• Welcome to Religious Forums, a friendly forum to discuss all religions in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Our modern chat room. No add-ons or extensions required, just login and start chatting!
    • Access to private conversations with other members.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

No more babies being delivered at NY hospital

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Teachers are forced to do many things.
What's odd is that they seize upon this one thing,
a thing that's useful in curbing a pandemic, as
their line in the sand against government control.

Teachers....where I live, they're all Democrats &
pro-union. They love having government control
others...& raising their taxes.
It seems that when a little useful control comes in
their direction, all a sudden they become anarchists.
That is interesting! Hmmm... humans can be so complicated. :D Is this evolution? :D
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Another resource
Why won’t some health care workers get vaccinated? - Harvard Health


People keep saying: listen to the facts facts facts/misinformation/listening to science like it's a magic wand (even though medical professionals know the facts than someone who isn't a medic), if they don't have inherent trust then they can know the facts all they want but that's just not going to keep.

Edit.
How many people would take the vaccine given what we know "and" don't know if they weren't doing it to help others?
I got the vaccine this spring. It was after millions had taken it with very few problems or effects. The worst effects are typically after the second shot and the body's immune system responds to create antibodies against the Covid virus. Pfizer is now FDA approved. There have been few problems. So what remains as a reason for people to be afraid of the vaccine? What are they hearing that makes them worry about the vaccine that is WORSE than the effects of Covid?

Having had both the vaccine and Covid I'll say that Covid is a lot worse. I lost 2 weeks of work, lost training which will probably ruin my racing goals for this fall, and just the suffering that comes from being ill. Imagine how much worse Covid would have been for me had I not vaccinated . From my experience I can understand why of all the people getting infected the unvaccinated get Covid much worse and end up in hospitals, if there's room.
 

Revoltingest

Pragmatic Libertarian
Premium Member
That is interesting! Hmmm... humans can be so complicated. :D Is this evolution? :D
It all resulted from evolution.
I don't know what's happening right now,
when critters are aware of evolution, &
can influence how it will proceed.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Imagine the stress of people who face being infected by non-vaccinated people in their work place. If a person can't feel safe at work then their stress will be very high. I keep hearing concerns about people who don't want to wear a mask or get a vaccines as if they are under some threat somehow or being infringed upon. This is an ideological issue, and they are getting a lot of attention. For this ideological view there's little respect given to those who fear being infected by non-vaccinated and non-masked people. This is anti-social, anti-science, and anti-reason.

That's like saying people care more about the patients but not about those that are treating them.

But do you "know" their situation to determine if the threat was warranted or not? Mask is a different story. It's just a piece of fabric. So that can't compare to those who don't mind wearing a mask but do not want to take the vaccine. Both masks and vaccine issues are not always synonymous with each other.

Disrespect is fine for people who want to harbor that hate, but if the staff that are treating patients aren't treated fairly, why would they want to keep their jobs?

If you didn't have an intrinsic motivation to get vaccinated, would you because you are pressured or receive bonus incentives?

Why isn't being safer from Covid enough motivation? Right wing disinformation. Why isn't the goal of heard immunity enough motivation? Right wing disinformation. Why isn't public health something that is an interest and duty for all citizens? Right wing rhetoric complaining about individual freedom. They never mention the personal responsibility a citizen has to the society they rely on.

When you generalize the world population as if everyone is in dire need to get the vaccine, there's a problem. Of course people want to be safe from COVID just not all people see it as a life/death situation as their peer across the world would.

I wouldn't blame it on political parties, though. People make healthcare decisions without needing to affiliate it with democratic and republican views.

That would mean No democrat believes in personal freedom in their healthcare choices?
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
If I were a mother-to-be, I would not want anti-medicine disease spreaders anywhere need me and my baby.

Those "nurses" and others who hate medicine need to find another career that does not so directly endanger those who need real nursing.
I wouldn't take it to the extreme radicalism that they hate medicine... they are in the medical profession. I also wouldn't assume that they are spreading disease. If you are a nurse and you are coughing, have a fever or even have the sense off taste gone, you automatically stay home because you don't want to spread disease. It is their nature.

So, no, I don't think nurses are psychopathic in nature.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
Or 43 ICUs being so full that someone dies because of all of those who thought they were non-coughing, non-fever BUT COVID sick disease spreaders.
With nurses quoting, it will be 100 ICU's not available because there is no one to attend them.
 

F1fan

Veteran Member
Whatever the logic is, when push comes to shove, there will be reverberating consequences to where, perhaps, we can find other alternatives. What will be weightier? A non-coughing, no-fever unvaccinated person or a ruptured appendix that won't be addressed because the medical profession quit.
Imagine if more citizens got vaccinated this summer and this curbed Covid to a degree that hospitals weren't full of Covid patients. The overall stress on society and healthcare people would be vastly lower.

So the questions are: is the fear of being vaccinated at this point of millions of successful injections justified? Is opposition to wearing masks in public when infections are spiking justified?
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
I got the vaccine this spring. It was after millions had taken it with very few problems or effects. The worst effects are typically after the second shot and the body's immune system responds to create antibodies against the Covid virus. Pfizer is now FDA approved. There have been few problems. So what remains as a reason for people to be afraid of the vaccine? What are they hearing that makes them worry about the vaccine that is WORSE than the effects of Covid?

Having had both the vaccine and Covid I'll say that Covid is a lot worse. I lost 2 weeks of work, lost training which will probably ruin my racing goals for this fall, and just the suffering that comes from being ill. Imagine how much worse Covid would have been for me had I not vaccinated . From my experience I can understand why of all the people getting infected the unvaccinated get Covid much worse and end up in hospitals, if there's room.

Where you at high risk of catching COVID?

For example, my friend told me yesterday her friend couldn't see her former wife's children (they're divorced and get visitation rights) because her friend's family all got COVID-and even more so, even though her own son was sick and asked for the vaccine, the mother didn't want to give it to him.

Now, they, are at a high risk so getting the vaccine would have been appropriate (my friend got the vaccine but is waiting until they approve it for her children). Unfortunately, the former wife got mad and threatened to come near them to spread the disease.

That's totally different than most unvaccinated people's situation. It really is because a lot of people are indifferent to it in those regards unless they loose their job over it among other reasons.

But, yes, of course COVID is worse than side effects. A lot of people don't take it because of the adverse effects (which can be worse than COVID) and long term effects. Which is very understandable, but not many people see it that way.
 

Unveiled Artist

Veteran Member
Right. We look at those who filled hospitals and made the stress for workers that much higher to a degree they had to quit.

They left because of pressure to get the vaccine not because of normal hospital stress. Where there other vaccines medical professionals had to take without being forced to do so? Without that good precedent, its really not about hospital work stress. I'm also highly sure it's not the change in policy either.
 

viole

Ontological Naturalist
Premium Member
That is a good question... I just spoke to someone in the school system and their response was not about the vaccination but about the dictatorial position of being forced. The issue, "what will they force me to do and say on the next go-around?"
If you smoke in school, you will also probably be forced out. Would that be dictatorial?
I would say it should always be the case when the health of others might be affected.

Ciao

- viole
 

Wildswanderer

Veteran Member
Well insurance companies do that by charging people with unhealthy diet and exercise habits more in premiums. So these private companies do penalize poor judgment.

But your comment that suggests the pandemic isn't all that serious is typical disinformation from right wing media. Is that what has influenced your dismissive attitude about the pandemic?

You seem to be implying that certain governments and businesses are imposing mandates for vaccination as if they are doing it for political reasons. That is the opposite. Covid is real, the USA is seeing massive increases in infection rates and deaths, and this happening at a time when kids are going back to school could open the door to even more spread, more disrupted lives, more pressure on hospitals, more deaths, more impact on the economy. I wonder what conservatives really believe in these days, it doesn't seem to be pro-life or pro-America. Perhaps you can explain why you don't think Covid is a public health risk.
Quit putting words in my mouth. And I never had an insurance company ask how much exercise I get or what I eat.
Whenever the government says: "You have to do this for your own good, and we are not giving you a choice." well, you no longer live in a free society. Get the vaccine, don't get the vaccine, whatever appeals to you. But don't tell me I have to get it.
 

Heyo

Veteran Member
If you are a nurse and you are coughing, have a fever or even have the sense off taste gone, you automatically stay home because you don't want to spread disease. It is their nature.
I assume that all who have that level of care are already vaccinated, twice.
 

Kenny

Face to face with my Father
Premium Member
If you smoke in school, you will also probably be forced out. Would that be dictatorial?
I would say it should always be the case when the health of others might be affected.

Ciao

- viole
Im not sure that qualifies. You can't smoke while on the airplane. Smoking--It is limited, not banned.
 
Top