Nature’s great book is written in mathematics.

[cladking]

" God could make a stone so large they themselves can't move it "
Isn't it a rhetoric of the "religion-none" people, please? Right?

Regards

You quoted a third a sentence!!!! Only complete sentences have any meaning at all to parse.


"Neither nature nor God could make a stone so large they themselves can't move it but they sure as hell could if they wanted to."


I'm suggesting everyone is wrong.

I'm sorry but I just tried to make a little joke by responding at all. It was not my intent to insult anyone or to promote any belief over another. I still maintain Mother Nature does not know English so can not obey man's laws. I'm out of this exchange.

 

[paarsurrey]

It's a very big perhaps.

Frankly I don't believe in laws of nature or laws of God. Nature or God do what they want to do and it's never predictable. Science and religion are crutches because people want to have all the answers despite not even knowing the questions. Neither nature nor God could make a stone so large they themselves can't move it but they sure as hell could if they wanted to.

" Nature or God do what they want to do "

When did nature acquire consciousness to do what it wants to do, please? Right?
Isn't it neither possible according to Religion nor according to Science, please? Right?
Anybody please

Regards

 

[Polymath257]

World Environment Day: From fractals to Fibonacci, 5 things to show math is an integral part of nature

Meh. The fact that the universe can be described using language does not mean that language is an integral part of nature or that the great book of the universe is written in human language.

Math is *one* expression of human language. But there are many aspects of the universe that seem to difficult or impossible to describe using math. The details of turbulence, for example.

Most of the math used here is related to some sort of optimization. And we developed many aspects of math to talk about such optimization problems.

This said, there is a curious aspect that things mathematicians make up for their own amusement often turn out to be useful for others in modeling the universe. But, and this is relevant for the discussion, a great deal of math never finds such application.

 

[cladking]

When did nature acquire consciousness to do what it wants to do, please?

It's a figure of speech but what do I know?

Maybe mother nature stays up half the night writing new laws for cosmologists to put numbers to.

 

[syo]

I hate math. Mathematicians are obsessed with proof.

 

[Aupmanyav]

Meh.

That was a newspaper article and not a research paper.
Chaos, randomness is a part of universe.
Thank. Got to the Wiki article on Turbulence.

 

[Polymath257]

That was a newspaper article and not a research paper.
Chaos, randomness is a part of universe.
Thank. Got to the Wiki article on Turbulence.

From that article:

"A complete description of turbulence is one of the unsolved problems in physics."

Yes, chaos and randomness are both parts of the universe (they are different things). But a good mathematical description of turbulent flow is not known. We can do some approximations, most of which are mediocre at best.

 

[paarsurrey]

It's a figure of speech but what do I know?

Maybe mother nature stays up half the night writing new laws for cosmologists to put numbers to.

Isn't it an accusation on Nature that it has consciousness and can do anything it wants to, while it cannot, please? Right?
Nature never claimed it and it never gave any reasons to that effect, please? Right?

Regards

 

[paarsurrey]

Isn't it an accusation on Nature that it has consciousness and can do anything it wants to, while it cannot, please? Right?
Nature never claimed it and it never gave any reasons to that effect, please? Right?

So nature has never claimed of consciousness and it is "Religion-None" people who claim for it on its behalf, and of course unauthorized, one gets to know, please. Right?

Isn't it like the Hellenist-Pauline-Christians claim godhead for (Jesus) Yeshua that Yeshua never claimed, one could say, please?
Both are accusations, the former against nature, and the later against Yeshua, please. Right?

Regards

 

[cladking]

So nature has never claimed of consciousness and it is "Religion-None" people who claim for it on its behalf, and of course unauthorized, one gets to know, please. Right?

Isn't it like the Hellenist-Pauline-Christians claim godhead for (Jesus) Yeshua that Yeshua never claimed, one could say, please?
Both are accusations, the former against nature, and the later against Yeshua, please. Right?

Regards

I don't understand all of your post but just to be clear I do not believe nature is conscious. I believe all life is individual and every individual is conscious. If God exist (S)He is probably conscious and may or may not have other attributes of life. I simply don't know and don't know how to solve the answer.

Nature (reality) operates on an unknown number of apparently very simple logical patterns but is expressed in infinitely complex ways. Whenever I say nature wants to do something this is a mere anthropomorphization and is not meant literally. Frankly, if nature did behave or experience at all it would likely have the consciousness like an animal and not like a human. We are the odd man out. Just as I don't know the "mind" of God, neither do I know the "mind" of nature. I merely know nature and God have virtual autonomy at all times. The former is short hand for observable reality and the latter is a possible cause of that reality.

 

[paarsurrey]

I don't understand all of your post but just to be clear I do not believe nature is conscious. I believe all life is individual and every individual is conscious. If God exist (S)He is probably conscious and may or may not have other attributes of life. I simply don't know and don't know how to solve the answer.

Nature (reality) operates on an unknown number of apparently very simple logical patterns but is expressed in infinitely complex ways. Whenever I say nature wants to do something this is a mere anthropomorphization and is not meant literally. Frankly, if nature did behave or experience at all it would likely have the consciousness like an animal and not like a human. We are the odd man out. Just as I don't know the "mind" of God, neither do I know the "mind" of nature. I merely know nature and God have virtual autonomy at all times. The former is short hand for observable reality and the latter is a possible cause of that reality.

" If God exist (S)He is probably conscious and may or may not have other attributes of life."

Not so difficult to understand, please, all good peculiarities that one can imagine that are positive and exist , are attributes of that All-Conscious being, collectively named as G-D; and all negative belong to Satan and or the Devil (for easy understanding), one gets to know, please. Right?

Regards
_____________
7:181وَلِلّٰہِ الۡاَسۡمَآءُ الۡحُسۡنٰی فَادۡعُوۡہُ بِہَا ۪ وَذَرُوا الَّذِیۡنَ یُلۡحِدُوۡنَ فِیۡۤ اَسۡمَآئِہٖ ؕ سَیُجۡزَوۡنَ مَا کَانُوۡا یَعۡمَلُوۡنَ ﴿۱۸۱﴾
English - Sher Ali
And to Allah alone belong all perfect attributes. So call on Him by these. And leave alone those who deviate from the right way with respect to His attributes. They shall be repaid for what they do.
Holy Quran: Read, Listen and Search

 

[cladking]

" If God exist (S)He is probably conscious and may or may not have other attributes of life."

Not so difficult to understand, please, all good peculiarities that one can imagine that are positive and exist , are attributes of that All-Conscious being, collectively named as G-D; and all negative belong to Satan and or the Devil (for easy understanding), one gets to know, please. Right?

I've heard it suggested that every consciousness is a part of something larger. It's an interesting concept and I wouldn't dismiss it but I see no mechanism for a man or an acorn to be a part of such a larger context unless we assume we were created by a consciousness. Ironically I do believe all life is "created" by consciousness but I see no reason to exclude the possibility that each are separate and distinct.

I believe good things and bad things are on a continuum for every individual. The devil is in the details. All things are impossibly complex. The odds against everything make the concept of "infinity" look like a bakers dozen. Only man could believe he understands.

 

[paarsurrey]

" If God exist (S)He is probably conscious and may or may not have other attributes of life."

Not so difficult to understand, please, all good peculiarities that one can imagine that are positive and exist , are attributes of that All-Conscious being, collectively named as G-D; and all negative belong to Satan and or the Devil (for easy understanding), one gets to know, please. Right?
_____________
7:181وَلِلّٰہِ الۡاَسۡمَآءُ الۡحُسۡنٰی فَادۡعُوۡہُ بِہَا ۪ وَذَرُوا الَّذِیۡنَ یُلۡحِدُوۡنَ فِیۡۤ اَسۡمَآئِہٖ ؕ سَیُجۡزَوۡنَ مَا کَانُوۡا یَعۡمَلُوۡنَ ﴿۱۸۱﴾
English - Sher Ali
And to Allah alone belong all perfect attributes. So call on Him by these. And leave alone those who deviate from the right way with respect to His attributes. They shall be repaid for what they do.
Holy Quran: Read, Listen and Search

To add further, please.
One of the attributes of All-Conscious being is that He converses with the human beings and claims as such and gives gist of good reasons in this connection, therefore, from just a hypothetical concept it provides certainty to one, one may say, please. Right?

Regards
_____________
42:24 ذٰلِکَ الَّذِیۡ یُبَشِّرُ اللّٰہُ عِبَادَہُ الَّذِیۡنَ اٰمَنُوۡا وَعَمِلُوا الصّٰلِحٰتِ ؕ قُلۡ لَّاۤ اَسۡـَٔلُکُمۡ عَلَیۡہِ اَجۡرًا اِلَّا الۡمَوَدَّۃَ فِی الۡقُرۡبٰی ؕ وَمَنۡ یَّقۡتَرِفۡ حَسَنَۃً نَّزِدۡ لَہٗ فِیۡہَا حُسۡنًا ؕ اِنَّ اللّٰہَ غَفُوۡرٌ شَکُوۡرٌ ﴿۲۴﴾
English - Sher Ali
This it is whereof Allah gives the glad tidings to His servants who believe and do good works. Say: ‘I ask of you no reward for it, except that I am inviting you to God because of love of kinship.’ And whoso earns a good deed, We give him increase of good therein. Surely, Allah is Most Forgiving, Most Appreciating.
Holy Quran: Read, Listen and Search

 

[cladking]

To add further, please.
One of the attributes of All-Conscious being is that He converses with the human beings and claims as such and gives gist of good reasons in this connection, therefore, from just a hypothetical concept it provides certainty to one, one may say, please. Right?

Regards
_____________
42:24 ذٰلِکَ الَّذِیۡ یُبَشِّرُ اللّٰہُ عِبَادَہُ الَّذِیۡنَ اٰمَنُوۡا وَعَمِلُوا الصّٰلِحٰتِ ؕ قُلۡ لَّاۤ اَسۡـَٔلُکُمۡ عَلَیۡہِ اَجۡرًا اِلَّا الۡمَوَدَّۃَ فِی الۡقُرۡبٰی ؕ وَمَنۡ یَّقۡتَرِفۡ حَسَنَۃً نَّزِدۡ لَہٗ فِیۡہَا حُسۡنًا ؕ اِنَّ اللّٰہَ غَفُوۡرٌ شَکُوۡرٌ ﴿۲۴﴾
English - Sher Ali
This it is whereof Allah gives the glad tidings to His servants who believe and do good works. Say: ‘I ask of you no reward for it, except that I am inviting you to God because of love of kinship.’ And whoso earns a good deed, We give him increase of good therein. Surely, Allah is Most Forgiving, Most Appreciating.
Holy Quran: Read, Listen and Search

I'm way over my head here and just don't know.

Just as all reality resonates so too does truth. Most of us can identify "truth" in some things some times even if it's only math. I believe in truth but at the same time I believe that we should remember even the firmest truths are dependent on definitions and perspectives. Finding truth might be even more important than finding the formatting for reality which I don't believe is mathematical.

 

[paarsurrey]

I'm way over my head here and just don't know.

Just as all reality resonates so too does truth. Most of us can identify "truth" in some things some times even if it's only math. I believe in truth but at the same time I believe that we should remember even the firmest truths are dependent on definitions and perspectives. Finding truth might be even more important than finding the formatting for reality which I don't believe is mathematical.

" reality which I don't believe is mathematical."

I agree with one what I have colored in magenta.
Mathematics is a human tool to get to know only an aspect of the reality for sure, it transpires, please.

Regards