go to your doctor and don't bother asking. You decided not to vaccinate on your own.
You don't even follow your own suggestion.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Why would I go to my doctor to ask to get vaccinated?
That doesn't make sense... he'd look at me funny if I told him I choose not to vaccinate but I want to ask you if I should.
If I guessed, my conditions and medicines so looked up doesn't prevent me from getting the vaccine. However, since I don't take medical advice from CDC experts, I would ask my doctor if I were that concerned.
This has nothing to do with the vaccine in general. This is for ANY medical related topic or problem.
Like I said: healthy people more than likely don't need to talk to their doctors, if they have one. AND it's important if they were concerned.
Not sure why you're making healthcare choices about the vaccine though.
metis
aged ecumenical anthropologist
We live under mandates all the time and in many different areas, and this is the price we must logically pay for living in a "society". Not doing so would mean literally everything would be a fee-for-all = anarchy.
The vaccine and mask mandates are pro-life, and to oppose them is to be pro-death. We know with absolute certainty the vaccines and the masks can and have saved lives, although nothing is perfect [correction: some say I'm a perfect _______, but I'll let you fill in the blanks
]. The reality is this got almost instantly politicized, and then it has morphed from there with all sorts of excuses as to why not mandate the shot and/or the masks, even though it's been done for many decades now with numerous other infectious organisms. In the past, we took them without being politicized, and by doing so it gradually increased life expectancy and reduced infant mortality.
The problem is with not the science nor the scientists but with the political talking-heads that put their political future ahead of even this country's children. Jesus said "Bring the littles ones unto me..." not "Don't bother worrying about children, just make certain you get reelected through any means possible".
IMO, character matters, and protecting this nation's children should be a top priority.
You know why. You've already posted it. Expert advice so the average person isn't on the internet reading nonsense about side effects and tracking devices.
I don't know what your problems are, but you seem confused and afraid of something.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Tracking devices?
What do you mean by that?
Side and adverse effects are good reasons to go to your doctor IF you're concerned. COVID vaccine is no different.
I know personally I wouldn't take CDC as doctors advice. In the US there's a clause that online resources are for informational purposes only.
If people substitute doctors advice for CDC that's totally on that person. No health expert will tell you to forgo your doctor cause you get all you need from authoritative sources.
I'd totally feel it's unsafe to use CDC as a substitute
And
So far we know the adverse effects are rare so
No hurt in taking the vaccine.
It's people's personal choice as to if they take it and why.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
"My choice my body", applies to both pro/anti vax (if making it political). What would provax do if they were forced to take the vaccine IF they did not want to?
If you already want to, you won't feel forced. If not, that would be different.
If you already want to, you won't feel forced. If not, that would be different.
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
I have a friend who believes that Bill Gates put microchips in the vaccines so the Illumati can track us all. Maybe that's what that poster was referring to?
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
The thing is that your choice can affect other peoples' bodies as well.
Why do they never suspect him of putting microchips
or nanobots in Ivermectin, hydroxychloroquine, bleach,
or the other various miracle cures of fringe medicine?
SkepticThinker
Veteran Member
Good question.
I'm wondering when they're going to realize that if they have a cell phone, they've already been carrying around a tracking device all along.
Well, funny that you should mention that. One friendGood question.
I'm wondering when they're going to realize that if they have a cell phone, they've already been carrying around a tracking device all along.
who's an Ivermection & hydroxychloroquine fan won't
carry his cell phone because not only can they track
him, but it will also cause cancer.
He's hard to get ahold of by phone.
Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
Seriously?? All I said was check with your doctor if you're concerned about the vaccine.
Weird. My coworker believes in the 3G theory and my mother new world order. I don't think it's completely online since they would have to really search cause of censorship. My coworker also has a biblical perspective. She said it's the start of the tribulation where the bible foretold numerous world wide events before judgement day.
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Unveiled Artist
Veteran Member
I don't see that being overnight. One morning I'm fine and the next a ticking time bomb. I see risk of spread more associated to having close people contact, not washing hands, etc. But we can't control getting covid. Vaccinated people can spread the virus too. The severity depends on the other person's overall health not vaccination status.